Thoughts? Amazing 1885-1889 Indianapolis Studio Cabinet Card

[npa589]

This just ended, I just missed out on it. It was at 179.50 with less than 5 minutes to go.

I believe this is 1889 which would mean it has Jack Glasscock, Amos Rusie, and Bancroft. I'm no expert on what they look like and it's always hard to compare picture to picture with players back then but I feel Glasscock is easily identified - though Rusie is a little tougher. In the center is Frank Bancroft right?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-SPORTS-PHOTO-1900-039-s-BASEBALL-TEAM-PHOTO-INDIANAPOLIS-INDIANA-/391984557825?item=391984557825&ViewItem=&nma=true&si=eo9YBJkJkRAtYyr%252B3TW8iGp75l8%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557


I found an old thread talking about another photo found of Indianapolis Hoosiers on N54: http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=190880

[T206Jim]

I believe it is 1889 as well, Rusie middle seated row 2nd from left, Glasscock middle of back row.

[packs]

I compared the photo to this REA cabinet and did not feel like I saw two of the same people in them:

https://bid.robertedwardauctions.com/bids/bidplace?itemid=43345

[the-illini]

I compared the photo to this REA cabinet and did not feel like I saw two of the same people in them:

https://bid.robertedwardauctions.com/bids/bidplace?itemid=43345

yeah i didn't see anyone i clearly recognized either on the ebay one that just sold. Admittedly I am not great at picking out players though.

[npa589]

True, but if this is 1889, then Harry Spence would have no longer been the manager - with Frank Bancroft taking over (along with Glasscock). Also, Amos Rusie made his debut with the Hoosiers in 1889, and was not on the 1888 team.

Here is the BR site for the 1889 team:

https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/IND/1889.shtml

[packs]

I don't see Glasscock in the photo at all, or anyone who resemble him. I also don't see anyone who could be Paul Hines, who has a pretty distinct appearance in the REA cabinet.

I think it is more likely this is the Western League Hoosiers than the NL team.

[JeremyW]

I was following this auction & couldn't match any faces with any of the '87-'89 Indy Hoosier teams. The uniforms appear to be the same, but I don't think this is the major league team.

[npa589]

Who do you think you see? I feel like I see Myers (front row seated right side) and McGeachy (middle top row) so far. Are those the 2?

[packs]

There would be more than a few players shared in the REA cabinet and this photo if this was the 1889 team and I don't see any of the confirmed players from the REA cabinet in this photo.

[npa589]

There would be more than a few players shared in the REA cabinet and this photo if this was the 1889 team and I don't see any of the confirmed players from the REA cabinet in this photo.

Definitely --- I feel like Myers and McGeachy are accurate, and even if there is one of the same, I'm curious to figure out what year this was, and what team. (And I promise that I was not the winner)

[ramram]

This could be the 1885 Western League team with Bill Watkins, manager, in the middle.

Rob M

[oldjudge]

Hats don't match 1889 Indy Old Judge Images. I don't see Rusie either.

[npa589]

This could be the 1885 Western League team with Bill Watkins, manager, in the middle.

Rob M

Good call - I definitely see that. It's hard to decipher age in these photos and Watkins would be 26 in the cabinet card. At first I assumed it was an older man.

[judsonhamlin]

What's the latest date that this might be, given the uniforms? Clark appeared to be an active studio into the 1890's at least.

[JeremyW]

Rob might be onto something here. I see the resemblance with Watkins.

[A2000]

The ears appear to match up :D

[npa589]

I've tried to find some other players and identify them and have names on three players - but they are shots in the dark--- but figured I'd throw it out there. Here is the roster (going with the 1885 theory): Dan Casey, Chub Collins, Sam Crane, Jim Donnelly, Jim Keenan, Deacon McGuire, Larry McKeon, Mox McQuery, Cyclone Miller, Gene Moriarty, Miah Murray, Tom Poorman, Sam Thompson (HOF)




Dan Casey
306914

Mox Mcquery
306915

Sam Crane
306916

[JeremyW]

If I were you, I'd be happy that I missed out on this one. Cool photo, but not that valuable.

[Leon]

If I were you, I'd be happy that I missed out on this one. Cool photo, but not that valuable.

Sometimes great deals on the front end, or even good deals, don't turn out how they are supposed to. Been there, done that, on more than one occasion.

[JeremyW]

Sometimes great deals on the front end, or even good deals, don't turn out how they are supposed to. Been there, done that, on more than one occasion.

I've been down that path before. If I could have confirmed that Rusie was in this photo, I would have bid a higher price than it sold for & still wouldn't be sure that I got a great/good deal.

[insidethewrapper]

I don't think I see Sam Thompson in that photo and he joined the team in 1885. Watkins was manager in 1884-1885 so it could be a 1884 photo.

[packs]

I think it is more likely a later photo of the 1890s Western League team.

[JeremyW]

Mike- I thought about that possibility also & am certain Sam Thompson is not in the photo. I believe that Watkins is pictured, so 1884 sounds correct to me.

[npa589]

I don't think I see Sam Thompson in that photo and he joined the team in 1885. Watkins was manager in 1884-1885 so it could be a 1884 photo.

Agreed - he definitely isnt in the photo.

[RUKen]

Watkins was manager in 1884-1885 so it could be a 1884 photo.

Watkins also managed the Indianapolis team in 1895, 1896, 1897, and part of 1898.

[IMAXMAX]

i think i see Dude Esterbrook up in the mix,,,thus making it the 1888 Indianapolis team(???)

[judsonhamlin]

Any shot at all that it as late as 1901? I don't think so but if so, Harry Bay is close to the guy seated front left

[insidethewrapper]

If Harry Bay is in the picture with Bill Watkins as manager then it is 1901 based on baseball-reference data. How come all these guys look the same ?

[swarmee]

Why are so many people posting eBay ended items the day of or after they ended? Don't you remember how many of those deals are cancelled by the seller when they think they can resell for more, or when a Net54 member or lurker sees the thread and offers the seller more?
Give it a week and then ask; be kind to your fellow collectors.