PDA

View Full Version : Candiman Auctions Explained


Pages : [1] 2

CandimanAuctions
03-05-2018, 03:49 PM
Hey guys,

My name is Daniel and along with my brother Justin, we are the owners of Candiman Auctions. We are a new auction house and our first auction ends this Saturday, March 10th. I was informed last night that our company was being discussed on the forum. I spoke at length with Leon Luckey on the phone earlier today and asked for his advice. His advice was to start this thread.

Based on posts on this forum and other phone calls & emails I have received, I understand that people have concerns that we are associated with the eBay seller "Battlefield". We want to be upfront and honest with everyone about our association with them. We are related to the owners as I'm sure everyone on here already suspected based on our last name. I want to start out by saying that we completely disavow eBay seller "Battlefield". We do not in any way, shape, or form support their actions on eBay over the past several years. We find their actions despicable and we advised them to shut down their business because their reputation in the collecting community has been completely destroyed and no true collector would ever want to deal with them. They have consigned their remaining inventory to us and shut down their eBay operation. We were happy to take on their remaining inventory and get them out of the collecting industry for good. They actually have a lot of high quality items and if they had done things honestly, I believe they could have been successful. Not everything in our auction is their inventory. We have about 25 total consignors for this auction.

Regarding the items in our auction that we have identified as "Authentic" in the title and descriptions, we believe those cards have been altered and would likely only receive a grade of "Authentic" if submitted to any of the major grading companies. I know Battlefield was notorious for purchasing trimmed or altered cards and breaking them out of the holders and then reselling them as high grade examples on eBay. There is no excuse for that kind of activity and participating in that kind of activity is shameful. We have made every effort to identify any and all cards in our auction that appear to be trimmed or altered. If for some reason a card we haven't identified as altered is submitted for grading and comes back as such we would encourage the buyer to return the card and a full refund would be given.

We want to completely disassociate ourselves and our company from the terrible name that Battlefield has made for themselves in the collecting community. We are NOT like them. We have worked hard to provide high quality images and descriptions of all of the items in our auction. I hope you guys give us a chance and I appreciate anyone who takes the time to read this post. If you have any questions or concerns please contact me through PM or post to this thread.

Thanks,

Daniel & Justin

Aquarian Sports Cards
03-05-2018, 04:16 PM
https://tse2.mm.bing.net/th?id=OIP.isUwk0E5MmAnSYTg3efSWwAAAA&pid=15.1&P=0&w=300&h=300

T205 GB
03-05-2018, 04:29 PM
No link to the auction?

iowadoc77
03-05-2018, 04:29 PM
I tend to agree with Scott's post considering where this thread may go, but the proof will be in the customer service if and when an item is deemed to be altered. Best of luck to you guys. I will be following your auctions

Rookiemonster
03-05-2018, 04:31 PM
Candiman ......... candiman .............. candiman ..........


Aaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhghhh. :eek:

Battlefield is the things nightmares are made of.

Leon
03-05-2018, 04:39 PM
Hi Daniel
I did tell you that I thought the right thing to do was come explain the situation. And if you remember I think I also told you that it wouldn't be a walk in the park with this group. So a couple quick questions as you go down the path of vetting....

Have you ever sold anything to your mother and father, ever done any deals with them, or vice versa BESIDES the lots in your current auction? Also, through a search I found something and am curious what your middle name is? Good luck...

Aquarian Sports Cards
03-05-2018, 04:48 PM
The only point of my post was that this should be a long thread before it's done. Not a comment as to my opinions of the auction.

bobbyw8469
03-05-2018, 05:09 PM
I wish them luck. For the most part, Battlefield DID have nice stuff...and it was all original...no reprints. I think the problem arose when they attempted to deceive. Cracking out "A" cards and selling them as unaltered. Photoshopping. You get the point. The ironic thing is, if they would have just been honest, they probably would have been successful anyway. Without needing to cheat people.

cardsnstuff
03-05-2018, 05:09 PM
If for some reason a card we haven't identified as altered is submitted for grading and comes back as such we would encourage the buyer to return the card and a full refund would be given.


Thanks,

Daniel & Justin

So if this is true, I think you need to change your auction terms and descriptions, otherwise it's just fluff.

CandimanAuctions
03-05-2018, 05:26 PM
Hi Daniel
I did tell you that I thought the right thing to do was come explain the situation. And if you remember I think I also told you that it wouldn't be a walk in the park with this group. So a couple quick questions as you go down the path of vetting....

Have you ever sold anything to your mother and father, ever done any deals with them, or vice versa BESIDES the lots in your current auction? Also, through a search I found something and am curious what your middle name is? Good luck...

Hi Leon,

I appreciate your advice and willingness to speak with me on the phone earlier today. I didn't expect it to be a walk in the park and I am completely fine with that. I have nothing to hide. My middle name is Brian. I am a collector and I have sold them some items a few times in the past (on occasions where I would buy bulk or shoebox collection lots and pulled the cards I wanted and sold them the rest). I have never had any dealings with the operation of their business.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-05-2018, 05:26 PM
Battlefield is the things nightmares are made of.

Hi Dustin,

I absolutely agree with you on this. They destroyed their reputation by doing things the wrong way. I am glad we are able to play a role in ending their business for good.

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-05-2018, 05:26 PM
So if this is true, I think you need to change your auction terms and descriptions, otherwise it's just fluff.

Hi Tony,

I agree with you. That should be in the auction rules and I will be adding that today.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-05-2018, 05:27 PM
No link to the auction?

Hi Andrew,

The link to the auction is candimanauctions.com/catalog.aspx

Thanks,

Daniel

SMPEP
03-05-2018, 05:37 PM
Hi,

My question is ... if you're so disassociated with Battlefield ... then how did you get my name to send me an email today advertising your services?

I have never dealt with you. But I did buy from Battlefield on Ebay (and my purchase was okay actually). They would have had my contact information. So the only way I can conceive of that you got my information is from someone you have disassociated yourself from.

Are you now claiming they gave you their entire inventory and all of their sales contact information?

Thanks,
Patrick

bnorth
03-05-2018, 05:45 PM
If anyone is going to bid on anything in this auction please PM me. There is a small lot of beaters I would like to throw a low ball bid at. For one small lot of cheap beaters I am not going to register with them. Thanks

Batpig
03-05-2018, 06:01 PM
I want to believe you, but it's hard when you say you're disassociating yourself from them, and then auction their remaining inventory. I think that's the opposite of disassociating.

In addition, there's a lot of lots that have no business not being graded, and are not identified as authentic (unless I'm missing it). For example, the NM Clemente rookie and NM+ 1956 Mantle. Unless you know them to be suspect, why not get them graded prior to auctioning?

- Jeff

egbeachley
03-05-2018, 06:10 PM
why not get them graded prior to auctioning?


Maybe pay for 5-day Express service in order to get them back mid-month?

CandimanAuctions
03-05-2018, 06:50 PM
Hi,

My question is ... if you're so disassociated with Battlefield ... then how did you get my name to send me an email today advertising your services?

Thanks,
Patrick

Hi Patrick,

Since this is our first auction we asked our consignors if they would provide us an email list of people they have dealt with in the past that they thought might be interested in the auction. Your email address must have been on the list that either they gave us or one of our other consignors. It is not easy starting an auction site and we have tried to utilize every option to reach as many people that would possibly be interested in bidding in the auction. Our company operates nothing like they did. We are here to do things the right way. The only way to do that is to be open and honest like Leon advised me to do with this thread. I hope I am able to answer everyone's questions and ease their concerns. We love this hobby and really want to be a part of it.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-05-2018, 06:51 PM
I want to believe you, but it's hard when you say you're disassociating yourself from them, and then auction their remaining inventory. I think that's the opposite of disassociating.

In addition, there's a lot of lots that have no business not being graded, and are not identified as authentic (unless I'm missing it). For example, the NM Clemente rookie and NM+ 1956 Mantle. Unless you know them to be suspect, why not get them graded prior to auctioning?

- Jeff

Hi Jeff,

We want our company disassociated with them. We operate nothing like they did. We want to be upfront and honest about every item we sell. If we believe a card has been altered it will be posted in the title and description. That is the only way to be successful in this industry. As cardsnstuff (Tony) mentioned earlier in the thread, I have updated the Auction Rules on the website indicating that if any card we haven't identified as altered is submitted for grading and comes back as such we will encourage the buyer to return the card for a full refund. There are many cards in the auction that should absolutely be sent in for grading and should receive good grades in my opinion.

Thanks,

Daniel

conor912
03-05-2018, 07:20 PM
Just my 2 cents, but I would never ever buy a raw card from an auction peppered with cards from Battlefield's inventory. Auction industry standard is now, for better or worse, to have all major individual cards slabbed. The fact that you have chosen not to do so, coupled with your unfortunate hobby lineage and inventory source, is, if not telling, then baffling at very least.

mantlefan
03-05-2018, 07:45 PM
I'm having difficulty with your description "....has the appearance of a NM-MT card with no creases and excellent centering but measures a bit smaller than the standard size and would likely only receive a grade of “Authentic” if submitted to any of the major grading companies." Many of your high end cards have this notation.

Are you saying that these cards are trimmed? If so, why not come out and just say that?

Generally PSA will not slab a trimmed card:

"PSA will not grade cards that bear evidence of trimming, re-coloring, restoration, or any other forms of tampering, or are of questionable authenticity."

Peter_Spaeth
03-05-2018, 07:56 PM
I'm having difficulty with your description "....has the appearance of a NM-MT card with no creases and excellent centering but measures a bit smaller than the standard size and would likely only receive a grade of “Authentic” if submitted to any of the major grading companies." Many of your high end cards have this notation.

Are you saying that these cards are trimmed? If so, why not come out and just say that?

Generally PSA will not slab a trimmed card:

"PSA will not grade cards that bear evidence of trimming, re-coloring, restoration, or any other forms of tampering, or are of questionable authenticity."

They could just be small. Back in the day people were always telling me their small cards were "natural shorts.":D

ALR-bishop
03-05-2018, 08:34 PM
Probably cards from smallish Presentation Sets :)

ZiggerZagger
03-05-2018, 08:42 PM
Brothers Battles--

Full credit for coming on to state your case. I think this is understandably fascinating to a lot of us on Net54, as Battlefield/War_Eagle_Vintage had become a bit of a punchline on here and elsewhere.

Although I won't consider bidding in the auction, I'm interested to see how the first round goes for folks on here who will hopefully report back their experiences.

Couple of points here, and that's it:

--Ungraded cards of the caliber you have up for auction are very unusual to see these days. We're well past the advent of TPG's, and grading is now the standard way for collectors to protect themselves.
I think it's jarring for most of us to see this caliber of raw cards at auction, and understandably would make us suspicious even a neutral situation.

--However, we are not in a neutral situation. You not only have a good amount of Battlefield's inventory in your auction, but they are your *Family*.
You couldn't have disavowed Battlefield's actions any more strongly but, in the end, those are words. And they are words from an interested party who presumably has tens of thousands of dollars on the line with a current auction running.
And the counterpoint to that is that your direct Family members operated Battlefield for years, the most notorious vintage card operation on eBay.

I genuinely am not trying to be personal, but why persist in the vintage sports collectibles arena with this sort of history??

--Although there were certainly issues with Battlefield's product being trimmed, the bigger issue was the truly impressive manipulation and photoshopping of cards.
Ultimately a buyer ended up with a lesser card than expected, and then had to weigh the trouble of returning once in-hand, or simply just take the path of least resistance and keep it.
Would you be willing to guarantee that no scans have been enhanced or altered in any of your listings, now and in future? That and a return policy for ungradeable cards via TPG's would go a long way.

--Finally, just out of curiosity, with both of your experience in the collecting world, are there maybe some Dealers/Buyers you've had great associations with in the past? Feel free to name-drop.
It's a small community, and for folks who are deeply involved it's hard not to meet others in that circle and make an impression, one way or the other.

If you are truly trying to correct the wrongs of your Family, then I think that's extraordinarily commendable and I will wish you luck.
If this is something less honorable, then it won't escape criticism. Misbehavior with an Auction House doesn't offer the eBay remediation route, just the regular old Court system.

And again, I honestly wish you a lot of luck if things are 100% as you say. I try to be an optimist wherever possible, and hope for the good sense to stop just short of being a fool. :D

cardsnstuff
03-05-2018, 08:53 PM
Brothers Battles--

Would you be willing to guarantee that no scans have been enhanced or altered in any of your listings, now and in future? That and a return policy for ungradeable cards via TPG's would go a long way.

.

:D

Agreed. Because the problem is their reputation was among the worst in the industry.

I saw you amended your returns as suggested. I think that was a good start.

horzverti
03-05-2018, 09:04 PM
Thoughts:

-you started this thread to defend yourself only AFTER a Net54 user posted proof that your last name matches Battlefield’s name. That wasn’t being “upfront and honest.” That was you being reactive. Being “upfront and honest” would have been proactive, but it is too late for that.

-your parents taught you love the hobby. Did they also teach you how to deceive potential buyers?

-what about War Eagle on eBay? You didn’t mention that War Eagle was most likely the same seller as Battlefield. It seems that Candiman is your third attempt to con under a similar format. What will your next name be?....just so we know.

-you wrote, “we advised them to shut down their business.” I read that Battlefield was booted from eBay and that they didn’t voluntarily close their business. Are saying that they weren’t booted from eBay for fraud?

-it seems like you have a huge inventory of altered/trimmed cards to sell. Since you have so much $ and time invested in this ongoing con, you have no choice but to sell these cards to recoup $ = newly created auction house.

-it is interesting that you repeatedly referred to your parents as “Battlefield”, “them” or “they.” I encourage readers here to re-read the original post and substitute those words with the phrase “our parents.” I feel that you are just trying distract us into forgetting that you are “related” to con artists. I’d like to remind potential buyers here that they may be taking on too much of a risk of fraud at its worst and just a headache at its best.

-I feel that there may not be a Daniel or Justin at all. Just the same people trying to deceive collectors by using a slightly different format. Maybe Daniel/Justin were the original culprits all along. If so, then why would they start being honest now?

-I was never ripped off by Battlefield, but they tried their best to try to rip me off. I bought some cards which turned out to be heavily photoshopped. I contacted Battlefield twice through eBay and didn’t receive a response. I returned the cards through eBay and eBay had to force them to refund $. A few weeks later the same cards were sold again using the same photos. Deception, attempted fraud, zero customer service, then more deception.

If you become an honest seller(s), then I wish you luck.

Beastmode
03-05-2018, 09:17 PM
I'm a little late to the party on the "battlefield" threads, but help me out here.

Is Battlefield your last name? Or is that an alias?

Most importantly, what is the full names of ebay users battlefield0516, so I run away from them in the real world?

cardsnstuff
03-05-2018, 09:26 PM
Brothers Battle:

If you are sincere about starting over and undoing so many wrongs; which, if true, I think is admirable; how about accepting paypal? I saw on your on rules page that specifically you do not; Paypal has built in buyer protections, at least until you have demonstrated good faith. That way us buyers have protection, in case "family" history repeats itself.

bbcardzman
03-05-2018, 09:35 PM
Can't believe these guys are starting an auction house and using their real names. Smart business move!! I agree with many on this forum. Carol tried to scam me a few years ago also and only thanks to paypal and not eBay was I able to get my money back. I, for one, don't buy into any of this crap. If I was a betting man, my money would be on - different forum - same old crap. Can't wait to see all the feedback on this auction, if anyone here would even participate. Although now that they are not protected by eBay, guess they had better be on the up-and-up. Mail fraud is a serious offense.

Peter_Spaeth
03-05-2018, 09:39 PM
Even if you believed it, who would go on a public forum and call their parents' actions "despicable"? The same parents who are supplying them with most of their material. This whole thing seems odd to me.

ullmandds
03-05-2018, 09:49 PM
I was duped by battlefield...with deceptive scans and inaccurate descriptions. I DID get my money back and after that steared far clear of them. With their history...in my opinion your endeavor is doomed and i will not be doing business with you. Id consider changing the name too..sounds like a drugdealer!

Beastmode
03-05-2018, 09:50 PM
Even if you believed it, who would go on a public forum and call their parents' actions "despicable"? The same parents who are supplying them with most of their material. This whole thing seems odd to me.

Exactly. Looks like his name is Daniel Battles. He's had Candiman, Inc. since 2011. I'm guessing Candiman Auctions is rolled into his vast conglomerate, similar to Berkshire:). Smoke and mirrors. This whole story is hard to believe, IMO. If you're buying anything in this auction, you're begging to be screwed.

111gecko
03-05-2018, 09:55 PM
Just a quick question. Has anyone confirmed it was actually the parents and not the brothers running the EBay account?

