Help with Victoria Bees RPPC

[Jobu]

Can anyone here provide any info about this postcard? The team in the grey is the Victoria Bees, but that is all I have been able to find out about it.

Thanks in advance.

[Kawika]

Hi Bryan-
Victoria baseball ephemera seems to be very scarce. I live here and I've looked but have rarely seen anything aside from 1911 Obaks. The local team played as the Bees for five seasons (1911-1915) in the Northwestern League. Portland had a team in the league in the 1911 through 1914 seasons. They're the only team whose city name started with a "P" which you can see on some of the uniforms so my assumption is that they are the the players in pinstripes. Might they be the home team? Their uniforms are white; the Bees uniforms are grey. The Bees, to the best of my knowledge, played in those years at Royal Athletic Park just north of downtown Victoria. [I'm not 100% certain. A few years ago I was researching the team via the Victoria Times-Colonist archives (hi, Bruce) and learned that for a period of time there was a leasing problem and they may have played elsewhere]. In any event I have never seen an image of any sort of the ballpark from those days so can't compare the fence or line of houses with anything. The park is still extant (hello again, Bruce) but in a different configuration today as a multi-use facility. I have attached a Google Map view to give you an idea of what is there now. Some of the faces look to be identifiable but no one is popping out at me. It would be interesting to see what some of the billboards say if you're able to crank up the resolution. I am also wondering what exactly the guy with the satchel is holding in his hand. Have also included a team postcard of the 1914 Bees (that's rookie Highpockets Kelly standing tall in the back row if you're keeping score) and a small snapshot of a Vic player with a bee on his sleeve - don't know the year. Maybe Mr Eskenazi can weigh in with some expertise. He knows a thing or two about west coast deadball.

PS Thanks and a tip of the Kawika hat for the heads-up on the Metro Studios set. I was able to win it and another dragon has been slain.

https://photos.imageevent.com/kawika_o_ka_pakipika/sportscardsetc/mischidden/miscellany2/huge/Screen%20Shot%202019-12-02%20at%2011.54.20%20AM.png

https://photos.imageevent.com/kawika_o_ka_pakipika/sportscardsetc/mischidden/miscellany2/huge/Victoria%20Bees%201914%20Highpockets%20Kelly.jpg

https://photos.imageevent.com/kawika_o_ka_pakipika/sportscardsetc/mischidden/miscellany2/large/Vic%20Bees%20player.jpg

https://photos.imageevent.com/kawika_o_ka_pakipika/sportscardsetc/mischidden/miscellany2/websize/DMcD%20Victoria%20Obak2.jpg

[Jobu]

Thanks David!! (And congrats on winning the Metro Studios set!)

I have a better image here:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/132359235@N05/49119737756/in/album-72157672452361010/

I will rescan it tonight and post a better picture.

[Kawika]

I was mistaken in seeing a "P" on the uniform. Looks more like a "V" which would make it Vancouver. Their ballpark in those days was Athletic Park for which there are more images to be found. The attached colorized photo, although from 1935, shows a similarity with the row of houses. My semi-educated conclusion then is that the photo was taken in Vancouver. As for the year I think the telltale would be the bee on the sleeve. The 1911 Obaks don't show it and the 1914 team postcard doesn't show it either. That leaves 1912, '13 and '15. I'd start with 1915 and try to photo match faces. Some of the mugs are pretty distinctive but I'm still not able to ID anyone. The tall fellow on the right could be Kelly for all I know although I haven't found anything to substantiate that except for he is big and lanky, and I want it to be him. Maybe one of the N54 eagle eyes will be able to help.

[Jobu]

Here is a bigger scan of the area with the identifiable stuff.

I uploaded a copy to Flickr too as that has a zoom feature:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/132359235@N05/49161133147/in/album-72157672452361010/

It looks like the guy is holding a wire garbage can filled with paper. Maybe they were taking collections for someone? Or there was a raffle or contest?

[seattlerainiers]

Hi fellas,

Definitely Victoria and Vancouver players, and I peg it as 1913. I believe that the pinstriped Vancouver uniform with that style V is from that year only. Below is an RPPC image of pitcher Bob Ingersoll in this uniform. It indicates 1913 in period ink on the reverse, and Ingersoll only played for Vancouver in 1913.

I'd agree with Dave that it is likely the Vancouver ballpark, but will dig through other RPPCs and other images to nail it down. I'll also be able to ID some of the players as I spend more time with it, but can immediately recognize Charles Brooks (back row, 4th from right with his head tilted). He was with Victoria 1912-1914. Also, Chief Chouneau, front row, 2nd from left. He was only with Vancouver in 1913.

Also below are a few RPPCs of 1913 Opening Day action at the Victoria ballpark, and one of Northwestern League legend and 1913 Victoria manager Mike Lynch, infamous for "passing" on a young Walter Johnson in Tacoma in 1906.

Dave, I think that your team RPPC is 1915, not 1914, and ol' Highpockets is not present in Bryan's PC. His pro debut was in 1914.

Fun stuff!

[Jobu]

Awesome, info! Thank you for helping to pin this down. I love turning unknowns into knowns. :)

[Kawika]

Fun stuff!
Indeed!

Neat to see anything related to Victoria baseball. The current Royal Athletic Park is oddly configured to accommodate baseball and other sports like soccer and rugby. I have no idea how the grandstands and ballfield were sited back in the day, whether they were in the same location or perhaps more to the east toward Cook Street. Very few old houses left around the immediate perimeter now and the few I found look nothing like the ones shown in your photos. In the case of Bryan's postcard there is one house with an arrow-like shape that also appears in the colorized 1935 photo. Along with the V's on the uniforms it's what made me think it was Vancouver. As for the year of my postcard you are correct. Saw in my notes that it was in fact 1915, just slipped my brain. Old age will do that to a person. A perusal of the 1913 Van and Vic teams at bbref.com indicates a number of Obak subjects. Don't have the time myself to try to make photo matches but hope you are able to ID some of the players.

Cheers -

DMcD