INSANITY BIDDING [Archive] - Net54baseball.com Forums

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09-04-2003, 07:50 AM

Posted By: Jay Miller  Not to cast any aspersions on other Old Judge collectors, but does anyone know who the moron is who is bidding over $500 on a rebacked John Smith Old Judge card. John Smith has one valuable pose, a portrait with the title "Phenominal Smith". Otherwise, his cards are common and he was certainly not a star. This is a $100 card not a $500 card. John Billingsley did a good job hypeing the card in the write-up but this bidder took the bait, and then some. This case is similar to Healy-Washington. He has a very valuable portrait, but his other cards are the most common of commons.

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09-04-2003, 08:04 AM

Posted By: halleygatorThank you for at least having the decency to phrase your question in an anonymous manner ... rather than just coming out and asking: "Hal Lewis, are you out there bidding like an idiot again?" <img src="/images/happy.gif" height=14 width=14> Relax ... I am not interested in John, whether he was Phenomenal or not.

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09-04-2003, 08:14 AM

Posted By: runscottJay, no one else is going to say this, so I will. John is well-trusted in the ebay community, so if his comments are believable, his customers will buy it hook-line-and-sinker. We saw this when he was selling the trimmed Lipset cards two years ago, and I was defending his descriptions, giving him the benefit of the doubt, because I know him and he's a nice guy. Jay, if you told me a card was rare, I would believe you. John reads this board, as does his buddy Brooks, so I would have expected him to ammend his description before taking this poor sap for an extra $300 or so. He didn't - maybe he went on vacation for a while. More and more dealers are taking advantage of buyer trust to squeeze out some extra profit - this is a shame.

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09-04-2003, 08:25 AM

Posted By: runscottOn the other hand, I would not hesitate to buy from John - he is one of the friendliest sellers I have dealt with, and his customer service is A+, giving immediate refunds for undescribed writing on cards, damage, etc.

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09-04-2003, 08:47 AM

Posted By: John(z28jd)The only thing i could think of besides the description possibly misleading people is that Baltimore collectors seem willing to spend alot more on old judges which ive seen on ebay in the past,but Smith also has 5 different Baltimore variations in the set so based on that alone it cant be THAT tough to warrant a $500 bid.....I think its more of a case of uneducated bidders.It looks like 2 people really want it and they were both willing to pay alot for it. I'll mention a possible similar scenario.A well-known T206 collector wanted to make sure he won a card that was probably a 35-40$ card.He bid way more than it was worth,and ended up paying $140. I was thinking of bidding on the Smith because i want one,its the nickname,im not gonna lie,he wasnt a good player(ala Chicken Wolf who i have a card of,but probably wouldnt have spent so much on if he used his real name,William Van Winkle).Once the Smith reached $150+ i gave up that idea of bidding.I couldve bought a GAI2 Smith,same pose but with the A's for $150 earlier this year

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09-04-2003, 08:55 AM

Posted By: runscottThe two high bidders might have been well aware that the card isn't rare, but they each had huge egos and open bottles.

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09-04-2003, 09:01 AM

Posted By: Jay MillerThe funny thing is the high bidder seems to be a dealer. He has over 3000 feedback and almost all of his feedbacks are sales.

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09-04-2003, 09:02 AM

Posted By: Jay MillerSorry--feedback was only 2500+

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09-04-2003, 09:02 AM

Posted By: halleygatorGiven that it is re-backed... I don't even think this is a $100 card. Crazy.

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09-04-2003, 10:19 AM

Posted By: warshawlawThese ungraded examples from a non-professional seller sold for $3,650 on ebay. described as "1)THIS CARD PICTURES AND READS "WELSH,P.,NEW YORKS COPYRIGHT BY GOODWIN & CO. 1889 OLD JUDGE CIGARETTE FACTORY GOODWIN & CO. NEW YORK" 2)THISCARD PICTURES AND READS "DELAHANTY,2DB PHILA.,COPYRIGHT 1889 OLD JUDGE CIGARETTE FACTORY GOODWIN & CO. NEW YORK" 3)THIS CARD PICTURES AND READS "TURNER,C.F.MINNEAPOLIS COPYRIGHT 1889 OLD JUDGE CIGARETTE FACTORY GOODWIN & CO. NEW YORK" with bleary but passable pictures showing what look like vg-ex to ex cards. comments?? <a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3239495184" target=_new>http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3239495184</a>

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09-04-2003, 10:57 AM

Posted By: Jay MillerI couldn't see any obvious problems with the cards but given the sellers no return policy and the fact that the bidding level was close to full value I saw no reason to bid. Much of the bidding was done by a "1" feedback and a "0" feedback bidder so that makes you wonder a little too.

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09-04-2003, 01:58 PM

Posted By: Trevor HockingI am amazed that this thing is even over $100 but $500 WOW!!! I think John is a very happy camper right now. I think there might be a few bidders not reading the descriptions completely. Look at what his other re-backed cards are bringing. As far as the lot of three N172's that sold for $3,650, I was one of the under bidders on this lot. Adam did you happen to see who the players are? The Delahanty will probably grade an 80 or better the Welch does have a black mark over his name but looks 70 to 80 material to me. I have bought N172's from this seller before and they where beautiful! They are original!!! The seller is good. Hey Adam are you going to be at the Hollywood Park show this weekend? If so I will be setting up again. I hope to see you there. Trevor

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09-04-2003, 03:54 PM

Posted By: warshawlawBut I smelled shill s**t all over that auction so I stayed out of it.

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09-04-2003, 03:56 PM

Posted By: warshawlawI remembered that the Hebrew word for diarrhea is "shillshool". Sorta appropriate.

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09-04-2003, 05:33 PM

Posted By: Trevor HockingI would have to agree about the shill bidding. It did look a little suspicious. I had offered the guy $3,000 to end the auction early but he passed and then amazingly I was out bid by a 0 feedbacker very shortly after the auction had opened. But there was some serious bidding after the $3,100 mark. I still believe that the cards went for a fair market price. I'm sure the auction was won by a very knowledgeable dealer, who reads this board. I'm also sure they will make a VERY nice profit off these cards, especial after they are submitted for grading. See you at the show. I just got an e-mail saying Mastro will be there. I guess they must have been in town or something. I think this is the first time they have hit the west coast. It should be fun to finally meet Kevin Struss in person.

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09-04-2003, 07:42 PM

Posted By: julie..how would he know?