DJR
03-05-2018, 10:18 PM
Mason Cole Battles - Are you related?

http://www.dothaneagle.com/news/crime_court/two-charged-with-attempted-murder-at-henry-co-campground/article_df22be2e-f013-11e3-9f70-0017a43b2370.html

Jason
03-05-2018, 10:20 PM
My parents would have to do way more than be bad eBay sellers for me to "disavow" them. Best of luck with the auction house guys.

BeanTown
03-05-2018, 10:56 PM
Mason Cole Battles - Are you related?

http://www.dothaneagle.com/news/crime_court/two-charged-with-attempted-murder-at-henry-co-campground/article_df22be2e-f013-11e3-9f70-0017a43b2370.html

Or is Peter Nash involved in any way with past or present auctions?

clydepepper
03-05-2018, 11:14 PM
Our alert membership kept me from ever considering doing business with 'battlefield' and I thank them for that.

It is extremely difficult to regain someone's trust and rehab a bad reputation.

Personally, I believe there are enough other choices out there to make anything connected (then or now)with to battlefield a bona fide non-starter.

frankbmd
03-06-2018, 05:30 AM
307899


Lot #191, although not specified in the title, appears to be 15% off.:D

toledo_mudhen
03-06-2018, 06:14 AM
That Clemente is absolutely a killer looking card.. almost cant stand it. If that thing comes back in a 6 slab (or better) the price goes thru the roof. You should really take that one down and send it in on fast turn around (probably going to need SGC for that as PSA cant get an order out to save their ass). Having said all of that - I am willing to take a chance on some smaller dollar items and take you at face value for now. If this is the same ole - same ole it wont take long to be outted. Best of luck!

iwantitiwinit
03-06-2018, 06:24 AM
Just my 2 cents, but I would never ever buy a raw card from an auction peppered with cards from Battlefield's inventory. Auction industry standard is now, for better or worse, to have all major individual cards slabbed. The fact that you have chosen not to do so, coupled with your unfortunate hobby lineage and inventory source, is, if not telling, then baffling at very least.

Exactly.

bigfish
03-06-2018, 08:36 AM
I want to believe you, but it's hard when you say you're disassociating yourself from them, and then auction their remaining inventory. I think that's the opposite of disassociating.

In addition, there's a lot of lots that have no business not being graded, and are not identified as authentic (unless I'm missing it). For example, the NM Clemente rookie and NM+ 1956 Mantle. Unless you know them to be suspect, why not get them graded prior to auctioning?

- Jeff


I am not buying candiman is here to be robinhood. I think battlefield and candiman are the same entity.

Basket of deplorables


Toby Petersen

Peter_Spaeth
03-06-2018, 08:42 AM
Anyone up for taking a chance on a NM MT Red Heart Mantle?
http://candimanauctions.com/Mickey_Mantle_1954_Red_Heart__18___New_York_Yankee-LOT38.aspx

How about a NM 52T Jackie?
http://candimanauctions.com/Jackie_Robinson_1952_Topps__312___Hi_____Brooklyn_-LOT29.aspx

NM/MT Brooks rookie?
http://candimanauctions.com/Brooks_Robinson_1957_Topps__328___RC___Mid_____Bal-LOT57.aspx

bigfish
03-06-2018, 08:48 AM
If you look at them for more than 30 seconds you get seasick and need a fisherman’s friend.

Sigh 😔

bobbyw8469
03-06-2018, 09:02 AM
I'll admit, I'm one of the worst at detecting trimmed cards. On some of these, it's almost like they are too good to be true. Unfortunately, due to battlefields history of duping people in their quest for the almighty dollar, I am hesitant to bid aggressively on any of these lots, knowing full well the likelihood they will come back "AUTHENTIC" only is strong. Honestly, I would be surprised if any of these go higher than "A" prices. If people submit these for grading, and are rewarded, I predict you will be very successful in this business. If they submit for grading, and are disappointed, then I predict this is a one and done.

Leon
03-06-2018, 09:05 AM
Anyone up for taking a chance on a NM MT Red Heart Mantle?
http://candimanauctions.com/Mickey_Mantle_1954_Red_Heart__18___New_York_Yankee-LOT38.aspx

How about a NM 52T Jackie?
http://candimanauctions.com/Jackie_Robinson_1952_Topps__312___Hi_____Brooklyn_-LOT29.aspx

NM/MT Brooks rookie?
http://candimanauctions.com/Brooks_Robinson_1957_Topps__328___RC___Mid_____Bal-LOT57.aspx

To me those look like three fraudulent listings. So much for making a new start.

Batpig
03-06-2018, 09:06 AM
I feel sorry for the other 15 people who consigned for this auction.

ALR-bishop
03-06-2018, 09:10 AM
Just another walk in Leon's Park 54

RichardSimon
03-06-2018, 09:11 AM
To me those look like three fraudulent listings. So much for making a new start.

Obviously, I am not a card guy as most of you know.
But I do read some threads on this side from time to time.
"This card appears to be" from the OP's description on his website is all the wording I think anyone would need to know where he is coming from.
To offer those cards, non-graded, in a "major" internet auction is certainly telling.
Why do these people even come on Net54 and try to defend themselves? This board is way too smart to let anyone come on here and try to fool us.

bigfish
03-06-2018, 09:18 AM
I feel sorry for the other 15 people who consigned for this auction.

The other 15 consignors are all family members I would guess.

🤷🏻*♂️

frankbmd
03-06-2018, 09:24 AM
Originally the March 2018 premier auction was scheduled to close on March 3rd.

I guess they felt it would be more profitable to move it back to March 10th and hype it here on Net54 this week.;)

aconte
03-06-2018, 09:24 AM
Peter,

I thought you were looking for a nice Red Heart Mantle. There you go!
:)

jfkheat
03-06-2018, 09:38 AM
Someone mention that this auction house has been around since 2011. I can't find anything about past auctions. Have they ever sold ball cards? They have 300 followers on Twitter. I think it is great that this is posted here on Net54 but what percent of their bidders will ever know about their relationship with battlefield? The images in the auction still look to be photoshopped. 50 year old and older cards with no blemishes are very tough to find. There is a reason that the cards are not graded.
James

Peter_Spaeth
03-06-2018, 09:44 AM
So we have an auction of mostly ungraded cards, from Battlefield's inventory, by family members. Why would anyone be concerned? To the OP: if you really want to distance yourself from Battlefield, get these high end looking cards graded first. That would serve you much better than talk.

Peter_Spaeth
03-06-2018, 10:06 AM
Someone mention that this auction house has been around since 2011. I can't find anything about past auctions. Have they ever sold ball cards? They have 300 followers on Twitter. I think it is great that this is posted here on Net54 but what percent of their bidders will ever know about their relationship with battlefield? The images in the auction still look to be photoshopped. 50 year old and older cards with no blemishes are very tough to find. There is a reason that the cards are not graded.
James

Maybe Battlefield's scanner came with the inventory?

pokerplyr80
03-06-2018, 10:11 AM
Worf summed up my thoughts on this thread and the OP pretty well.

horzverti
03-06-2018, 10:11 AM
307899


Lot #191, although not specified in the title, appears to be 15% off.:D

Frank - Very funny! You're the best. :)

PiratesWS1979
03-06-2018, 10:45 AM
how many of these are for sale again? I know the Leaf Kiner listed on Candiman "sold" with War_Eagle TWICE. Why, because I bid the first time which went for twice my bid.

Also, how come you cant supersize the auction pic like EVERY one auction site?

https://www.ebay.com/sch/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ipg=&_from=&rmvSB=true&LH_Complete=1&LH_Sold=1&_ssn=war_eagle_vintage&_sop=16

Leon
03-06-2018, 10:50 AM
Edited - those are old auctions. I thought they were current ones at first.

how many of these are for sale again? I know the Leaf Kiner listed on Candiman "sold" with War_Eagle TWICE. Why, because I bid the first time which went for twice my bid.

Also, how come you cant supersize the auction pic like EVERY one auction site?

https://www.ebay.com/sch/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_ipg=&_from=&rmvSB=true&LH_Complete=1&LH_Sold=1&_ssn=war_eagle_vintage&_sop=16

frankbmd
03-06-2018, 10:57 AM
The answer is one.

Hmmmmmmm.............

“How many mailing addresses do battlefield, war eagle and Candiman Auctions have?”

NYYFan63
03-06-2018, 11:02 AM
So we have an auction of mostly ungraded cards, from Battlefield's inventory, by family members. Why would anyone be concerned? To the OP: if you really want to distance yourself from Battlefield, get these high end looking cards graded first. That would serve you much better than talk.



Agreed or clearly state the cards are altered.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Peter_Spaeth
03-06-2018, 11:04 AM
Agreed or clearly state the cards are altered.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

As was mentioned by someone, Battlefield's biggest issue wasn't necessarily trimmed cards, it was cards scanned to look two grades better than they were.

bobbyw8469
03-06-2018, 11:08 AM
Another big issue with them was they preyed on people's greed that they were getting high end cards, so they were bidding high end prices, for cards that would not grade numerically. If they had just been ethical about it, there are some collectors (such as myself) who don't mind an attractive "A" card. Paying an exorbitant amount of money for a card that will not ever attain the grade that it supposedly represents is just wrong.

bobbyw8469
03-06-2018, 11:09 AM
PS- I have notified them of several instances of cards in their current auction being the exact same card. They claim to have two different cards, but the scans show the exact same card. Maybe that can be corrected.

NYYFan63
03-06-2018, 11:22 AM
As was mentioned by someone, Battlefield's biggest issue wasn't necessarily trimmed cards, it was cards scanned to look two grades better than they were.



Ahh ok - good point


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sophiedog
03-06-2018, 11:33 AM
Tough Crowd

CandimanAuctions
03-06-2018, 11:55 AM
Hey guys,

There have been lots of comments on the thread since I logged in last night. Instead of trying to respond to each post individually I will just try and sum everything up into one post. I know many of you are skeptical (rightfully so) but I must reiterate that my brother and I were not the owners of the Battlefield eBay store and had nothing to do with the operation of it. That business was started when we were off at college and living our own lives. We both have accounting degrees from Auburn University. We're not ignorant people and we know that being anything less than 100% honest in this business will result in failure every single time. We started Candiman Auctions knowing that we would be associated with Battlefield and that we would have to deal with the repercussions of that. I chose to post on this forum knowing we would be attacked, insulted, mocked, and not taken seriously. Many of you have stated that we are trying to defend ourselves and start over. That's not the case. We are not here to defend the actions of our family. Quite the opposite. This is our first auction. We want to be successful and develop great relationships with people in this industry. There isn't a single person on this forum that has ever done business with my brother or myself because we are a new auction house. All we are asking for is a chance to prove you guys wrong and I believe if given that chance we will be successful in doing that.

Battlefield was known for 2 things: Purchasing cards in "A" holders and breaking them out and selling them on eBay as high grade examples and photoshopping cards with flaws to look better than they actually are. As I said in the opening post on this thread we in no way, shape, or form support their actions on eBay over the past several years. Those actions are unacceptable and anyone participating in this kind of activity is doomed to fail. People in this industry are too smart not to figure out if someone is engaging in that kind of activity. We have worked hard to post accurate descriptions and high quality images of all of the items in our auction. If a card is in Poor condition it is listed as so. If a card appears VG, VG-EX, EX, EX-MT, NM, then it is listed as so.

As I said above, all we are asking for is a chance. We're not here to defend the actions of anyone. We're not hiding who we are. Leon seemed to think that everyone on here would give us a fair shot if we were open and honest and that's what we're trying to do.

Daniel

Peter_Spaeth
03-06-2018, 12:00 PM
If I win a card you call NM-MT and it comes back a 5 or a 6, what's my recourse? And if you truly want credibility, you need to explain why you are selling so many purportedly high end and expensive cards without grading them.

CW
03-06-2018, 12:07 PM
Someone mention that this auction house has been around since 2011. I can't find anything about past auctions. Have they ever sold ball cards? They have 300 followers on Twitter. I think it is great that this is posted here on Net54 but what percent of their bidders will ever know about their relationship with battlefield? The images in the auction still look to be photoshopped. 50 year old and older cards with no blemishes are very tough to find. There is a reason that the cards are not graded.
James

I can see how it might be confusing, but the previous comment was just that Daniel owned or registered the name Candiman, Inc., not necessarily the auction house. The auction house appears to be brand new.

Exactly. Looks like his name is Daniel Battles. He's had Candiman, Inc. since 2011. I'm guessing Candiman Auctions is rolled into his vast conglomerate, similar to Berkshire:). Smoke and mirrors. This whole story is hard to believe, IMO. If you're buying anything in this auction, you're begging to be screwed.

bnorth
03-06-2018, 12:30 PM
One question for Candiman Auctions. Do you or anybody associated with the auction house or the consignors shill bid their own or any other listings? I just want a simple yes or no answer. Thank you.

Now to be clear I am not asking if it is legal or illegal in your area. It has been pointed out by a member(auction house owner) that it is perfectly legal in his area. I am asking if you are allowing it in your auctions.

BeanTown
03-06-2018, 12:31 PM
I don't understand why you don't have any card worth more than 100.00 graded. That is hurting your auction and your consignor big time with todays landscape. The first thing most people think seeing a raw high end card is ..... Whats wrong with it, and why isn't it graded?

Knowing your Mom and Dad's history, you should make sure your first auction goes off without a hitch. Most AHs offer their consignors a grading option where its done for free or at their cost.

I think you should suspend your auction, send in all your high end cards to a TPG, and then start over. You are now in the auction business where you are supposed to know your industry. Not too mention the best way to maximize your consignors investment and at the same time protect your customer the buyer. Don't act like you found a big box of cards at the local storage war auction, and then you are just selling as-is and not graded. You can't play that card, or maybe you can but it most likely wont fly on this forum.

bnorth
03-06-2018, 12:31 PM
The answer is one.

Hmmmmmmm.............

“How many mailing addresses do battlefield, war eagle and Candiman Auctions have?”

Very interesting discovery Frank that should be worth more than a $40 question.:)

botn
03-06-2018, 12:39 PM
If a card is in Poor condition it is listed as so. If a card appears VG, VG-EX, EX, EX-MT, NM, then it is listed as so.

Daniel

It is your prerogative to sell cards without them being graded. Many auction houses do but given your close ties to Battlefield when you qualify a card's condition using the term "appears", as most if not all of the auction listings do, I don't feel that gives buyers any confidence.

Further your rules state "...We do not guarantee that our grades will conform to the standards of 3rd party authenticators (TPA's). Furthermore, we are not bound by the opinions of any authenticators, grading services, or "experts"." So that would mean we have zero recourse for cards not being in the condition stated. On eBay this would allow us to make a return as was done many times with Battlefield's auctions.

From my vantage point it seems Candiman was formed simply to avoid the returns of over graded material. Please correct me if I am mistaken.

x2drich2000
03-06-2018, 01:01 PM
As a step in good faith, why don't you identify any and all lots that were consigned by any employees or relatives which would include those from Battlefield. This is not a unique option as at least one other auction house does it.

Leon
03-06-2018, 01:52 PM
I agree.
I don't think those descriptions fly. I can't imagine auctioning raw NRMT - MT cards which I know, or should reasonably know, are altered and not mentioning it. IF it isn't criminally wrong it seems it is ethically wrong.Those high end cards should be in holders even in auctions with well established records, let alone brand new ones with dubious lineage. It is not being completely honest and transparent in my opinion. Here is the entire Mantle description of the card itself. Now if they went onto say something like - "WE believe this card to be altered", then that might be more like it. BTW, I don't disagree with their description(s). They just don't go far enough.

This particular card up for auction is New York Yankees Hall of Fame legend Mickey Mantle. This card appears to be in NM-MT condition with no creases.


I don't understand why you don't have any card worth more than 100.00 graded. That is hurting your auction and your consignor big time with todays landscape. The first thing most people think seeing a raw high end card is ..... Whats wrong with it, and why isn't it graded?

Knowing your Mom and Dad's history, you should make sure your first auction goes off without a hitch. Most AHs offer their consignors a grading option where its done for free or at their cost.

I think you should suspend your auction, send in all your high end cards to a TPG, and then start over. You are now in the auction business where you are supposed to know your industry. Not too mention the best way to maximize your consignors investment and at the same time protect your customer the buyer. Don't act like you found a big box of cards at the local storage war auction, and then you are just selling as-is and not graded. You can't play that card, or maybe you can but it most likely wont fly on this forum.

Stampsfan
03-06-2018, 02:47 PM
This is shaping up to be just another horror movie we've seen before.

307956

Exhibitman
03-06-2018, 02:53 PM
https://photos.imageevent.com/exhibitman/dropins/dr%20evil.jpg
Right...

buymycards
03-06-2018, 02:59 PM
Many of the cards do not have scans of the backs. Even if I am bidding on a $10 card I want to see the back before I bid.

