1951 Bowman - Mickey Mantle - Is it real? [Archive]

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03-11-2004, 04:10 PM

Posted By: BradDoes anyone know of any 1951 Bowmans where the last line on the BACK of the card has the words 'Inc.' in capital letters?. i.e. 1951 Bowman Gum, INC., Phila, Pa. I am trying to determine if this card is real. Thanks!!<img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1079050212.JPG">

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03-11-2004, 05:24 PM

Posted By: Brian Weisner<img src="http://www.network54.com/Realm/tmp/1079054689.JPG">

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03-11-2004, 05:27 PM

Posted By: RobertI have not seen any with all capital letters. If that was the one on ebay my opinion is it is a reprint. I am sure of it 100%. It is a real reprint. But lets see what others here say. Rob

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03-11-2004, 05:30 PM

Posted By: BradThanks for the info. I haven't seen any 1951 Bowman's with all capital letters either but just wanted to make sure.

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03-11-2004, 06:18 PM

Posted By: Anonymousanyone else have any comments??

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03-11-2004, 06:54 PM

Posted By: petecldFake. Even with your bad scan I can see by the letter quality of everything except for the coypright line is at least second generation print quality. Copyright line is sharper and a different font style. DEFINITELY fake.

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03-11-2004, 07:07 PM

Posted By: Bradthanks so much for all the info i will avoid the card.

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03-11-2004, 08:11 PM

Posted By: CyclebackOne thing to notice with the in question Mantle is the whiteness around the edges. The genuine 51 Bowmans were printed on grey cardstock-- meaning the cardboard Bowman used was grey all the way through (If you ripped one open, it would be grey in the middle). If you turn a genuine 51 Bowman Mantle on its side, the edge will be be grey. The bright whiteness in the first image is not natural for the issue. This quality by itself suggests that someone printed a picture of the grey Bowman back onto white paper or white cardstock. The unnatural whiteness test can be applied to all cards that are known to have been printed on grey or dark colored cardboard. The appearance of unnnaturally white edges can quickly identify many counterfeits online.

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03-11-2004, 11:26 PM

Posted By: CyclebackI add that one of the key places to look for unnatural whiteness in an online image is in the areas of wear. Counterfeiters of 1952 Topps Mantles or 51 Bowman Mantles or such will commonly rough up the card-- clip a corner, bend or ding a corner or edge-- and this is where the bright whiteness will often appear. For example, a dinged corner on a counterfeit might appear as a little white spot .... Just rememeber that a 1951 Bowman Willie Mays Rookie Card is like a hunk of baker's chocolate. No matter how you cut it, scratch it or bite into it, the edge will always be dark.

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03-12-2004, 06:33 AM

Posted By: RobertI think this is the one we are talking about. Rob  <A href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2791764050&category=60 479"><a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2791764050&category=60 479</A" target=_new>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2791764050&category=60 479</A</a>>

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03-12-2004, 07:48 AM

Posted By: petecldSure is the one we are talking about. No question about it now. It's fake.

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03-12-2004, 08:33 AM

Posted By: leonin the last ebay url just put up....in the description the guys says he is selling them as reprints AND someone still paid $1400 for it.....where's that guy that said something about a sucker being born?

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03-12-2004, 11:33 AM

Posted By: CyclebackRule #1 with eBay auctions. If the seller says the expensive and rare Ty Cobb or Mickey Mantle is a reprint or "is selling as a reprint," take him at his word.

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03-12-2004, 12:00 PM

Posted By: AdamLooks like the buyer was clued in - the item was relisted with a note about non-payers.

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03-12-2004, 12:28 PM

Posted By: RobertAmazing isn't it this time it is a private auction. Rob

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03-12-2004, 12:58 PM

Posted By: petecldThey always are.

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03-12-2004, 01:59 PM

Posted By: CyclebackAlso be wary of eBay sellers who's deductions and reasoning are nonsensical. Paraphrasing of this seller's logic and deductions include: "I am calling this card a reprint because it's very old." "I'm calling this card a reprint because it is not graded." "A 1969 Topps football card is close to 50+ years old." An auction description is not supposed to read like Alice in Wonderland. * * As it may not be obvious to all (especially the bidders!), I point out that this seller is intentionally using circuitous language and double speak and charged phrases so that some bidder reads it and thinks "Hey, this Mantle looks pretty good. This seller is a total rube and doesn't even realize what he has." .... I can promise you that there is a rube involved in this transaction if the card sells, and it isn't the seller.

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03-12-2004, 03:23 PM

Posted By: BradDoes anyone recommend any guide that helps detect these kind of forgeries?

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03-12-2004, 05:17 PM

Posted By: PeterWThomasCopyright line has INC in caps real cards have inc in lower case .

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03-12-2004, 07:36 PM

Posted By: RobertHi Brad you can get the book called SportCard Counterfeit Detector from Sports Collectors Digest. ISBN number is 0-87341-284-2. Doesn't have everything but it is not bad.  Rob

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04-07-2004, 12:41 AM

Posted By: TerriMy user ID is mtcomm but I do not have any cards listed there as of now. I am trying to figure out what to do with them. We have 2 sons (young - they are 7 months and 2 1/2 years) so may just keep some or all of them for the boys when they grow up. I noticed there were several duplicate cards too. All I really want to know is maybe where a beginner should start. If I take them to a dealer how will I know I am getting a fair price? If I decide to list them what is a fair price to expect? If I decide to put them away for my boys which ones should I keep? Which ones are worthless? I really would appreciate the help!

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04-07-2004, 12:47 AM

Posted By: Bill CornellStart by posting scans of the card, please.

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04-07-2004, 01:56 AM

Posted By: HankronTerri, the standard price guides are: Beckett Almanac of Baseball Cards and Collectables and Standard Catalog of Baseball Cards (Krause Publications) Both are available at amazon.com and barnes and nobles. You can pick either. If you were to post some pictures of a variety of cards, we could tell if the cards are valuable or penny sort of stuff.