View Full Version : PSA 6 with Stain on Front
ejharrington
11-10-2019, 01:54 PM
Looking for some thoughts on the grade of this card, which is nice but has a noticeable stain on the front (and back). Do the grading standards allow for such a high grade for a card with a stain like this?
https://sports.ha.com/itm/baseball-cards/singles-pre-1930-/1909-t204-ramly-jake-stahl-psa-ex-mt-6-pop-three-one-higher/a/50020-50293.s?ic2=mybidspage-lotlinks-12202013&tab=MyBids-101116#
https://sports.ha.com/itm/baseball-cards/singles-pre-1930-/1909-t204-ramly-jake-stahl-psa-ex-mt-6-pop-three-one-higher/a/50020-50293.s?ic2=mybidspage-lotlinks-12202013&tab=MyBids-101116#
swarmee
11-10-2019, 02:03 PM
Very unlikely to get higher than a PSA 4 at this point. Could be soaking/bleaching damage that wasn't visible when the card was graded over 10 years ago.
https://www.psacard.com/resources/gradingstandards/#cards
Their standards for VG 3 read "Slight stain may show on obverse and wax staining on reverse may be more prominent."
ValKehl
11-10-2019, 02:03 PM
Looking for some thoughts on the grade of this card, which is nice but has a noticeable stain on the front (and back). Do the grading standards allow for such a high grade for a card with a stain like this?
I would say yes, but WITH a a "ST" qualifier on the flip.
boneheadandrube
11-10-2019, 02:29 PM
Very unlikely to get higher than a PSA 4 at this point. Could be soaking/bleaching damage that wasn't visible when the card was graded over 10 years ago.
https://www.psacard.com/resources/gradingstandards/#cards
Their standards for VG 3 read "Slight stain may show on obverse and wax staining on reverse may be more prominent."
If you soak a Ramly it would likely fall apart into its two laminated halves and the embossing would probably go flat also. Try owning and handling some of these rarer card issues to understand them better before guessing how they might have been altered. Its not a Topps or a Leaf.
swarmee
11-10-2019, 04:10 PM
Good point; I've seen Ramlys before in person and do realize they are multiple layers, it just slipped my mind at the time.
The last two statements above are false.
The number of Ramly cards that are not solid stock is very, very small, (I have seen one small group in nearly 30 years of collecting and a few singles here and there). The embossing will not soak out nor press out fully, it will still be present even if placed under pressure. The half-tone will get very fragile and can easily be damaged while wet, creating very small spots of paper loss, with just the lightest touch of fingers or other contact.
The offered card exhibits some of the above characteristics.
boneheadandrube
11-10-2019, 04:53 PM
The last two statements above are false.
The number of Ramly cards that are not solid stock is very, very small, (I have seen one small group in nearly 30 years of collecting and a few singles here and there). The embossing will not soak out nor press out fully, it will still be present even if placed under pressure. The half-tone will get very fragile and can easily be damaged while wet, creating very small spots of paper loss, with just the lightest touch of fingers or other contact.
The offered card exhibits some of the above characteristics.
Well, there ya go. I Remember some "blank back cards" that were determined to be soaked in two from here on the board many years ago. I assumed they would all separate.
One or two here and there, but very unusual to find the two part ones, in fact quite difficult. That being said, I have talked to some old time collectors 1960's/70's that did think all Ramly's were two parts, apparently due to the scarcity of all Ramly's and pre-internet era, these were the perhaps the only ones they had encountered.
Having handled a few thousand of them over the years, I have one small original group that are in fact two-pieces and pretty easy to see, as the front and back are markedly mis-aligned on most of them. Oddly they were removed from an album, apparently with very little direct water, as they have back stains and paper pulls where they were glued in with the old brown horse glue.
I have soaked a few solid stock Ramly's to remove excess paper and find that they get extremely fragile on the front, just a few touches and the top layer will rub. They are printed directly onto to the paper stock and then coated with a clear coat of some type. Most T-cards are printed on clay coated paper and you can soak and handle them without any fear of disturbing the front image, the back which is just paper stock will however suffer the same surface damage if you get too aggressive with a q-tip or such when trying to get stubborn paper to release.
swarmee
11-10-2019, 05:47 PM
Thanks, Sc0tt. Glad to know I wasn't too far off.
h2oya311
11-11-2019, 08:18 AM
If you soak a Ramly it would likely fall apart into its two laminated halves and the embossing would probably go flat also. Try owning and handling some of these rarer card issues to understand them better before guessing how they might have been altered. Its not a Topps or a Leaf.
Haha! Don’t you feel like a bonehead now? Maybe a little more hobby RESPECT would go a long way...
With respect to the stain on the first card, I once got a Ramly in the cigarette pack it presumably came in and both the card and pack had water type stains just about in that same place. I think Bill C ended up with it. That was a beautiful card. And I think even with the little stain they gave it a 6 (it was a long time ago so not positive.) Good info to know about soaking Ramlys. I don't think I have tried any.