CandimanAuctions
03-06-2018, 03:42 PM
One question for Candiman Auctions. Do you or anybody associated with the auction house or the consignors shill bid their own or any other listings? I just want a simple yes or no answer. Thank you.

Now to be clear I am not asking if it is legal or illegal in your area. It has been pointed out by a member(auction house owner) that it is perfectly legal in his area. I am asking if you are allowing it in your auctions.

Hi Ben,

Absolutely not.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-06-2018, 03:42 PM
It is your prerogative to sell cards without them being graded. Many auction houses do but given your close ties to Battlefield when you qualify a card's condition using the term "appears", as most if not all of the auction listings do, I don't feel that gives buyers any confidence.

Further your rules state "...We do not guarantee that our grades will conform to the standards of 3rd party authenticators (TPA's). Furthermore, we are not bound by the opinions of any authenticators, grading services, or "experts"." So that would mean we have zero recourse for cards not being in the condition stated. On eBay this would allow us to make a return as was done many times with Battlefield's auctions.

From my vantage point it seems Candiman was formed simply to avoid the returns of over graded material. Please correct me if I am mistaken.

Hi Greg,

You are very mistaken. Candiman Auctions was formed because we love this hobby and enjoy buying and selling items we have collected for the better part of our lives. We are looking forward to developing long term business relationships with the great people in this community. All of our lots have high quality pictures posted and if a card has a specific flaw it has been noted in the description. Grading is subjective and no auction house can guarantee that their grades will line up exactly with a TPG. Most auction houses have this in their Auction Rules (see Goldin Auctions as an example).

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-06-2018, 03:43 PM
The answer is one.

Hmmmmmmm.............

“How many mailing addresses do battlefield, war eagle and Candiman Auctions have?”

Frank,

Candiman Auctions mailing address is NOT associated with Battlefield, War Eagle, or anyone else. I'm sure there are people on this forum who purchased items from those others who can verify this if you don't want to take my word for it.

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-06-2018, 03:43 PM
I agree.
I don't think those descriptions fly. I can't imagine auctioning raw NRMT - MT cards which I know, or should reasonably know, are altered and not mentioning it. IF it isn't criminally wrong it seems it is ethically wrong.Those high end cards should be in holders even in auctions with well established records, let alone brand new ones with dubious lineage. It is not being completely honest and transparent in my opinion. Here is the entire Mantle description of the card itself. Now if they went onto say something like - "WE believe this card to be altered", then that might be more like it. BTW, I don't disagree with their description(s). They just don't go far enough.

This particular card up for auction is New York Yankees Hall of Fame legend Mickey Mantle. This card appears to be in NM-MT condition with no creases.

Hi Leon,

What you are saying is exactly what we have done (see Lot #'s 7, 8, 26, 32, 45, 52, etc.) So if I'm reading this correctly what you are saying is that we should say that all of our ungraded cards are altered even though they measure correctly and show no signs of alteration? I'm a little confused.

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-06-2018, 03:44 PM
Many of the cards do not have scans of the backs. Even if I am bidding on a $10 card I want to see the back before I bid.

Hi Rick,

We can provide back scans for any item you are interested in. Just let me know which ones you would like to see.

Thanks,

Daniel

sycks22
03-06-2018, 04:00 PM
As expressed by multiple people it would be beneficial to grade the top 5 lots so you don't get push back when a Near Mint card comes back Vg and there's no recourse.

bnorth
03-06-2018, 04:01 PM
Hi Ben,

Absolutely not.

Thanks,

Daniel

Thank you for the answer. You do have a few low end lots that interest me so I will be signing up to bid on them.

My only other question and I do understand it is almost impossible to answer with any accuracy is. What kind of shipping fees are you going to be using, how are you going to ship lower end lots? This is big problem with some AHs and the reason I ask. Some have very reasonable shipping and some use it to make a huge profit.

My point being I don't want to win a $20-$50 lot and have to pay another $$20-$30 to ship some low end cards. Thanks

CandimanAuctions
03-06-2018, 04:41 PM
As expressed by multiple people it would be beneficial to grade the top 5 lots so you don't get push back when a Near Mint card comes back Vg and there's no recourse.

Hi Pete,

I understand that concern. We are going to place a much bigger emphasis on adding more graded cards for our next auction and work with consignors to get the more high end raw cards graded prior to the auction. With that being said, I don't see how a card that looks NM, measures correctly, has no creases, good centering, and minimal corner wear could possibly grade VG. We have posted high quality images of all lots in the auction. Those should give any potential bidders a good idea of the estimated grade. I sincerely hope that the winners of our raw cards get great deals and are rewarded with nice grades when the cards are submitted for grading. I think that will go a long way to proving that we are here for the right reasons. As I have said we are looking to develop long-term business relationships with the great people of this community.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-06-2018, 04:42 PM
Thank you for the answer. You do have a few low end lots that interest me so I will be signing up to bid on them.

My only other question and I do understand it is almost impossible to answer with any accuracy is. What kind of shipping fees are you going to be using, how are you going to ship lower end lots? This is big problem with some AHs and the reason I ask. Some have very reasonable shipping and some use it to make a huge profit.

My point being I don't want to win a $20-$50 lot and have to pay another $$20-$30 to ship some low end cards. Thanks

Hi Ben,

We will be using FedEx exclusively probably for any invoice over $250. For an invoice under $250, I don't see a problem mailing the items via USPS in order to lower the shipping costs if that is what the buyer prefers. We would never charge someone $20-$30 to ship items for a $20-$50 invoice. That would be way too much.

Thanks,

Daniel

bnorth
03-06-2018, 05:05 PM
Hi Ben,

We will be using FedEx exclusively probably for any invoice over $250. For an invoice under $250, I don't see a problem mailing the items via USPS in order to lower the shipping costs if that is what the buyer prefers. We would never charge someone $20-$30 to ship items for a $20-$50 invoice. That would be way too much.

Thanks,

Daniel

I registered and put in a bid. If I win I will post in this thread how the transaction went down.

I figure we can't hold what someones parent(s) done against them. My parents make theirs look like Mother Teresa. Not that long ago my dad broke into my house and stole a title to a car I own(ed). He had my step mom who worked in the treasurers office process the stolen forged title and then sold my car.

Batpig
03-06-2018, 05:12 PM
Hi Pete,

I understand that concern. We are going to place a much bigger emphasis on adding more graded cards for our next auction and work with consignors to get the more high end raw cards graded prior to the auction. With that being said, I don't see how a card that looks NM, measures correctly, has no creases, good centering, and minimal corner wear could possibly grade VG. We have posted high quality images of all lots in the auction. Those should give any potential bidders a good idea of the estimated grade. I sincerely hope that the winners of our raw cards get great deals and are rewarded with nice grades when the cards are submitted for grading. I think that will go a long way to proving that we are here for the right reasons. As I have said we are looking to develop long-term business relationships with the great people of this community.

Thanks,

Daniel

The problem is that altered isn't just trimming. It could be recolored, have rebuilt corners, or simply have been in a screw down that compressed the corners.

This is basically your only chance to gain credibility on this board and elsewhere, and if people here start reporting that their won NM auctions are coming back altered, you aren't going to get another chance. If you're sincere, you really need to consider either getting the cards checked by a TPG or resetting the auctions and changing the descriptions.

egbeachley
03-06-2018, 05:29 PM
I registered and put in a bid. If I win I will post in this thread how the transaction went down.

I figure we can't hold what someones parent(s) done against them. My parents make theirs look like Mother Teresa. Not that long ago my dad broke into my house and stole a title to a car I own(ed). He had my step mom who worked in the treasurers office process the stolen forged title and then sold my car.

I agree with your first sentence. But I am intrigued by your last and what happened next.

bnorth
03-06-2018, 05:37 PM
I agree with your first sentence. But I am intrigued by your last and what happened next.

TMI for the internet.:)

CandimanAuctions
03-06-2018, 05:40 PM
I registered and put in a bid. If I win I will post in this thread how the transaction went down.

I figure we can't hold what someones parent(s) done against them. My parents make theirs look like Mother Teresa. Not that long ago my dad broke into my house and stole a title to a car I own(ed). He had my step mom who worked in the treasurers office process the stolen forged title and then sold my car.

Hi Ben,

Thank you very much for registering and placing a bid. I hope you win and do post your experience with us on here.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-06-2018, 05:47 PM
The problem is that altered isn't just trimming. It could be recolored, have rebuilt corners, or simply have been in a screw down that compressed the corners.

This is basically your only chance to gain credibility on this board and elsewhere, and if people here start reporting that their won NM auctions are coming back altered, you aren't going to get another chance. If you're sincere, you really need to consider either getting the cards checked by a TPG or resetting the auctions and changing the descriptions.

Hi Jeff,

Believe me I understand this is our chance to gain credibility on this board and that is 100% our goal. We want anyone who wins items from our auction to post their experience with us on this thread. That will help us immensely. My greatest hope is that after this first auction people do share their experiences with us and others see that the cards are what we describe them to be.

Thanks,

Daniel

Peter_Spaeth
03-06-2018, 05:48 PM
a 52t Jackie in a 7 is a 7k card. if you really believed it was nm, you would grade it, or at the very least you are doing your consignor a huge disservice. imo.

jfkheat
03-06-2018, 05:53 PM
I see that you have two more auctions scheduled. Will these auctions also have cards from battlefield?

James

botn
03-06-2018, 05:57 PM
Hi Greg,

You are very mistaken. Candiman Auctions was formed because we love this hobby and enjoy buying and selling items we have collected for the better part of our lives. We are looking forward to developing long term business relationships with the great people in this community. All of our lots have high quality pictures posted and if a card has a specific flaw it has been noted in the description. Grading is subjective and no auction house can guarantee that their grades will line up exactly with a TPG. Most auction houses have this in their Auction Rules (see Goldin Auctions as an example).

Thanks,

Daniel

Thanks for the reply Daniel. I do not expect you to keep taking the time to respond to each of us who make an inquiry but I would challenge that the images you are using are high quality. They are actually pretty small making it impossible for a buyer to determine for themselves if your assessment is accurate. I must have missed the lots in which you disclose flaws. I seemed to see a great deal of your descriptions simply describing the player or the set the card came from with only one line about the card appearing to be in specific condition.

I did state that all houses sell raw cards but not all houses are selling cards that belong to family members who defrauded and misrepresented the product they were selling.

So you are affirming that you would not accept a return on a card that came back from PSA or SGC as EX that you described as appearing NM-MT?

Thanks,
Greg

sycks22
03-06-2018, 06:47 PM
Hi Pete,

I understand that concern. We are going to place a much bigger emphasis on adding more graded cards for our next auction and work with consignors to get the more high end raw cards graded prior to the auction. With that being said, I don't see how a card that looks NM, measures correctly, has no creases, good centering, and minimal corner wear could possibly grade VG. We have posted high quality images of all lots in the auction. Those should give any potential bidders a good idea of the estimated grade. I sincerely hope that the winners of our raw cards get great deals and are rewarded with nice grades when the cards are submitted for grading. I think that will go a long way to proving that we are here for the right reasons. As I have said we are looking to develop long-term business relationships with the great people of this community.

Thanks,

Daniel


I had an auction house describe a card at NM+ and when I got it graded it came back a SGC 35 (2.5). A simple grade would've saved me over a grand

pokerplyr80
03-06-2018, 06:57 PM
Hi Pete,

I understand that concern. We are going to place a much bigger emphasis on adding more graded cards for our next auction and work with consignors to get the more high end raw cards graded prior to the auction. With that being said, I don't see how a card that looks NM, measures correctly, has no creases, good centering, and minimal corner wear could possibly grade VG. We have posted high quality images of all lots in the auction. Those should give any potential bidders a good idea of the estimated grade. I sincerely hope that the winners of our raw cards get great deals and are rewarded with nice grades when the cards are submitted for grading. I think that will go a long way to proving that we are here for the right reasons. As I have said we are looking to develop long-term business relationships with the great people of this community.

Thanks,

Daniel

Since it appears most of your auction is made up of cards from battlefield expecting a grade of VG on a card you describe as NM seems pretty optimistic to me. I would expect them all to come back altered. I am surprised any knowledgeable net54 members would even consider bidding in this auction. I will be sitting this one out.

It seems much more likely to me that this auction is nothing more than a battlefield auction moved off of eBay. I am pleasantly surprised to see eBay finally did the right thing and got rid of you guys.

BoyWonder089
03-06-2018, 07:07 PM
Hi Daniel and Justin,

First off, good luck with the auction. I hope everything you have said up to this point is honest and filled with nothing but good intentions.

This is merely a suggestion, but might you two be willing to post a video introducing yourselves and the auction site a bit more? Maybe provide some close up highlights of the auction?

I think many people realize how easily photos can be shopped, so maybe a video might add some additional trust?

conor912
03-06-2018, 07:09 PM
Daniel,

If I could make a suggestion...I think it would go a long way with earning the trust of the board by offering to give full refunds, plus the shipping, insurance and grading fees, for any of your cards that come back altered. My guess is that you already know that most of them are, otherwise you would have graded them yourself, but if you're serious about gaining trust here then you're going to need to figure out a way to assure people they won't be out one cent. And, to be honest, I'm not even sure that would work, but I think you're gonna need a hail Mary here.

Peter_Spaeth
03-06-2018, 07:17 PM
with all the smooth talk and reassurances and self-promoting narrative, I am still waiting for the explanation why you would choose not to grade cards that obviously would be worth substantially more if in fact they are in the condition you claim.

jfkheat
03-06-2018, 07:30 PM
I agree with Peter. Like I said earlier, there is a reason that the cards are not graded.
James

botn
03-06-2018, 07:31 PM
Daniel,

If I could make a suggestion...I think it would go a long way with earning the trust of the board by offering to give full refunds, plus the shipping, insurance and grading fees, for any of your cards that come back altered. My guess is that you already know that most of them are, otherwise you would have graded them yourself, but if you're serious about gaining trust here then you're going to need to figure out a way to assure people they won't be out one cent. And, to be honest, I'm not even sure that would work, but I think you're gonna need a hail Mary here.

Their rules state they will refund if the card comes back altered but will not refund if their NM appearing card comes back as EX. What would go a long way is to put up large clear scans of the cards so that buyers might have a chance to assess the card themselves.

frankbmd
03-06-2018, 07:35 PM
The answer is one.

Hmmmmmmm.............

“How many mailing addresses do battlefield, war eagle and Candiman Auctions have?”

Frank,

Candiman Auctions mailing address is NOT associated with Battlefield, War Eagle, or anyone else. I'm sure there are people on this forum who purchased items from those others who can verify this if you don't want to take my word for it.

Daniel


I hate Jeopardy.:eek:

Peter_Spaeth
03-06-2018, 07:38 PM
I agree with Peter. Like I said earlier, there is a reason that the cards are not graded.
James

it's the elephant in the room for me, particularly with the squishy talk about being unable to guarantee tpg grades etc.

if you're a hobby icon who everyone knows and trusts that's one thing

as was pointed out, when you are relatives of one of the hobby's biggest fraudsters and are selling their inventory, quite another

conor912
03-06-2018, 08:07 PM
Their rules state they will refund if the card comes back altered but will not refund if their NM appearing card comes back as EX. What would go a long way is to put up large clear scans of the cards so that buyers might have a chance to assess the card themselves.

My point was that that's not far enough. But I agree about the scans.

ZiggerZagger
03-06-2018, 08:09 PM
Battles Brothers--

Again, thanks for getting involved in the discussion directly. Your persistence honestly deserves credit.
You're getting your points across well, and you seem intelligent and thoughtful.
It's hard to win with a losing hand, but you're playing it well.

A lot has been said already, so I'll just make two quick points that are the sore thumbs for me:

Credibility: You've said that you want to gain credibility as an Auction House and develop long-lasting business relationships with folks in the hobby.
A necessary goal for an AH, but in today's world there is absolutely no way to be viewed as a credible AH with high end-appearing cards that are Ungraded.
This is not 1995, honestly, and the world has turned on that one a long time ago. Reputable AH's who receive important raw cards send them to a TPG for grading prior to auction, usually at their own expense.
It's standard of practice, and you are a brand new AH that is outside of this Standard at the moment.

Relationships: Similar to above, you've clearly stated that you want to build long-term relationships in the hobby.
But Vintage collecting is not a vast, anonymous empire. Everyone -- absolutely everyone -- who is in this hobby for more than a minute establishes relationships with fellow collectors and sellers.
I understand that you have been exposed to cards through your family, but is there no-one in the hobby world that could vouch for your intentions? This beggars belief, honestly.
To me, this is the most concerning and unbelievable piece of the puzzle, and it speaks to your intentions in the hobby as temporary, not permanent.

The established Auction Houses grew organically from long-standing relationships in the hobby. They were not started up just because someone had a supply of cards they wanted to move and the ability to use SimpleAuctionSite.com.

Many of us invest 4, 5, and even 6-figure sums on Vintage cards. We need to feel like that buying experience is safe and secure, not like I'm buying something out of the back of some guy's van in a Wal-Mart parking lot.

Anyway, if in 10 years Candiman Auctions is a reputable and established Auction House, then it will be a hard-fought and incredible victory for your stated convictions. I'll be in line to give you a big high-five if that's the case.

mantlefan
03-06-2018, 08:32 PM
I try to have an open mind on this sort of thing, but I prefer specificity over generality. Let's look at Lot #26...1953 Bowman Color Mantle.

You state: "This particular card up for auction is New York Yankees Hall of Fame legend Mickey Mantle. This card has the appearance of a NM-MT condition card but does measure smaller than the standard size and would likely only receive a grade of “Authentic” if submitted to any of the major grading companies."

Let's say I win this lot for $1000 (incl. BP) and I send it to PSA. I use the 10 day shipping option ($50), send it insured Priority Mail ($14.99) and pay PSA $18 to return it. The card comes back from PSA No Grade - N-1 Evidence of Trimming.

You would refund me $.......?

OriolesHOF
03-06-2018, 08:46 PM
Thoughts:

-you started this thread to defend yourself only AFTER a Net54 user posted proof that your last name matches Battlefield’s name. That wasn’t being “upfront and honest.” That was you being reactive. Being “upfront and honest” would have been proactive, but it is too late for that.

-your parents taught you love the hobby. Did they also teach you how to deceive potential buyers?

-what about War Eagle on eBay? You didn’t mention that War Eagle was most likely the same seller as Battlefield. It seems that Candiman is your third attempt to con under a similar format. What will your next name be?....just so we know.

-you wrote, “we advised them to shut down their business.” I read that Battlefield was booted from eBay and that they didn’t voluntarily close their business. Are saying that they weren’t booted from eBay for fraud?

-it seems like you have a huge inventory of altered/trimmed cards to sell. Since you have so much $ and time invested in this ongoing con, you have no choice but to sell these cards to recoup $ = newly created auction house.

-it is interesting that you repeatedly referred to your parents as “Battlefield”, “them” or “they.” I encourage readers here to re-read the original post and substitute those words with the phrase “our parents.” I feel that you are just trying distract us into forgetting that you are “related” to con artists. I’d like to remind potential buyers here that they may be taking on too much of a risk of fraud at its worst and just a headache at its best.

-I feel that there may not be a Daniel or Justin at all. Just the same people trying to deceive collectors by using a slightly different format. Maybe Daniel/Justin were the original culprits all along. If so, then why would they start being honest now?

-I was never ripped off by Battlefield, but they tried their best to try to rip me off. I bought some cards which turned out to be heavily photoshopped. I contacted Battlefield twice through eBay and didn’t receive a response. I returned the cards through eBay and eBay had to force them to refund $. A few weeks later the same cards were sold again using the same photos. Deception, attempted fraud, zero customer service, then more deception.

If you become an honest seller(s), then I wish you luck.

Curt, I believe your assessment of the situation to be spot on. Master manipulation by the Ebay first family of photoshopped, altered cards in an attempt to sell NET54 members a bag of dog $hit in hopes they'll be happy they bought it.

Peter_Spaeth
03-06-2018, 08:57 PM
yep, buy a raw high end expensive card, that we didn't submit for grading and won't say why, from battlefield's relatives, from battlefield's inventory, with a smallish scan, no recourse if you or a tpg disagree with our grade, we have no hobby experience or reputation, but trust us

sorry hope I am wrong but that's where I am despite the pitch

irv
03-06-2018, 09:05 PM
with all the smooth talk and reassurances and self-promoting narrative, I am still waiting for the explanation why you would choose not to grade cards that obviously would be worth substantially more if in fact they are in the condition you claim.

I'm beginning to think these guys like "dodgeball" more than they like Baseball. :rolleyes:


Guys, (Candiman) I think it's too late now anyways as you lost anything you had with me by dodging this question, repeatedly.

pokerplyr80
03-06-2018, 09:17 PM
yep, buy a raw high end expensive card, that we didn't submit for grading and won't say why, from battlefield's relatives, from battlefield's inventory, with a smallish scan, no recourse if you or a tpg disagree with our grade, we have no hobby experience or reputation, but trust us

sorry hope I am wrong but that's where I am despite the pitch

That about sums it up. I'm having a hard time understanding why everyone doesn't see this. I get that less educates buyers will bid thinking they can buy, grade, and flip these cards for a profit. Guys on this site should know better. Caveat emptor.

egbeachley
03-06-2018, 09:21 PM
If I was a consignor for a group of $100 - $500 cards, I would not want to spend roughly $25 per card for grading which I probably wouldn't recoup with higher sales. And that's on top of waiting another 4 months to get paid since that's how long it is taking to get back cards from PSA.

BeanTown
03-06-2018, 09:26 PM
Why would any consignor give you cards when you tell potential buyers good luck, and I hope you win the card at a cheap price?

There are many old skool collections out there that have not been slabbed yet. So, why would any consignor give a new auction house some nice cards and not worry about grading or trying to maximize their investment????

111gecko
03-06-2018, 09:34 PM
Didn't look, but I assume the buyer premium is +/- 20%.
Auction houses are in this to make money:
Sell a questionable 52T Jackie raw for $1,500 and make a $300 fee.
Sell a NM graded 52T Jackie for $7,000 and make a $1,400 fee.
Why grade them???..maybe they are in it for the love of the hobby only?:rolleyes:

cardsnstuff
03-06-2018, 09:37 PM
Daniel,

If I could make a suggestion...I think it would go a long way with earning the trust of the board by offering to give full refunds, plus the shipping, insurance and grading fees, for any of your cards that come back altered. My guess is that you already know that most of them are, otherwise you would have graded them yourself, but if you're serious about gaining trust here then you're going to need to figure out a way to assure people they won't be out one cent. And, to be honest, I'm not even sure that would work, but I think you're gonna need a hail Mary here.

I said simply..................WHY NOT ACCEPT PAYPAL; than there is buyer protections.

egbeachley
03-06-2018, 09:37 PM
I said $100 - $500 cards which seems to be the range of most cards in this auction. Not the exceptional few.

slidekellyslide
03-06-2018, 09:44 PM
Wow...just wow. What are two young guys with accounting degrees doing getting into the baseball card business when their parents are known as two of the most notorious scammers in hobby history?

Starting off by selling what appears to be a NM-M Mantle in RAW form???

If they were honestly trying to prove they are not chips off the old block then all of those high end looking cards would be encapsulated or described as altered.

No way is this business on the up and up.

Leon
03-06-2018, 10:07 PM
Hi Leon,

What you are saying is exactly what we have done (see Lot #'s 7, 8, 26, 32, 45, 52, etc.) So if I'm reading this correctly what you are saying is that we should say that all of our ungraded cards are altered even though they measure correctly and show no signs of alteration? I'm a little confused.

Daniel

Hi Daniel
Peter Sp.aeth (hi Peter) has better explained my thoughts than I apparently could. If you read his last several posts you will know how I feel too. I told you it wasn't going to be easy. :) Good luck.
.

Peter_Spaeth
03-06-2018, 10:31 PM
If I was a consignor for a group of $100 - $500 cards, I would not want to spend roughly $25 per card for grading which I probably wouldn't recoup with higher sales. And that's on top of waiting another 4 months to get paid since that's how long it is taking to get back cards from PSA.

And yet countless dealers find it profitable to grade their cards in this range.

PiratesWS1979
03-06-2018, 10:46 PM
Personally I think this is all worthless banter. They REALLY don’t care what a small percentage of the hobby says or does
about their new auction site. They knew coming on here that very few if any would ever participate in the auction.

Heck why would they care, battlefield made all their money hoping a few people would not notice the Photoshop. If the
buyer did and left a negative, just relist it along with 100 $5 cards….POOF 99% feedback, just like magic!!

Now with an auction site they have the operating and maintenance expense but don’t pay eBay fees plus received
buyer/seller(if any) fees. Remember, this is the third way they are trying to “sell” cards in the last six months. Once again,
there are a lot of happy people who bought from them off eBay so we just don’t matter.

Now I hope I’m wrong and you are really trying to right the wrongs…but you’re doing a REALLY terrible job at it.
Listing any of battlefield/war_eagle inventory should never happen. Also, any card of significant value should be graded
and a description of “appears” should never be used PERIOD

I have bought ’57 Topps commons from battlefield with good results. I also bought ’55 Topps were the solid colors were
ALL PHOTOSHOPPED. I even bought a graded card from War_Eagle and was very happy.

ctownboy
03-06-2018, 11:31 PM
Is it just me or don't you think the Alabama Attorney General's Office and the Alabama Better Business Bureau should be alerted about this new auction house?

That way if (when?) problems arise about cards being sold that aren't as described the authorities will already have a heads up in knowing about what is going on?

Just a thought,

David Smith

Aquarian Sports Cards
03-06-2018, 11:59 PM
https://memegenerator.net/img/instances/63275719/looks-like-i-picked-the-wrong-week-to-run-out-of-popcorn.jpg

AddieJoss
03-07-2018, 12:01 AM
I’m all for giving everyone a fair chance based on their own actions. Now with that said, based on this new auction house that wants to develop Long-term relationships.....why not grade the higher valued cards before the auction? I have not seen a reasonable reply to this question. Does ANYONE want to consign with this auction house who is not tying to maximize the value of the cards the auction?

If the cards of meaningful value are professionally graded thier provenance is less pronounced. Without answering why they aren’t graded, it appears the main reason is not a long-term relationship (which will not work without consignors) but rather a quick auction or two to help out their folks monetize the inventory for them since they do not have a venue to do it themselves. This is the easiest and quickest way to do it even if some money is left on the table. Getting them graded is more work and since they are just helping their folks out, no need to do that extra work that All the reputable AHs would do. That just makes sense to help their folks out since they aren’t able to themselves now.

I’m thrilled if I’m wrong, but that just seems like logical motivation to me.

Cory Weiser

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 12:09 AM
If you truly expect your 52 Jackie to 7, making it a 7K card, then you would do the work -- IMO.

mechanicalman
03-07-2018, 01:02 AM
Scott: I haven’t participated in your auctions, but my understanding is that you’ve established a nice alternative to the traditional big AHs. My guess is that you have some experience that could be valuable to these guys. If these guys are truly trying to turn things around and run a clean operation, I’m sure they would appreciate your insight more than your popcorn memes.

egbeachley
03-07-2018, 01:04 AM
Is it just me or don't you think the Alabama Attorney General's Office and the Alabama Better Business Bureau should be alerted about this new auction house?

That way if (when?) problems arise about cards being sold that aren't as described the authorities will already have a heads up in knowing about what is going on?

Just a thought,

David Smith

Are you kidding me? Contact the Attorney Generals Office because someone's parents are bad? While you are at it you should call my local AA chapter and let them know that I might be a problem since my Dad is an alcoholic.

BeanTown
03-07-2018, 01:58 AM
.

pokerplyr80
03-07-2018, 02:15 AM
Are you kidding me? Contact the Attorney Generals Office because someone's parents are bad? While you are at it you should call my local AA chapter and let them know that I might be a problem since my Dad is an alcoholic.

You really believe these guys are just innocent bystanders? I suggest reading through some of the points others have brought up in this thread. These guys have done nothing to convince me they're not a part of the scam. Actions speak louder than words.

Stampsfan
03-07-2018, 03:11 AM
I registered and put in a bid. If I win I will post in this thread how the transaction went down.

I figure we can't hold what someones parent(s) done against them. My parents make theirs look like Mother Teresa. Not that long ago my dad broke into my house and stole a title to a car I own(ed). He had my step mom who worked in the treasurers office process the stolen forged title and then sold my car.

Wow Ben... and I thought my dad was a douche. That's horrible, and sorry to hear that. You seem like a good man from our few conversations.

Bocabirdman
03-07-2018, 05:34 AM
I suggest looking at Post #44 of this War-Eagle thread. Leon provides links to 3 Mantles auctioned in REA. They were in SGC A slabs. Leon also provides 3 eBay links where War-Eagle is selling the same three years as NM. Now look at the Mantles in the Candiman Auction. Draw your own conclusions.

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=247588&highlight=war_eagle

bobbyw8469
03-07-2018, 06:57 AM
If I was a consignor for a group of $100 - $500 cards, I would not want to spend roughly $25 per card for grading which I probably wouldn't recoup with higher sales. And that's on top of waiting another 4 months to get paid since that's how long it is taking to get back cards from PSA.

The group sub was entered in Nov 11th....we are still waiting as of March 6th.

botport
03-07-2018, 07:53 AM
Does anyone here want to admit that they are one of the fifteen individuals consigning to Candiman Auctions? Or possibly someone just knows anyone that is consigning?

I doubt it.

As it appears to me, this is just a rebranding of the family business model as laid out lucidly by numerous members in this thread.

Frank Horv@th

bnorth
03-07-2018, 09:37 AM
Is it just me or don't you think the Alabama Attorney General's Office and the Alabama Better Business Bureau should be alerted about this new auction house?

That way if (when?) problems arise about cards being sold that aren't as described the authorities will already have a heads up in knowing about what is going on?

Just a thought,

David Smith

David thank you for the morning laugh. The BBB is a joke and telling your mom would do just as much good. The BBB has no power to do anything to anybody. All they can do is give you a grade(LOL) on their worthless web site.

If you really are that concerned please do call both places and report back with what they tell you.

Republicaninmass
03-07-2018, 09:47 AM
And all the state can do is not renew their auctioneers license if people complain. Also, I'd bet if they use a PO box, and don't list their physical address, they can't be sued

bnorth
03-07-2018, 09:55 AM
And all the state can do is not renew their auctioneers license if people complain. Also, I'd bet if they use a PO box, and don't list their physical address, they can't be sued

Ted I never knew that, now I know why so many businesses use a PO box instead of their physical address.

x2drich2000
03-07-2018, 10:13 AM
I'm not an attorney, but a PO box should not exclude someone from being sued. They would still need to have business licenses and permit filed with the state/city. Finding a physical address for them is also not hard either...took less than 2 minutes (edited out actual address for privacy purposes as it is a residence).

Candiman Auctions
1** S******* Dr
Dothan, AL 36303
(334) 790-2145
info@candimanauctions.com
Owners: Daniel Battles & Justin Battles

frankbmd
03-07-2018, 10:25 AM
I'm not an attorney, but a PO box should not exclude someone from being sued. They would still need to have business licenses and permit filed with the state/city. Finding a physical address for them is also not hard either...took less than 2 minutes (edited out actual address for privacy purposes as it is a residence).

Candiman Auctions
1** S******* Dr
Dothan, AL 36303
(334) 790-2145
info@candimanauctions.com
Owners: Daniel Battles & Justin Battles


Hartford is about 20 miles from Dothan.

egbeachley
03-07-2018, 10:29 AM
The group sub was entered in Nov 11th....we are still waiting as of March 6th.

My 4-months estimate was based on using the 10-day service :(

I sent out a package from their Jan Special and it still isn't logged in yet

bobbyw8469
03-07-2018, 10:46 AM
My 4-months estimate was based on using the 10-day service :(

I sent out a package from their Jan Special and it still isn't logged in yet

Damn...that's sad....sounds like they need to hire some help....surely, they can open up the purse springs and pay an enticing wage....sounds like they are overwhelmed with work with not enough employees to handle it.

Aquarian Sports Cards
03-07-2018, 11:14 AM
Scott: I haven’t participated in your auctions, but my understanding is that you’ve established a nice alternative to the traditional big AHs. My guess is that you have some experience that could be valuable to these guys. If these guys are truly trying to turn things around and run a clean operation, I’m sure they would appreciate your insight more than your popcorn memes.

Rest assured if someone reached out to me I would be glad to share my thoughts. As it is I was just trying to add a little humor to a thread that is difficult at best.

There's really no simple fix for these guys other than time. Frankly I think what will serve them best is actually having subsequent auctions as right now I imagine this still looks like a Battlefield fire sale to a lot of our members. Their protestations of wanting to establish long term relationships don't mean much until they've actually demonstrated that they are going to be around for the long haul. That along with the other issues mentioned are going to create a suspicion that's nearly impossible to counter until some history that runs counter to that which Battlefield has created is established.

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 11:17 AM
Rest assured if someone reached out to me I would be glad to share my thoughts. As it is I was just trying to add a little humor to a thread that is difficult at best.

There's really no simple fix for these guys other than time. Frankly I think what will serve them best is actually having subsequent auctions as right now I imagine this still looks like a Battlefield fire sale to a lot of our members. Their protestations of wanting to establish long term relationships don't mean much until they've actually demonstrated that they are going to be around for the long haul. That along with the other issues mentioned are going to create a suspicion that's nearly impossible to until some history that runs counter to that which Battlefield has created is established.

All they have to do is offer graded cards. Next to none of the issues raised by this thread would exist had they done so. IMO, the choice not to do so -- combined with the refusal to offer any recourse if your opinion or a TPG's opinion is different than their self-serving one -- is telling.

If all those raw cards work out, then great, next time (ex post) we'll know better. But ex ante, too many red flags for me.

egbeachley
03-07-2018, 11:35 AM
Damn...that's sad....sounds like they need to hire some help....surely, they can open up the purse springs and pay an enticing wage....sounds like they are overwhelmed with work with not enough employees to handle it.

They have admitted as much and I assume it got bad before they reacted. That's not a criticism since I understand any company doesn't want to go through the expensive hiring and training process for a short-term blip. But in hindsight they would probably agree they were slow to react. A huge surge in business is a problem many companies would love to have.

I'm certain that the hiring and training process is more detailed at PSA since they really need to be careful on who they hire. So, in that respect, I can add some patience knowing they aren't throwing temps at the problem.

Just to clarify, it was the Jan 2018 special.

vintagetoppsguy
03-07-2018, 12:21 PM
All they have to do is offer graded cards

Peter, I'm not trying to be argumentative, but what do you really want here? I've read your posts before in other threads how some dealers hide behind the TPG's assigned grade when a card is either altered or trimmed, but here you're asking why doesn't the OP grade his cards? So, if he grades them and they grade numerically, he's off the hook? You'll let it go? Nothing matters but the grade?

So if the OP has a card and it grades numerically, but it's really altered or trimmed, does it relinquish him of liability? I already know your answer. Of course it doesn't. So if you're going to hold him accountable either way - whether the card is graded or not - then why are you asking that he grades them? That my main question to you. Sounds to me like you just want to complain.

My point is this. Everybody has read the thread. We all have the information to base our opinions and we can all choose whether to bid or not to bid. As for me, I'll choose not to bid at this point, but my opinion may change in future auctions based on other bidders feedback. I just don't understand why you're beating a dead horse at this point?

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 12:25 PM
David, TPG is far from perfect, but it's a hell of a lot better than buying raw from Battlefield's inventory. And at least theoretically if a TPG grades an altered card in error there is recourse. There is NONE here if a card from Battlefield that these guys with no known hobby credentials grade NM MT is in fact EX. And sorry I am not going to put my faith in a scan from relatives of the master of the photoshopped scan.

steve B
03-07-2018, 12:31 PM
Hi Pete,

I understand that concern. We are going to place a much bigger emphasis on adding more graded cards for our next auction and work with consignors to get the more high end raw cards graded prior to the auction. With that being said, I don't see how a card that looks NM, measures correctly, has no creases, good centering, and minimal corner wear could possibly grade VG. We have posted high quality images of all lots in the auction. Those should give any potential bidders a good idea of the estimated grade. I sincerely hope that the winners of our raw cards get great deals and are rewarded with nice grades when the cards are submitted for grading. I think that will go a long way to proving that we are here for the right reasons. As I have said we are looking to develop long-term business relationships with the great people of this community.

Thanks,

Daniel

Really nice looking cards are sometimes VG technically. And it can be some silly thing you don't notice, or something trivial.

Like this one
http://www.net54baseball.com/picture.php?albumid=123&pictureid=3031

What makes it VG is as far as I can tell, the tiny paper inclusion that left the white dot in the background. (Not paper loss, something trapped inside the paper when it was made makes that bit stick out and the ink rubbed off. If it was in the white border, who knows, maybe vg-ex or ex?

vintagetoppsguy
03-07-2018, 12:57 PM
David, TPG is far from perfect, but it's a hell of a lot better than buying raw from Battlefield's inventory. And at least theoretically if a TPG grades an altered card in error there is recourse. There is NONE here if a card from Battlefield that these guys with no known hobby credentials grade NM MT is in fact EX. And sorry I am not going to put my faith in a scan from relatives of the master of the photoshopped scan.

I understand. But I think the OP has been honest and upfront at this point. If he does things the way Battlefield did, he won't last long. Likewise, if he runs a clean auction, his business will succeed.

Also, I don't think it's fair to judge them based on their relatives past wrong doings. Look at Ben. That took a lot of courage to say that publically about his dad. But do you not deal with Ben just because of his dad? I have an uncle the same way. Do you want to deal with me too?

I understand being leery. I am too. That's why I said I was just going to sit back for a while and just observe the auctions. But to keep talking about it at this point isn't productive. You're not going to accomplish anything.

bigfish
03-07-2018, 12:58 PM
I suggest looking at Post #44 of this War-Eagle thread. Leon provides links to 3 Mantles auctioned in REA. They were in SGC A slabs. Leon also provides 3 eBay links where War-Eagle is selling the same three years as NM. Now look at the Mantles in the Candiman Auction. Draw your own conclusions.

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=247588&highlight=war_eagle



Could you explain this?

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 01:04 PM
I understand. But I think the OP has been honest and upfront at this point. If he does things the way Battlefield did, he won't last long. Likewise, if he runs a clean auction, his business will succeed.

Also, I don't think it's fair to judge them based on their relatives past wrong doings. Look at Ben. That took a lot of courage to say that publically about his dad. But do you not deal with Ben just because of his dad? I have an uncle the same way. Do you want to deal with me too?

I understand being leery. I am too. That's why I said I was just going to sit back for a while and just observe the auctions. But to keep talking about it at this point isn't productive. You're not going to accomplish anything.

I haven't judged them, David. It's just a red flag, which to my mind they haven't dispelled. And after all, despite trashing Battlefield, they took all their inventory. Seems a bit inconsistent, to me. Not the most persuasive way to put distance between them?

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:11 PM
I see that you have two more auctions scheduled. Will these auctions also have cards from battlefield?

James

Hi James,

The plan is to have an auction every 6 weeks or so. We are already working on the next auction. As I said in a previous post yesterday we are going to try and feature more graded cards in our future auctions. There will still be raw cards but the focus will definitely be to add more graded items.

This first auction will be the only auction that includes cards from Battlefield. Everything they consigned to us is in this auction and I believe anything else they had has already been sold locally.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:11 PM
Thanks for the reply Daniel. I do not expect you to keep taking the time to respond to each of us who make an inquiry but I would challenge that the images you are using are high quality. They are actually pretty small making it impossible for a buyer to determine for themselves if your assessment is accurate. I must have missed the lots in which you disclose flaws. I seemed to see a great deal of your descriptions simply describing the player or the set the card came from with only one line about the card appearing to be in specific condition.

I did state that all houses sell raw cards but not all houses are selling cards that belong to family members who defrauded and misrepresented the product they were selling.

So you are affirming that you would not accept a return on a card that came back from PSA or SGC as EX that you described as appearing NM-MT?

Thanks,
Greg

Hi Greg,

Our policy is in line with all other auction houses. Grading is subjective and and no auction house can guarantee that their grades will line up exactly with a TPG. We have posted clear images of all of the items in the auction and tried to point out any relevant flaws. If you look at some of the cards that are Poor to EX you will see where we pointed out creasing, wax staining, paper loss, etc. Obviously anything EX-MT or higher wouldn't have these flaws which is why the descriptions are shorter.

As I have said previously (and added to the Auction Rules on the website), if any card that we haven't described as altered is sent in for grading and comes back as such we will encourage the buyer to return the card to us for a full refund.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:12 PM
Since it appears most of your auction is made up of cards from battlefield expecting a grade of VG on a card you describe as NM seems pretty optimistic to me. I would expect them all to come back altered. I am surprised any knowledgeable net54 members would even consider bidding in this auction. I will be sitting this one out.

It seems much more likely to me that this auction is nothing more than a battlefield auction moved off of eBay. I am pleasantly surprised to see eBay finally did the right thing and got rid of you guys.

Hi Jesse,

I'm sorry you feel that way. We would love to have you participate in the auction. I look forward to proving you wrong. We are NOT Battlefield and have been upfront about our association with them (see older posts in this thread). I know it is going to take time to gain the trust of you guys on this forum and I look forward to doing so. We are here for the right reasons and that will become apparent in the near future when our auction is over and people start posting about their experience with us.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:12 PM
with all the smooth talk and reassurances and self-promoting narrative, I am still waiting for the explanation why you would choose not to grade cards that obviously would be worth substantially more if in fact they are in the condition you claim.

Hi Peter,

You can call it "smooth talk" or whatever you want. I am speaking the truth and that's all I can do. The simple answer to your question is that the consignor wants everything sold and doesn't want to spend a lot of money on grading fees and have to wait months to get the cards back from PSA as egbeachley (Eric) has pointed out. They want the items sold. If they wanted the cards graded we would send them in and wait months and add them to one of our auctions later this year.

I have stated over and over (and updated this in the Auction Rules on the website), if ANY card that we haven't identified as altered is sent in for grading comes back as such we will encourage the buyer to return the card to us for a full refund. I don't know how I can be more clear about this.

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:12 PM
I try to have an open mind on this sort of thing, but I prefer specificity over generality. Let's look at Lot #26...1953 Bowman Color Mantle.

You state: "This particular card up for auction is New York Yankees Hall of Fame legend Mickey Mantle. This card has the appearance of a NM-MT condition card but does measure smaller than the standard size and would likely only receive a grade of “Authentic” if submitted to any of the major grading companies."

Let's say I win this lot for $1000 (incl. BP) and I send it to PSA. I use the 10 day shipping option ($50), send it insured Priority Mail ($14.99) and pay PSA $18 to return it. The card comes back from PSA No Grade - N-1 Evidence of Trimming.

You would refund me $.......?

Hi Frank,

In this case no there would be no refund. This card has been clearly identified as one we believe will only receive a grade of "Authentic". If it is sent in to PSA that is the expected grade and that is clearly stated. Any potential bidder should only bid whatever value they deem the card to be in as an altered card. It does have a NM-MT appearance like many altered cards do but as the title and description clearly say, the expected grade is "Authentic" and NOT a numerical grade.

I am trying to respond to as many posts as possible today. I will continue to reiterate this point. If ANY card we haven't identified as altered is sent in for grading and comes back as such, we will encourage the buyer to return the card for a full refund.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:12 PM
Curt, I believe your assessment of the situation to be spot on. Master manipulation by the Ebay first family of photoshopped, altered cards in an attempt to sell NET54 members a bag of dog $hit in hopes they'll be happy they bought it.

Hal,

You couldn't be more mistaken. I look forward to proving you wrong.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:12 PM
I'm beginning to think these guys like "dodgeball" more than they like Baseball. :rolleyes:


Guys, (Candiman) I think it's too late now anyways as you lost anything you had with me by dodging this question, repeatedly.

We haven't dodged any questions Dale. We have nothing to hide. Please see my response to Peter in an earlier post.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:12 PM
If I was a consignor for a group of $100 - $500 cards, I would not want to spend roughly $25 per card for grading which I probably wouldn't recoup with higher sales. And that's on top of waiting another 4 months to get paid since that's how long it is taking to get back cards from PSA.

Thank you for pointing this out Eric. Almost every item in the auction falls into the category you are talking about. The consignor wants everything sold. They don't want to spend a lot of money on grading fees and have to wait months to get them back from PSA.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:13 PM
I said simply..................WHY NOT ACCEPT PAYPAL; than there is buyer protections.

Hi Tony,

We don't accept PayPal (which is the policy of virtually every other auction house). We DO accept all major credit cards. Many auction houses are strictly money order, cashier's check, personal check, or wire transfer.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:13 PM
Hi Daniel
Peter Sp.aeth (hi Peter) has better explained my thoughts than I apparently could. If you read his last several posts you will know how I feel too. I told you it wasn't going to be easy. :) Good luck.
.

Hi Leon,

Peter's question has now been answered. Please see earlier posts. I know you told me this wasn't going to be easy. I never expected it to be. I didn't have to do this. I chose to. I have nothing to hide. You did say that people on here were open minded and would listen to what I have to say. Other than a small few, I believe you are wrong about this. They aren't even willing to give us a chance to prove ourselves. That's all we are asking for and I'm confident if given that chance we will be successful.

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:13 PM
Personally I think this is all worthless banter. They REALLY don’t care what a small percentage of the hobby says or does
about their new auction site. They knew coming on here that very few if any would ever participate in the auction.



Larry,

You couldn't be more wrong. If I didn't care what the people on this forum thought I would've never posted this thread. I have exposed myself to a public attack from everyone on this forum. I have been respectful to everyone and have answered as many questions as possible. We want to gain the support from the people of this forum. I know that isn't going to happen overnight. All we are asking for is a chance to prove you guys wrong. We are doing things the right way. That will become apparent after our first auction ends and in our subsequent auctions this year. I hope anyone who wins an item from our auction does get on this thread and post their experience with us. I am confident it will all be positive.

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:13 PM
I suggest looking at Post #44 of this War-Eagle thread. Leon provides links to 3 Mantles auctioned in REA. They were in SGC A slabs. Leon also provides 3 eBay links where War-Eagle is selling the same three years as NM. Now look at the Mantles in the Candiman Auction. Draw your own conclusions.

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=247588&highlight=war_eagle

Hi Mike,

We do have a 1953 Bowman Color Mickey Mantle & a 1954 Bowman Mickey Mantle card listed in our auction. BOTH are listed as altered. While they look like high grade cards, we are confident in our assessment that those 2 cards would only receive a grade of "Authentic" if submitted to any of the major grading companies. I'm not sure what your point is here. If it is that we are trying to deceive people then you are mistaken. Please click the following links to the 2 cards in our auction:

candimanauctions.com/Mickey_Mantle_1953_Bowman_Color__59___New_York_Yan-LOT30.aspx (http://candimanauctions.com/Mickey_Mantle_1953_Bowman_Color__59___New_York_Yan-LOT30.aspx)

candimanauctions.com/Mickey_Mantle_1954_Bowman__65___New_York_Yankees__-LOT36.aspx (http://candimanauctions.com/Mickey_Mantle_1954_Bowman__65___New_York_Yankees__-LOT36.aspx)

The 2 1955 Bowman Mantle's in the auction are from a different consignor.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:14 PM
Are you kidding me? Contact the Attorney Generals Office because someone's parents are bad? While you are at it you should call my local AA chapter and let them know that I might be a problem since my Dad is an alcoholic.

Hi Eric,

Thank you very much for this post. I couldn't have said it any better. We are being found guilty by association. Who has control over their parents actions or any other person for that matter? The only thing you can do in this life is control your own actions. I know who I am as a person. My Lord and Savior Jesus Christ leads me and if He is with me that is all I need.

I have said this over and over and over, we do not in any way, shape, or form support the actions of Battlefield over the past several years on eBay. We are NOT them. We are a new Auction House and not one single person on this forum has ever done business with my brother or myself. Yet we are being attacked, insulted, and not taken seriously because of other peoples actions. That is not the response Leon said I would receive if I was honest and explained the situation. I look forward to proving everyone on this forum wrong and I will continue to be active on this thread and answer as many questions as I can.

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:14 PM
Rest assured if someone reached out to me I would be glad to share my thoughts. As it is I was just trying to add a little humor to a thread that is difficult at best.

There's really no simple fix for these guys other than time. Frankly I think what will serve them best is actually having subsequent auctions as right now I imagine this still looks like a Battlefield fire sale to a lot of our members. Their protestations of wanting to establish long term relationships don't mean much until they've actually demonstrated that they are going to be around for the long haul. That along with the other issues mentioned are going to create a suspicion that's nearly impossible to counter until some history that runs counter to that which Battlefield has created is established.

Hi Scott,

I agree with you completely. It is going to take time for sure. I didn't expect this to be a walk in the park. I knew everyone would be skeptical and I have willingly opened myself up to public ridicule. We already have subsequent auctions planned for this year. We are already working on our next one right now (with ZERO items from Battlefield). All we are asking for is a chance to prove you guys wrong. The only way that can happen is seeing how our auctions play out this year. I am confident that everyone's mind will be at ease if we are just given the chance to prove ourselves.

Thanks,

Daniel

vintagetoppsguy
03-07-2018, 01:14 PM
And after all, despite trashing Battlefield, they took all their inventory.

What's wrong with that? If Battlefield offered you their inventory, you wouldn't take it either? I would. Then I would do exactly as Candiman did. I would go through it, and re-sell it, listing anything I believed to be altered as such.

What should have been done with their inventory? Do we just burn it all? I don't collect altered or trimmed cards, but they DO have their place in the hobby.

You're really complaining about taking their inventory? Seriously? You're really grasping for straws at this point.

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 01:15 PM
Could you explain this?

Please see my post from earlier today.

Thanks,

Daniel

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 01:32 PM
Hi Peter,

You can call it "smooth talk" or whatever you want. I am speaking the truth and that's all I can do. The simple answer to your question is that the consignor wants everything sold and doesn't want to spend a lot of money on grading fees and have to wait months to get the cards back from PSA as egbeachley (Eric) has pointed out. They want the items sold. If they wanted the cards graded we would send them in and wait months and add them to one of our auctions later this year.

I have stated over and over (and updated this in the Auction Rules on the website), if ANY card that we haven't identified as altered is sent in for grading comes back as such we will encourage the buyer to return the card to us for a full refund. I don't know how I can be more clear about this.

Daniel

And you have been equally clear that if a card you list as NM MT comes back a 5 or 6, or is clearly EX or EX MT upon visual inspection, there is no recourse.

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 01:34 PM
What's wrong with that? If Battlefield offered you their inventory, you wouldn't take it either? I would. Then I would do exactly as Candiman did. I would go through it, and re-sell it, listing anything I believed to be altered as such.

What should have been done with their inventory? Do we just burn it all? I don't collect altered or trimmed cards, but they DO have their place in the hobby.

You're really complaining about taking their inventory? Seriously? You're really grasping for straws at this point.

How many times do I have to say it, David? If there are legitimate high grade cards in there, send them in to one of the TPGs. If I am really grasping at straws, why is your POV so clearly in the minority here?

bobbyw8469
03-07-2018, 01:44 PM
How many times do I have to say it, David? If there are legitimate high grade cards in there, send them in to one of the TPGs. If I am really grasping at straws, why is your POV so clearly in the minority here?

I think what David is saying is, if you DO NOT think they will get the high numeric grade, then bid on them what they are worth TO YOU!! Me personally, I don't mind trimmed cards that look mint. I won't be bidding "8" prices though...I will be bidding "A" prices...

calvindog
03-07-2018, 01:45 PM
How many times do I have to say it, David? If there are legitimate high grade cards in there, send them in to one of the TPGs.

I once spent 10K on two raw Detroit Free Press PCs (Jennings and Cobb) from a Lipset auction. Lew was no thief bit he didn't care about grading cards. In addition, the DFP cards were not registry cards and not widely collected, i.e. very rare. I spent about 10 seconds thinking before pulling the trigger.

That being said, anyone who buys raw Mantles and Robinsons in "high grade" from this or any auction or even from eBay, expecting the cards to grade, needs to have his head examined. This issue has been discussed many times and there's no good reason to do so. Any auctioneer who is hoping to maximize returns would get the cards graded -- unless they expect an A grade. If the auction house advertises the cards as possibly altered then that's all anyone can and should expect from them and the risk is on the buyer.

vintagetoppsguy
03-07-2018, 01:48 PM
How many times do I have to say it, David? If there are legitimate high grade cards in there, send them in to one of the TPGs. If I am really grasping at straws, why is your POV so clearly in the minority here?

Slow day at the office, Peter? Answer my question. What was Battlefield supposed to do with their inventory?

calvindog
03-07-2018, 01:50 PM
Slow day at the office, Peter? Answer my question. What was Battlefield supposed to do with their inventory?

Burn it at the stake.

botn
03-07-2018, 01:54 PM
Our policy is in line with all other auction houses. Grading is subjective and and no auction house can guarantee that their grades will line up exactly with a TPG.

Right but you are not like other houses. You are just now running your first auction. You have no hobby presence before this. You have consignments from your parents who defrauded the public with altered cards and enhanced scans to name just a few significant difference.

We have posted clear images of all of the items in the auction and tried to point out any relevant flaws.

Again, your images are very small and it is impossible to assess the card. I sell mostly graded cards and the scans I use for those are 3 times the size of that you are using.

As I have said previously (and added to the Auction Rules on the website), if any card that we haven't described as altered is sent in for grading and comes back as such we will encourage the buyer to return the card to us for a full refund.

Earlier in the thread I mentioned that your rules state you will give a full refund if a card comes back as altered that was not described as such. I think that is a step in the right direction but my concern is with your use of the word "appears" in your description which leads one to believe the card is not going to be in the condition stated were it to be sent in for grading. Maybe it is just me I only use the word "appears" in a card description when the card looks better than it is otherwise I assign a grade and put up a large scan and stand behind the grade.

You are expecting us to rely on your assessment having no established credibility in the industry, providing us with a small scan, offering no recourse and selling cards that belong to family members whose practice it was to misrepresented their product.

I wish you luck but been in business a long time and this does not sound legit to me. I hope I am wrong and if so I will issue you an apology but if I am right there will be a lot of people scammed who will not have a voice because eBay will not be there to insist they get a refund for an item significantly not as described.

Greg

pclpads
03-07-2018, 01:56 PM
My Lord and Savior Jesus Christ leads me and if He is with me that is all I need. Daniel

Hoo Boy! When the going gets tough, always play the Jesus card. If that doesn't convince all the fence-straddlers, nothing will. :rolleyes:

vintagetoppsguy
03-07-2018, 01:56 PM
Burn it at the stake.


LOL, come on, Jeff. As I already stated (and as someone confirmed 3 posts above), altered and trimmed cards DO have a place in the hobby.

Peter chastises Candiman for purchasing Battlefield's inventory, I'm just curious what Peter thinks should have happened to it?

Aquarian Sports Cards
03-07-2018, 02:00 PM
I don't know about throwing away trimmed cards but I do hate auctioning them because I hate the thought of them passing into unscrupulous hands after my sale. I do frequently reject cards I suspect of trimming, not even consenting to sell them as trimmed. Autographs that aren't authentic I ask the consignor if I can dispose of them and I literally destroy them and throw away the remains. If the consignor requests it obviously I have to return them.

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 02:01 PM
Slow day at the office, Peter? Answer my question. What was Battlefield supposed to do with their inventory?

Asked and answered. Once more: anyone acquiring Battlefield's inventory should, in light of their history and reputation, send in any high dollar card they think is legit to a TPG for grading. I have no problem selling altered cards as altered.

Aquarian Sports Cards
03-07-2018, 02:04 PM
Hoo Boy! When the going gets tough, always play the Jesus card. If that doesn't convince all the fence-straddlers, nothing will. :rolleyes:

If this is a fake quote it's in poor taste. I don't see this post anywhere.

bobbyw8469
03-07-2018, 02:09 PM
Burn it at the stake.

I'll take them before you do that....and get every last one of them in a slab.

Batpig
03-07-2018, 02:10 PM
I'm keeping an open mind. While I do think the cards that aren't known to be altered should be graded, the explanation is plausible. The biggest factor for me is the fact that Daniel came here, and has stuck around to take a beating. There was very little reason for him to do so. If their intentions were nefarious, they would have been better off just ignoring the board.

I do believe that a lot of the cards will come back altered for reasons that they didn't plan on. Screw down compression being the big one that is often overlooked. Also measuring ok doesn't mean a card isn't trimmed. The bottom line is I think they probably aren't well versed in identifying all of the possibilities of alterations, and that might bite them.

I also would like to see higher resolution pictures.

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 02:10 PM
if this is a fake quote it's in poor taste. I don't see this post anywhere.

161.

vintagetoppsguy
03-07-2018, 02:23 PM
Asked and answered. Once more: anyone acquiring Battlefield's inventory should, in light of their history and reputation, send in any high dollar card they think is legit to a TPG for grading. I have no problem selling altered cards as altered.

No, Peter, you still have not answered the question. You're just BSing at this point. The answer you gave was not to the question I asked.

You faulted Candiman for taking Battlefield's inventory (see your quote below). I didn't ask you what he was supposed to happen to the inventory once it was obtained. You made that answer clear. I'm asking you why are you faulting Candiman for taking the inventory in the first place?

And after all, despite trashing Battlefield, they took all their inventory.

Again, you ARE grasping for straws for faulting them for taking Battlefield's inventory.

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 02:37 PM
OK David I see, I should have been more precise and said, after all, they are taking Battlefield's inventory and selling most of it as unaltered. That's what seems inconsistent to me with trashing them as unethical. If they had done the appropriate thing with the inventory, I wouldn't have a problem with taking it per se.

vintagetoppsguy
03-07-2018, 02:43 PM
OK David I see, I should have been more precise and said, after all, they are taking Battlefield's inventory and selling most of it as unaltered. That's what seems inconsistent to me with trashing them as unethical. If they had done the appropriate thing with the inventory, I wouldn't have a problem with taking it per se.

Gotcha! I apologize for any confusion. I interpreted it differently. Thanks for the clarification.

horzverti
03-07-2018, 02:52 PM
We are a new Auction House and not one single person on this forum has ever done business with my brother or myself.

Daniel

How do you know for sure that you haven't done business with anyone here in the past?

Here are your words from an earlier post:

"...we love this hobby and enjoy buying and selling items we have collected for the better part of our lives."

The probability is high that you have dealt with one of us in the past.

My opinion is that you have indeed dealt with many of us in the past, but you did so under your other usernames, Battlefield and War Eagle.
__________________

pclpads
03-07-2018, 03:03 PM
If this is a fake quote it's in poor taste. I don't see this post anywhere.

Sorry if I offended your tender religious sensibilities. However, had you been following, reading and actually comprehending all posts in this thread, you might understand that your accusations were / are false and unwarranted.

HINT: re-read post #161.

ezez420
03-07-2018, 03:14 PM
I am not commenting on the auction and wish them luck but the question is: Was Battlefield REALLY a woman or was it really a guy that was hiding behind someone else.

I am very curious and these new guys know the truth.

cardsnstuff
03-07-2018, 03:14 PM
Hi Tony,

We don't accept PayPal (which is the policy of virtually every other auction house). We DO accept all major credit cards. Many auction houses are strictly money order, cashier's check, personal check, or wire transfer.

Thanks,

Daniel

Actually, your wrong, several auctions houses already accept paypal and several more are moving towards that. For many, it's also convenient; In your particular situation, the reason I suggest it, is because although you might be telling the truth {might, being the key word}, it will provide any buyers with more protection particularly if item is not as described. You must admit the questionable practices of the past and current inventory in the current auction DO NOT inspire confidence.

pokerplyr80
03-07-2018, 03:19 PM
Hi Eric,

Thank you very much for this post. I couldn't have said it any better. We are being found guilty by association. Who has control over their parents actions or any other person for that matter? The only thing you can do in this life is control your own actions. I know who I am as a person. My Lord and Savior Jesus Christ leads me and if He is with me that is all I need.

I have said this over and over and over, we do not in any way, shape, or form support the actions of Battlefield over the past several years on eBay. We are NOT them. We are a new Auction House and not one single person on this forum has ever done business with my brother or myself. Yet we are being attacked, insulted, and not taken seriously because of other peoples actions. That is not the response Leon said I would receive if I was honest and explained the situation. I look forward to proving everyone on this forum wrong and I will continue to be active on this thread and answer as many questions as I can.

Daniel

I can't speak for him but I have to assume Jesus does not support attempts to deceive customers by selling altered cards as authentic and unaltered, or enhancing scans and describing cards that are vg-ex as NM.

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 03:22 PM
I would not presume to judge or even comment on anyone's faith and fully respect it, but just anecdotally, back in the 90s, one of the leading card doctors who sold blatantly trimmed crap through SCD was also a preacher. It seemed incongruous.

Aquarian Sports Cards
03-07-2018, 03:33 PM
161.

Ugh, thanks. Didn't spot it because it was only a partial quote.

Aquarian Sports Cards
03-07-2018, 03:36 PM
Sorry if I offended your tender religious sensibilities. However, had you been following, reading and actually comprehending all posts in this thread, you might understand that your accusations were / are false and unwarranted.

HINT: re-read post #161.

I'm an agnostic, so I have no religious sensibilities. That being said I can recognize something offensive when I see it and the fact that the quote DOES exist doesn't change my point. If this had been fabricated (which is all I said) it's in very poor taste. You could've merely done what Peter did and refer me to the post without actually insulting religious people.

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 03:45 PM
Hoo Boy! When the going gets tough, always play the Jesus card. If that doesn't convince all the fence-straddlers, nothing will. :rolleyes:

Dave,

How dare you mock my faith. I have ZERO respect for someone who would come on a forum like this and mock someones faith. Especially someone they've never even met or talked to. You should be ashamed of yourself. Leon, I would hope that this post will be removed and that no other members of this forum would support comments like this. I am fine being attacked but I will not support someone attacking mine or anyone else's faith.

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 03:45 PM
And you have been equally clear that if a card you list as NM MT comes back a 5 or 6, or is clearly EX or EX MT upon visual inspection, there is no recourse.

Peter,

Yes that is our policy which is in line with every other auction house in the industry. If by looking at the pictures posted and reading our descriptions you don't agree with our assessment then bid accordingly. The policy is clearly posted for everyone to see prior to bidding.

Again, if ANY card in the auction that we haven't identified as altered is submitted for grading and comes back as such we will encourage the buyer to return the card for a full refund.

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 03:46 PM
Earlier in the thread I mentioned that your rules state you will give a full refund if a card comes back as altered that was not described as such. I think that is a step in the right direction but my concern is with your use of the word "appears" in your description which leads one to believe the card is not going to be in the condition stated were it to be sent in for grading. Maybe it is just me I only use the word "appears" in a card description when the card looks better than it is otherwise I assign a grade and put up a large scan and stand behind the grade.

Greg

Greg,

I think people are overthinking the word "appears". It only means that by our evaluation a card appears to be in ____ condition. If I'm evaluating a card and say "this card appears to be NM to me" I don't see any problem with that. I believe our grades are accurate but as we all know grading is subjective. It is only our opinion. That's why there are images of every card in the auction posted for everyone to see so potential bidders can make their own judgement before placing a bid.

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 03:46 PM
I'm keeping an open mind. While I do think the cards that aren't known to be altered should be graded, the explanation is plausible. The biggest factor for me is the fact that Daniel came here, and has stuck around to take a beating. There was very little reason for him to do so. If their intentions were nefarious, they would have been better off just ignoring the board.



Hi Jeff,

Thank you for keeping an open mind. You seem to be one of the only people on here doing so. You are correct I have come on here and took a beating for things I had nothing to do with and do not support. I'm not going to rehash what I've said previously. I couldn't have been more clear that I do not support any of Battlefield's actions on eBay. It is there for everyone to see. I am not going anywhere. I will continue to be active on the forum. I can handle the attacks.

Daniel

Sophiedog
03-07-2018, 03:46 PM
In the 1990's right before and in the beginning of PSA card grading, quite a few big card dealers were opposed to the idea of card grading. Very few collectors had computers and there was no Ebay. SCD was a source for many including myself to buy cards. Some dealers would put their cards in holders and put a tamperproof sticker across the opening so if you wanted to inspect the cards there was no returning the cards because the seal was broken. Many trimmed and cards that had creases were sold that way. TC Card Co was the most honest dealer of all my dealings through SCD. When he said a card was NM/MT it was. Do any of you guys remember those days?
As a side note I was at the 1989? show in Atlantic City. In the elevator one guy was telling another "We're going to have a good show, I'm going to make the T cards Mint" The card graders are not prefect, but you are much better off with them than without them in my opinion. Trimming was rampant before them.
To the brothers starting the new auction company: You have to have all the cards graded nowadays; all signed pieces too. Everything has to be graded; that's just how it's done. Good Luck.

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 03:47 PM
I can't speak for him but I have to assume Jesus does not support attempts to deceive customers by selling altered cards as authentic and unaltered, or enhancing scans and describing cards that are vg-ex as NM.

Jesse,

I agree with you. You can choose to believe me or not but I had nothing to do with what went on with Battlefield on eBay. If you want to find me guilty by association then that's your prerogative. If we are all guilty by association then I'm sure every single person on the forum is guilty of something bad.

Daniel

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 03:51 PM
Peter,

Yes that is our policy which is in line with every other auction house in the industry. If by looking at the pictures posted and reading our descriptions you don't agree with our assessment then bid accordingly. The policy is clearly posted for everyone to see prior to bidding.

Again, if ANY card in the auction that we haven't identified as altered is submitted for grading and comes back as such we will encourage the buyer to return the card for a full refund.

Daniel

Do you seriously not see why so many people here are skeptical/reluctant? What descriptions? "Appears NM-MT" and tough luck if you get the card in hand and you disagree. What are your qualifications? And as was pointed out above, your scans are inadequate to make those sorts of judgments. By the way, have you closely examined each card under a loupe for the tiny flaws that can affect grading? Tons of cards can "appear" NM MT on a mid size scan or to the naked eye but aren't.

Aquarian Sports Cards
03-07-2018, 03:58 PM
Dave,

How dare you mock my faith. I have ZERO respect for someone who would come on a forum like this and mock someones faith. Especially someone they've never even met or talked to. You should be ashamed of yourself. Leon, I would hope that this post will be removed and that no other members of this forum would support comments like this. I am fine being attacked but I will not support someone attacking mine or anyone else's faith.

Daniel

I would agree with you, however realize that waving your faith as a banner in a forum that has nothing to do with faith is going to attract attention. Some of it will not be positive. I generally don't condone mocking anyone on a generic basis, I prefer to be specific. I would defend your right to your faith, but I might be tempted to give you grief for irrelevantly bringing it into this thread. I didn't, but I might.

kmac32
03-07-2018, 04:00 PM
Daniel, have no problem with you or Battlefield and when I bought from Battlefield, was aa flawless transaction. I would have no problem bidding in your auction as you seem legitimate. Only Issue I have is there is nothing there I am interested in as is true for most auctions including ebay. Not your fault on this one as I have a very narrow focus of collecting. Good luck on your acution and I wish you the best. As with any auction including the big ones, it is always Caveat Emptor.

Kmac

egbeachley
03-07-2018, 04:12 PM
Daniel, you may not believe this, but the "attacks" you have received are very mild compared to many other threads over the years. Leon was not deceiving you there. In fact you have received more support than I expected.

And I understand you being upset that your faith may have been questioned. Many of us feel that adhering to a religion is serious stuff and a religious person should provide more ethical transactions. Unfortunately, there are many who use religion to prey on others honesty and then take advantage of them. That includes here and especially on eBay. While sticking with your faith is admirable, it doesn't help because of others that came before you. As a Christian, even I am wary when I see eBay dealers profess their faith. More often than not they are using it to deceive. Ive learned it's best to leave faith out of business discussions. Save it for future one-on-one dealings with those you know personally.

pokerplyr80
03-07-2018, 04:12 PM
Jesse,

I agree with you. You can choose to believe me or not but I had nothing to do with what went on with Battlefield on eBay. If you want to find me guilty by association then that's your prerogative. If we are all guilty by association then I'm sure every single person on the forum is guilty of something bad.

Daniel

Assuming that is true, which I highly doubt, launching your new business by offering an auction consisting almost entirely of their inventory in the same raw condition seems to me to be a questionable decision. How is that supposed to dissociate you from Battlefield? Why do all of the listings include the same types of scans, descriptions, and overly optimistic grading assessments that appeared in battlefield eBay auctions?

I can't imagine why anyone would want to consign to an auction house that starts off this way when there are so many other options available.

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 04:15 PM
Peter,

Yes that is our policy which is in line with every other auction house in the industry. If by looking at the pictures posted and reading our descriptions you don't agree with our assessment then bid accordingly. The policy is clearly posted for everyone to see prior to bidding.

Again, if ANY card in the auction that we haven't identified as altered is submitted for grading and comes back as such we will encourage the buyer to return the card for a full refund.

Daniel

As was pointed out above, you aren't every other auction house. You are a start-up with no experience or as far as we know qualifications, selling the raw inventory of a notorious fraudster. And anyhow I don't know any respected auction these days that would sell some of the cards you are calling NM or NM MT without grading them. These are not attacks, that's a bogus narrative on your part. These are legitimate concerns, not answered simply by saying, trust us.

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 04:23 PM
Daniel, you may not believe this, but the "attacks" you have received are very mild compared to many other threads over the years. Leon was not deceiving you there. In fact you have received more support than I expected.

And I understand you being upset that your faith may have been questioned. Many of us feel that adhering to a religion is serious stuff and a religious person should provide more ethical transactions. Unfortunately, there are many who use religion to prey on others honesty and then take advantage of them. That includes here and especially on eBay. While sticking with your faith is admirable, it doesn't help because of others that came before you. As a Christian, even I am wary when I see eBay dealers profess their faith. More often than not they are using it to deceive. Ive learned it's best to leave faith out of business discussions. Save it for future one-on-one dealings with those you know personally.

I completely agree that religion and faith have no place in these discussions. Not because anyone doubts your sincerity, but because they are irrelevant. Very well-stated.

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 04:34 PM
I would agree with you, however realize that waving your faith as a banner in a forum that has nothing to do with faith is going to attract attention. Some of it will not be positive. I generally don't condone mocking anyone on a generic basis, I prefer to be specific. I would defend your right to your faith, but I might be tempted to give you grief for irrelevantly bringing it into this thread. I didn't, but I might.

Scott,

I'm not going to address this any further. I have zero respect for the person that made that comment. That tells me all I need to know about his character. He specifically picked out that line out of everything I have posted on this forum to mock me. Anyone who would do that has no integrity in my opinion. If you guys can't respect that then I am sorry. This will be the last I comment about this. This thread is about my auction and nothing more.

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 04:35 PM
Daniel, you may not believe this, but the "attacks" you have received are very mild compared to many other threads over the years. Leon was not deceiving you there. In fact you have received more support than I expected.

And I understand you being upset that your faith may have been questioned. Many of us feel that adhering to a religion is serious stuff and a religious person should provide more ethical transactions. Unfortunately, there are many who use religion to prey on others honesty and then take advantage of them. That includes here and especially on eBay. While sticking with your faith is admirable, it doesn't help because of others that came before you. As a Christian, even I am wary when I see eBay dealers profess their faith. More often than not they are using it to deceive. Ive learned it's best to leave faith out of business discussions. Save it for future one-on-one dealings with those you know personally.

Hi Eric,

I agree that it is best to leave it out of business discussions. But I will not deny my faith or apologize for it. I respect everyone's right to their own beliefs and mocking someone's beliefs is not OK with me. That's my only point. Please lets get back to focusing on the auction and nothing more.

Thanks,

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 04:35 PM
Why do all of the listings include the same types of scans, descriptions, and overly optimistic grading assessments that appeared in battlefield eBay auctions?



Jesse,

Have you looked at the auction? I would hardly describe the majority of the auction as "overly optimistic grading assessments". There are many lower grade cards that have been clearly graded just as the higher grade stuff.

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 04:36 PM
As was pointed out above, you aren't every other auction house. You are a start-up with no experience or as far as we know qualifications, selling the raw inventory of a notorious fraudster. And anyhow I don't know any respected auction these days that would sell some of the cards you are calling NM or NM MT without grading them. These are not attacks, that's a bogus narrative on your part. These are legitimate concerns, not answered simply by saying, trust us.

Peter,

Look, I know I'm not going to win with you. You have been one of the most critical people on this thread and no matter what I say you aren't going to believe me. There's no point in repeating myself over and over again. The only thing I can ask is that you give us the chance to prove ourselves. With this auction and the subsequent one's. Like many people on here have said, if we aren't being honest, we won't last very long. I plan on Candiman Auctions being around for years to come. Can you at least agree to allow us the chance to prove ourselves? Time will prove that we are being straightforward with everyone.

Daniel

CandimanAuctions
03-07-2018, 04:36 PM
Daniel, have no problem with you or Battlefield and when I bought from Battlefield, was aa flawless transaction. I would have no problem bidding in your auction as you seem legitimate. Only Issue I have is there is nothing there I am interested in as is true for most auctions including ebay. Not your fault on this one as I have a very narrow focus of collecting. Good luck on your acution and I wish you the best. As with any auction including the big ones, it is always Caveat Emptor.

Kmac

Hi Ken,

Thank you very much. I hope we have some items in our future auctions that will interest you.

Thanks,

Daniel

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 04:44 PM
Peter,

Look, I know I'm not going to win with you. You have been one of the most critical people on this thread and no matter what I say you aren't going to believe me. There's no point in repeating myself over and over again. The only thing I can ask is that you give us the chance to prove ourselves. With this auction and the subsequent one's. Like many people on here have said, if we aren't being honest, we won't last very long. I plan on Candiman Auctions being around for years to come. Can you at least agree to allow us the chance to prove ourselves? Time will prove that we are being straightforward with everyone.

Daniel

You very well may be honest, and I do hope that turns out to be the case. But by your logic -- I wouldn't do anything dishonest or I won't last -- there would be no dishonesty in the world. It doesn't help. What would help is if you took the collective advice of this Board on how to effectively dissociate yourself from Battlefield, but since you won't, then I think most of us are just going to wait and see and not take risks.

vintagetoppsguy
03-07-2018, 04:46 PM
Can you at least agree to allow us the chance to prove ourselves?

I think that's a fair request.

buymycards
03-07-2018, 04:51 PM
Hi Daniel, you haven't been attacked by everyone on this forum. There seems to be a group of 8 to 10 guys who attack many of the auction houses, they attack many of the larger eBay sellers, and seem to be negative about just about everything.

It seems like every post ends up with an long argument between David and Peter.

Welcome to Net54. :)

pclpads
03-07-2018, 04:54 PM
Dave,

How dare you mock my faith. I have ZERO respect for someone who would come on a forum like this and mock someones faith. Especially someone they've never even met or talked to. You should be ashamed of yourself. Leon, I would hope that this post will be removed and that no other members of this forum would support comments like this. I am fine being attacked but I will not support someone attacking mine or anyone else's faith.

Daniel

Hey Pal! Just a reminder: you're the one who introduced your religion into this thread - (perhaps thinking that would buy you some cred?) That was my only point in my post: when in doubt, play the Jesus card. Frankly, I don't give a rat's a** what your religious preference is. You brought it up, not me. So, that makes your comment fair game. Do not spin this like I am slamming or shaming anyone's religion. And frankly, religion is irrelevant and unwelcome to this board and this thread.

botn
03-07-2018, 04:55 PM
Greg,

I think people are overthinking the word "appears". It only means that by our evaluation a card appears to be in ____ condition. If I'm evaluating a card and say "this card appears to be NM to me" I don't see any problem with that. I believe our grades are accurate but as we all know grading is subjective. It is only our opinion. That's why there are images of every card in the auction posted for everyone to see so potential bidders can make their own judgement before placing a bid.

Daniel

Daniel,

You are simply talking in circles. Grading is subjective. PSA, SGC and BVG graders do it every day. You do not see their flips saying Appears NM-MT, do you? If you have the skills, experience and qualifications you should not have to use the word "appears" to describe the condition of a card. And 2 or 3 times now I have stated your scans are inadequate and far too small for anyone to assess a card. You like to compare yourself to every other auction house so please tell me another auction house that only provides tiny scans on their auction lots?

I give you credit for coming on here but what is the point if you keep skirting the issues? Yeah I know you do not think you are not skirting the issues. You reply but you truly communicate nothing substantial. I was neutral after first post but I am incredibly skeptical now given the replies you have made here.

Greg

cardsnstuff
03-07-2018, 04:55 PM
Actually, your wrong, several auctions houses already accept paypal and several more are moving towards that. For many, it's also convenient; In your particular situation, the reason I suggest it, is because although you might be telling the truth {might, being the key word}, it will provide any buyers with more protection particularly if item is not as described. You must admit the questionable practices of the past and current inventory in the current auction DO NOT inspire confidence.

Daniel, The reason I keep pushing paypal; As asked previously, Specifically: what guarantee's are you offering that an item is accurately described? I am not speaking about those as identified as authentic. I am speaking of those that are not. I understand other auction houses perhaps don't offer any either however they have a presence in the hobby for decades and thousands of satisfied customers, and generally many accept returns if not as described. And if you have followed the industry most high grade and many high $ mid grade examples of vintage cards are graded now a days, especially with the fraud that has existed in the past.

As a new auction house I think you need to go over and above {as I do on ebay, Just an FYI I am not plugging myself I am just using myself as an example}. I hope you can be successful, If you are honest you will be. Good Luck

glchen
03-07-2018, 05:04 PM
I'll just throw a vote in and repeat what most of the other posters in this thread have said. If the OP wants to be given the benefit of the doubt and treated as a respected auctioneer, he needs to grade any valuable card that he has listed, in which he does not expect an Authentic grade. I would personally say that any card with a estimated value over $500 should be graded by a respected TPG (e.g., PSA, SGC, Beckett). Actions speak louder than words on a forum, and that is my belief on what the OP needs to do in order to be trusted.

Forever Young
03-07-2018, 05:10 PM
I'll just throw a vote in and repeat what most of the other posters in this thread have said. If the OP wants to be given the benefit of the doubt and treated as a respected auctioneer, he needs to grade any valuable card that he has listed, in which he does not expect an Authentic grade. I would personally say that any card with a estimated value over $500 should be graded by a respected TPG (e.g., PSA, SGC, Beckett). Actions speak louder than words on a forum, and that is my belief on what the OP needs to do in order to be trusted.

Agreed. I am no professional card grader but many of the borders look uneven and/or “short”. Maybe it is my mind playing tricks on me based on the history here. I have never done biz with the op parents as i am no card guy. All of this said, i think my opinion based on Whst i read here is telling since i have no skin in this game. I would Not spend money in this auction thinking a card that “looks Nm” would grade out even close to that the way things are worded coupled with past links. It just all points one way... which is nowhere good imo.

BoyWonder089
03-07-2018, 05:10 PM
Hi Daniel and Justin,

First off, good luck with the auction. I hope everything you have said up to this point is honest and filled with nothing but good intentions.

This is merely a suggestion, but might you two be willing to post a video introducing yourselves and the auction site a bit more? Maybe provide some close up highlights of the auction?

I think many people realize how easily photos can be shopped, so maybe a video might add some additional trust?

Daniel and Justin,

Any chance you guys would be willing to post an introduction video? Might help add some trust?

pokerplyr80
03-07-2018, 05:13 PM
Jesse,

Have you looked at the auction? I would hardly describe the majority of the auction as "overly optimistic grading assessments". There are many lower grade cards that have been clearly graded just as the higher grade stuff.

Daniel

I have, actually. I see scans that I can't even zoom in on to try to make out the details. And the corners are fuzzy and I can't tell how sharp they are. I have no way to know if a card listed is really NM or NM + as you have them described, or VG, ex, or altered as I assume they will grade.

When I look through an auction listing I hit the sort by price, high to low button. If I'm interested in what I see I will keep scrolling from one page to the next. After seeing the first page of your auction i saw no need to keep going.

I did see a 55 bowman mantle very off center with rounded corners described an NM, as well as several other cards that seem over graded.

As I mentioned in an earlier post what I have seen seems very similar to what I saw in battlefielslds eBay listings, moved to a stand alone auction site. Perhaps I will check out the next auction and see if it looks any different. But I will be sitting this one out.

vintagetoppsguy
03-07-2018, 05:40 PM
I did see a 55 bowman mantle very off center with rounded corners described an NM...

I have to agree with this. The OC part doesn't bother me, people can judge centering for themselves. But the corners do appear to be rounded (especially the top right and bottom left). The funny thing is they don't show any wear. You would think you would see a lot of white showing through with the corners that rounded. :confused:

I increased the size of the scans some.

Peter_Spaeth
03-07-2018, 05:47 PM
One man's NM is another man's EX.

botn
03-07-2018, 05:56 PM
I have to agree with this. The OC part doesn't bother me, people can judge centering for themselves. But the corners do appear to be rounded (especially the top right and bottom left). The funny thing is they don't show any wear. You would think you would see a lot of white showing through with the corners that rounded. :confused:

I increased the size of the scans some.

Well we have been told that grading is subjective. If this is an example of their NM then it is very safe to assume the other NM examples (that do appear to be NM) have hidden flaws that would render them EX.

botn
03-07-2018, 06:13 PM
Sing along if you know the lyrics

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AIPGyKGuWeA

chlankf
03-07-2018, 08:02 PM
I fortunately never dealt with Battlefield. I do respect the majority of opinions of our board members and stayed away from them and will be following suite on your auctions, why risk my hard earned money. Time will be the true test for you in your venture and i honestly hope your comments shine true. While, like many, i am skeptical on your sincerity. In my experience those who try this hard to defend themselves are usually guilty and overly trying to cover their tracks, a guilty minds worst enemy. That being said, I do wish you the best of luck and would welcome another honest, key word, venue to obtain items. Just my two cents, pull any item that you are not 100% certain that the description is not spot on, you should be overly critical of your items. If you have even one or two Net54 members take the risk winning an item and are unsatisfied, you will never recover. The reputation damage will be irreparable and you will have wasted time, money and have shot yourself for ever having an opportunity again.

Take the advice from the community here, no one is trying to deter you from following your dreams. If you ignore all the suggestions it will be your loss and IMO a foolish move.

Final thought, leave religion out of all conversations unless you are discussing with a group of folks that all share the same beliefs. This is not that group. While it may have been innocent, there are those of us who view the remarks negatively and laughable.

irv
03-07-2018, 08:45 PM
Peter,

Yes that is our policy which is in line with every other auction house in the industry. If by looking at the pictures posted and reading our descriptions you don't agree with our assessment then bid accordingly. The policy is clearly posted for everyone to see prior to bidding.

Again, if ANY card in the auction that we haven't identified as altered is submitted for grading and comes back as such we will encourage the buyer to return the card for a full refund.

Daniel

You repeatedly keep saying this but what guarantees anyone that you guys will be around after your first auction is over?? Many here are thinking this, I can guarantee that.

Like what has been mentioned numerous times, you sound and look too much like Battlefield and War-eagle.

My gut tells me, and I hope I am wrong, that you guys are just trying one last time to grab as much money as you can before you leave the hobby/auctions for good.

I also think you likely know that this forum/some members here had a big part in your parents demise/exit from E-Bay.

I know this is harsh, but like what has been said numerous times, you are not answering questions fully and seem determined to continue down that path without appeasing anyones concerns or questions. :confused:

Post up bigger, expandable pictures for starters. That cannot be that hard can it? And if you are 100% truthful in your self praise that you are in it for the long haul, that should have been done immediately after the first poster mentioned it.
You still have not given a reasonable answer why you never did that in the first place nor why you continue not too?

Like I said much earlier, you had me for a bit with your choice words where I actually believed you somewhat, :o but after reading more and more of your replies, I have completely done a 180 since.

botport
03-07-2018, 09:13 PM
How long does this need to go on?

Most single vintage cards in auctions... collector grade to high grade are slabbed by a TPG... enough of the free advertisement for Candiman Inc.

Plenty of people have had their say. Let the auction, and or future auctions sink or swim. Enough information has been disseminated for people to make their own minds up.

frankbmd
03-07-2018, 09:18 PM
To paraphrase Groucho Marx

“I wouldn’t want to be a bidder in any auction that would accept me as a bidder.”

Jenx34
03-07-2018, 10:07 PM
I am not buying candiman is here to be robinhood. I think battlefield and candiman are the same entity.

Basket of deplorables


Toby Petersen

I don't know that to be true. However, I had some issues with battlefield in July (I guess that's why I didn't get an email from them!). My takeaways from that and going forward are:

1. Once I filed a return claim on Ebay, I received and traded messages on Ebay. The tone was not nice, as I was not happy they relisted and sold all of the cards again, including one that had unmentioned paper loss on the back, BEFORE they refunded my money. The verbage of those messages did not have the feel of coming from a female. They also didn't contain wording what I would think of as coming from an 80+ yr old man and felt like they were coming with someone younger. I can't prove it and I went back and those messages are no longer on Ebay. So Daniel, if it wasn't you or your brother, who was handling that part of the business for your parents?

2. Battlefield and then War Eagle Vintage both used Auctiva software. They listed 500-600 cards per week. I apologize if I offend some of our older collectors who are computer savvy, but how realistic is that they didn't have help from the kids. I could be wrong on this one as I'm almost 50 myself, but I still thought it far fetched that war eagle vintage could be up and running so fast, especially if you believed the story in their listings, which brings me to #3......

3. When War Eagle Vintage started selling right after Battlefield stopped, their listings included a story about how they were selling a lifelong collection after recently retiring, blah blah blah. "Their story" certainly didn't give the feel of "we've been in business for a long time screwing people". It was also noted here that several of the cards listed were recently purchased as authentic, with comparable pics to prove it.

So I ask, why should we believe this is not just another story spun as was done with war_eagle_vintage? It seems Ebay was no longer an option, so another way to do business had to be found. Spin it with a new story and make money? Keep in mind, Battlefield took returns and issued refunds. So is changing their policy on refunds as a member suggested here, really helpful? It sounds good, but if you sell enough stuff and make enough money, who cares if you have to take returns? It works for WalMart!

One of the other things I read about Candiman, Inc. existing since 2011 makes me question things. What is the history there? Maybe it's already been answered, but an explanation there would be nice.

One last thought... even if everything they say is true and they are "clean" and don't/never approve of how their parents did business, aren't buyers of these cards simply rewarding the parents anyway? If the money is going back to them, it doesn't seem like them being "out of the business" is true.

DJR
03-08-2018, 12:14 AM
How hard would it be for Silkroadauction to shut down this charade?

BeanTown
03-08-2018, 12:14 AM
One thing I noticed when registering to bid on their auction. You are approved right away no matter what information you put down. No verification on anything and approval happens right after you hit submit.

slipk1068
03-08-2018, 12:18 AM
Hey guys,

My name is Daniel and along with my brother Justin, we are the owners of Candiman Auctions. We We want to be upfront and honest with everyone about our association with them. We are related to the owners as I'm sure everyone on here already suspected based on our last name.

Related? Really? You make your parents sound like distant cousins. If you wanted to be upfront and honest, you could have been a little more transparent about that.

even if everything they say is true and they are "clean" and don't/never approve of how their parents did business, aren't buyers of these cards simply rewarding the parents anyway? If the money is going back to them, it doesn't seem like them being "out of the business" is true.

Exactly. Even if they are disassociated from their parents, anyone who bids in this auction is rewarding their parents. They don't deserve our bids.

I believe the brothers should be judged apart from their parents. Problem is, Candiman appears to be nothing more than a revamped Battlefield.

Jenx34
03-08-2018, 12:43 AM
LOL, come on, Jeff. As I already stated (and as someone confirmed 3 posts above), altered and trimmed cards DO have a place in the hobby.

Peter chastises Candiman for purchasing Battlefield's inventory, I'm just curious what Peter thinks should have happened to it?

David:

The answer is not as cut and dried as you want it to be. The fact that they are consigning cards from the inventory of a known scammer as the feature cards in their first auction doesn't pass the smell test. It makes one wonder if they aren't just in this for a quick buck. I don't know the answer to what should happen to all of those cards, but being the feature of a new auction house run by family members just doesn't sit well.

What people are saying, is because of the history, they should go above and beyond to make sure they are above reproach. That they go the extra mile to distance themselves and earn respect on their own rather than jumping right in with mamma and daddy's tainted collection. Perhaps if they established themselves first and then added a few to future auctions with even more detail than they are presenting, it might fly. But I have yet to see them state in this thread that they have measured every single card and only made note of a handful (ones that could likely be traced back to their parents REA purchases?).

Also, in their responses they keep referring to Battlefield's inventory and not condoning Battlefield's prior actions, but no mention of war_wagle_vintage. Maybe a technicality, but future auctions could have inventory from war eagle, but not Battlefield.... Still lots of questions for me.

Jenx34
03-08-2018, 01:02 AM
Peter,

Look, I know I'm not going to win with you. You have been one of the most critical people on this thread and no matter what I say you aren't going to believe me. There's no point in repeating myself over and over again. The only thing I can ask is that you give us the chance to prove ourselves. With this auction and the subsequent one's. Like many people on here have said, if we aren't being honest, we won't last very long. I plan on Candiman Auctions being around for years to come. Can you at least agree to allow us the chance to prove ourselves? Time will prove that we are being straightforward with everyone.

Daniel

Daniel, your problem with Peter is you keep coming back with the same responses and he keeps challenging you because your responses to cover the depth of his concerns. I believe what Peter has said and is trying to say is this...

As a new auction house, fairly or unfairly attached to the reputation of your parents Ebay shenanigans, if you want respect from the serious card community, it is on YOU to go above and beyond to SEPARATE your business from the transgressions of your family. Featuring their inventory isn't doing so. And your continued responses about Peter's concern re: grading accuracy and another's question about Paypal with "we are the same as all the other auction houses" does nothing to separate you or give anyone the confidence that you are not just an extension of your parents with a new story and method.

If you are NOT them, prove it by separating yourself from them, not just denouncing them. If you had listed a few cards of theirs and disclosed that might be just fine. But that collection is the bellcow of this first auction, which sends up red flags everywhere. So it really is YOU that is not doing a good enough job earning it, rather than just asking people to believe you.

I truly hope you can see the difference.

Stonepony
03-08-2018, 11:15 AM
I've been following this thread and likely was the one to direct the auctioneer to this thread. After reading opinions and examining the cards in the auction I have a couple thoughts. 1) Candiman auctions has shown williness to engage in conversation that is quite heated and inflammatory, yet shown poise and respect. That's not easy to do. I understand they haven't complied with some posters request or answered all questions. I don't expect them to suddenly close an auction scheduled to close in a couple days and ship cards to PSA that is months and months behind on orders. 2) I believe most if not all the " high grade" raw cards are Battlefield inventory and not another consignor 3) I am not going to take a chance on the auction ( disclosed- I did put in a bid for the Red Heart Mantle before I knew who they were associated with) because I'm not comfortable with their ability to assign grades. If I bought a card and it came back authentic from PSA I would simply return it. My problem is cards that are listed as NM ( the 1955 B Mantle) that is clearly VG. This wipes out any confidence I would have that their assigned grades are remotely accurate. Without larger scans and more detailed descriptions I can't risk it.
I'm sure someone on this site is going to take a flyer. sometimes we can't help
Ourselves. I hope those persons keep us updated. I hope all works out well for all involved, but I'm out.

slidekellyslide
03-08-2018, 01:26 PM
So two young guys with accounting degrees decide to go into the baseball card business at the same time their parents get booted from ebay? They say no one can claim to have done business with them in the past yet they also say they have collected their whole life. They have Battlefield NM-M in appearance cards that they refuse to send off for grading. Paypal not accepted.

And then one of them dropped the "God bless" card.

Good luck fellas.

Peter_Spaeth
03-08-2018, 01:58 PM
So two young guys with accounting degrees decide to go into the baseball card business at the same time their parents get booted from ebay? They say no one can claim to have done business with them in the past yet they also say they have collected their whole life. They have Battlefield NM-M in appearance cards that they refuse to send off for grading. Paypal not accepted.

And then one of them dropped the "God bless" card.

Good luck fellas.

And don't forget, no recourse if you or a TPG disagrees with their grade. Hardly a theoretical concern given the origin of the cards and the NM I mean EX 55 Mantle we saw yesterday.

Bpm0014
03-08-2018, 02:01 PM
There is a Don Mattingly card that is described at "Mint +". Whatever that means? :confused::confused:

bnorth
03-08-2018, 02:01 PM
And don't forget, no recourse if you or a TPG disagrees with their grade. Hardly a theoretical concern given the origin of the cards and the NM I mean EX 55 Mantle we saw yesterday.

Is there a single auction house that guarantees that a card will grade exactly the same as their estimate?

Peter_Spaeth
03-08-2018, 02:02 PM
Is there a single auction house that guarantees that a card will grade exactly the same as their estimate?

Is there a single other auction house selling Battlefield's inventory, or selling 52T NM Jackie Robinsons ungraded?

Beyond that, with most auction houses or dealers, you know the qualifications and track record of the guys telling you their grades. If (just to pick a couple of names at random) Steve Verkman or Mike Wheat or Dean's Cards are telling me how a "raw" card grades, that means something to me.

If it's an unknown telling you the grade, you're taking a big risk on anything worth real dollars.

bnorth
03-08-2018, 02:03 PM
Is there a single other auction house selling Battlefield's inventory, or selling 52T NM Jackie Robinsons ungraded?

Peter your answer is even more evasive than theirs.:D

slipk1068
03-08-2018, 02:18 PM
A nice midgrade 52 Jackie has been very high on my wantlist for a while. Just waiting for the right card at the right price. It is tempting to go for the one in their auction because I can likely get that for a PSA 4-5 price. If I can get it into a PSA 6 or higher holder, JACKPOT. Battlefield built their business around collectors trying to do just that-find a raw bargain.

I am not fooled. I do think these brothers deserve to be judged separate from their parents, but the safest route is to sit this one out and wait to hear the feedback from their 1st auction.

Peter_Spaeth
03-08-2018, 02:22 PM
Peter your answer is even more evasive than theirs.:D

Not at all. I am pointing out context. The fact that other auction houses don't guarantee their grade, which the OP kept alluding to, really is beside the point here.

If (just to use a perhaps imperfect analogy, and only for illustration) Bernie Madoff's son with no experience was offering you an investment opportunity -- indeed the same one his father previously tried to sell you -- you're going to hold him to a higher standard than a venture capitalist with a 20 year track record with whom you are familiar.

And that's all I am saying here -- the situation calls for caution -- and I am not sure the OP fully understands why so many of us are saying that. It's not an attack, it's not personal, it's just common sense.

jfkheat
03-08-2018, 02:36 PM
One issue that I see here that has not been brought up it that many of these high dollar cards have been sold by battlefield and war_eagle on eBay more than one time. They were returned for refunds because they weren't as described. Was that because of photoshopped scans or because the cards had been altered in some way. I would bet that many of the high dollar cards were in slabs when the parents bought them.
James

bnorth
03-08-2018, 02:40 PM
Not at all. I am pointing out context. The fact that other auction houses don't guarantee their grade, which the OP kept alluding to, really is beside the point here.

If (just to use a perhaps imperfect analogy, and only for illustration) Bernie Madoff's son with no experience was offering you an investment opportunity -- indeed the same one his father previously tried to sell you -- you're going to hold him to a higher standard than a venture capitalist with a 20 year track record with whom you are familiar.

I do understand all of your posts in this thread. Because of my life experiences I judge people on their own actions. Yes that silly way of thinking has got me burnt before. I would still rather give many scum the benefit of doubt rather that talk crap about 1 innocent person no matter who they are related to.

I can see many legit reasons they are selling their parents old inventory. At some point in time I will have to do the same thing with all the junk my dad has acquired. I can guarantee he is much worse than a couple selling some baseball cards listed improperly.

I will end this by saying if they do turn out to be scum I will be pilling it on them as much as anybody else. Just read some of my posts I am not afraid to call out the scum in this hobby even though it has come close to getting me kicked off this wonderful forum a few times.

conor912
03-08-2018, 02:47 PM
There is a Don Mattingly card that is described at "Mint +". Whatever that means? :confused::confused:

PSA 11. Just wait. It's coming.

bnorth
03-08-2018, 02:50 PM
PSA 11. Just wait. It's coming.

Those PSA 11 cards as known as "Pristine Gem Mint" I have one in my collection. Custom made of course.:D

slidekellyslide
03-08-2018, 03:08 PM
I am not fooled. I do think these brothers deserve to be judged separate from their parents, but the safest route is to sit this one out and wait to hear the feedback from their 1st auction.

I don't know about that...I just searched their mother on facebook. She works for an accounting firm in Dothan, Alabama. Does anyone really think they're not close with their parents? This is the same wolf with new sheep clothing.

Stonepony
03-08-2018, 03:13 PM
I do understand all of your posts in this thread. Because of my life experiences I judge people on their own actions. Yes that silly way of thinking has got me burnt before. I would still rather give many scum the benefit of doubt rather that talk crap about 1 innocent person no matter who they are related to.

I can see many legit reasons they are selling their parents old inventory. At some point in time I will have to do the same thing with all the junk my dad has acquired. I can guarantee he is much worse than a couple selling some baseball cards listed improperly.

I will end this by saying if they do turn out to be scum I will be pilling it on them as much as anybody else. Just read some of my posts I am not afraid to call out the scum in this hobby even though it has come close to getting me kicked off this wonderful forum a few times.

Ben I understand your sentiments and generally agree. I just think under the circumstances the merchandise should be presented with having made every attempt ( including TPG and high quality scans and descriptions) to fully disclose the quality and condition of the cards. The cards came from a corrupt organization and we should certainly demand clarity

frankbmd
03-08-2018, 03:20 PM
Let’s hear from all those who judged war eagle independently of battlefield, despite having essentially the same inventory and modus operandi.
Granted the venue is different now, but sometimes a leap of faith is off a cliff.:eek:

slidekellyslide
03-08-2018, 03:31 PM
Coach's Corner is still in business. Shady businesses can keep operating seemingly forever I suppose as long as they offer returns. Battlefield was operating for how long on ebay without any repercussion? War Eagle was the same outfit. I personally believe this family has just decided to go independent and cut out the middleman (ebay).

Ulidia
03-08-2018, 04:33 PM
I can see many legit reasons they are selling their parents old inventory. At some point in time I will have to do the same thing with all the junk my dad has acquired. I can guarantee he is much worse than a couple selling some baseball cards listed improperly.

I will end this by saying if they do turn out to be scum I will be pilling it on them as much as anybody else. Just read some of my posts I am not afraid to call out the scum in this hobby even though it has come close to getting me kicked off this wonderful forum a few times.

The issue isn’t that they are apparently selling their parents’ inventory - it is that they appear to be using very similar (much critised) techniques that, prima facile, would make limited sense to an objective bystander.