Bulk Lot Purchase comes up short.

[savedfrommyspokes]

I recently purchased a large, bulk lot of cards from a reputable auction house.

When the securely packed package arrived, I eagerly removed the multiple individual boxes containing the lot from the shipping box. However, I quickly realized that the total amount of cards advertised for this large lot were physically unable to fit in the individual boxes (IE. auction advertised 1000 cards and they were packed into two 400 ct boxes). I reviewed/counted this lot of cards and all of the cards that were advertised were present (this lot contains a high quantity of multiples of each card), however, there were just not as many copies of each card as there should have been based on the lot's approximate number of cards represented by the auction house.

While this auction house did indeed state that this lot would contain an approximate number of cards, IMO the actual amount received was significantly short of the approximate number.

For other buyers of larger bulk type lots with a description mentioning just an approximate number (versus a firm amount) of cards, what is an acceptable variance (by percent) from what was received versus what was approximated?

And if your variance threshold was exceeded, what would you expect the auction house do to successfully complete the transaction?

[conor912]

It doesn't take a genius to figure out that 1000 cards won't fit in two 400 ct. boxes. I'd call them on it.

[Cozumeleno]

Can't speak to traditional auction houses when it comes to this but as someone who used to sell bulk lots of eBay, I'll give my two cents.

It's difficult because card thickness varies. (500) 1990 Upper Deck is different than (500) 1934 Goudeys. So while I consider about a 5% variance to be a good number, I don't know how hard it would be to complain about 10% for a large transaction. 20%, as it seems in your case, is unacceptable, though - especially considering that 800 cards isn't a ton and that it's easy to tell that 500 cards, unless ultra thin, won't fit into a 400-card box.

Since it said 'approximately', I don't know if you technically have a valid beef. But I'd at least let them know about it and see if they will do anything.

And FWIW, I once was in the same boat with a lot on eBay. The seller took the difference and refunded me the per card difference that I bid. So if you paid $100.00 for 1,000 cards, you'd get a $20.00 refund, assuming there were 400 cards. Not saying they will do that, but it's a reasonable solution.

[Jobu]

I have never been in your situation but to me being off by 20% way too far off, especially for a professional AH and especially when all the cards were stored in boxes that only held 800 cards. If they said approximately 800 cards and sent you those two full 400-count boxes then that would be close enough for me if they were both full.

I would contact the AH and suggest an easy solution - the buyer's premium was probably also about 20% so ask them to refund that to you because you would like to pay approximately 100% of your bill and use the same definition of approximate that they used in their listing.

[conor912]

I also feel compelled to add that I have never known 400 cards to fit in a 400 ct. box, unless they are pack-fresh and jammed in there like sardines.

[savedfrommyspokes]

Thank you guys for the replies......the 1000 cards in 2 400 ct boxes was just an example to illustrate that what was advertised could not come close to fitting into the boxes that were used to ship the lot in.

After counting the lot, which is much larger than the example, there is a 14% variance between the actual amount received and the amount that was advertised. Based on the size of the boxes that were used to ship this lot in, the variance amounts to an entire box worth of cards not being included. The multiple boxes used to ship this large lot as well as a single box used to ship another lot I won, were all packed snugly into one larger shipping box, so there was no room for the "missing" box.

I did contact the auction house and asked if there were any cards from the lot that had not shipped with rest. I then provided them with a count of cards by each box and the capacities of the boxes so that they could see that the advertised amount could not physically fit into the boxes used . Their response was that they thought it is strange the amount was off because one of their employees had counted the lot and then asked me if I was absolutely sure about the shortage. They then asked what amount I thought was fair to be refunded back.

Based on the fact the AH spent more to ship than what I was charged (yes, this is true) and that the advertised amount was approximate, I replied that a 10% refund (versus a 14%) would successfully conclude the transaction.

They responded back with an offer of 3%, and when I pointed out the fact that this mistake was their's and not mine they responded with an offer of 5%(or send it back??). This is where we sit now.

[conor912]

Wow. That's pretty shitty of them. It blows my mind that they have a chance to keep you as a return customer but instead are willing to write you off to save a few dollars. Unbelievable.

[jhs5120]

They responded back with an offer of 3%, and when I pointed out the fact that this mistake was their's and not mine they responded with an offer of 5%(or send it back??). This is where we sit now.

I would take the 5% refund. It's much better than sending the lot back to them. I've received lots from auction houses that were not quite as advertised - I just chalk it up as a loss and keep a mental note of which AH's exaggerate their lots and which do not.

[Jobu]

I would tell them there are two options: 1) you take the 5% and will no longer buy from them or 2) they give you the 10% and keep you as a customer, then let them decide. (Returning the lot is also no good because then you have to pay to ship it back to them and are out $$ with no cards to show for it.)

[conor912]

I just think it's BS that they even said a guy there counted the cards....either he's lying, or they did count them and then padded their description. If they did count them, they would have known there 860 cards, so why write "approximately 1000". Either way, that's just wrong.

What AH is this BTW? Feel free to pm it if you don't want to say, though I think others would like to know, too.

[Mountaineer1999]

What auction house

[savedfrommyspokes]

What auction house


The point of this thread was to make sure that I am not being unreasonable in either my approach to this situation or my expectation of receiving 96% (86% product + 10% reimbursement) of something that I paid 100% for, not to call out someone specifically.

[ibuysportsephemera]

What kind of dollars are we talking about? If the total difference is say $75 then I wouldn't waste too much time haggling over $20 or $30. I would let them know that you will be outing them here and will never do business with them again. On the other hand if you are talking about hundreds of dollars, I would pursue them for as much as possible. Good luck.

Jeff

[Mountaineer1999]

The point of this thread was to make sure that I am not being unreasonable in either my approach to this situation or my expectation of receiving 96% (86% product + 10% reimbursement) of something that I paid 100% for, not to call out someone specifically.

Fair enough. I just wonder how often their approximations are too low? And if someone counted the cards, why was it listed as approximate? You deserve your 10% back in my usually ignored opinion. You were taking the high road and being more than fair about it and they throw you a 3% bone.

[buymycards]

Is this any different than if they advertised a full set and there were some commons missing? Did their employee really count these cards, or did he just guess? They need to stand behind their auctions. If they were 14% short, then they owe you 14%. As for the shipping, it isn't your problem if they underestimated the shipping charges and didn't charge you enough.

Tell them you will have the cards in the mail right away and you expect a full refund for the cards, the buyers premium and shipping both ways. I'll bet they will come up with the 10% that you are asking for.

Rick

[rainier2004]

Is this any different than if they advertised a full set and there were some commons missing? Did their employee really count these cards, or did he just guess? They need to stand behind their auctions. If they were 14% short, then they owe you 14%. As for the shipping, it isn't your problem if they underestimated the shipping charges and didn't charge you enough.

Tell them you will have the cards in the mail right away and you expect a full refund for the cards, the buyers premium and shipping both ways. I'll bet they will come up with the 10% that you are asking for.

Rick

Exactly, they owe you...it was their mistake, not yours.

[Cozumeleno]

Is this any different than if they advertised a full set and there were some commons missing?

I think there's definitely a difference. This listing gave an estimated total number of cards where they specified that it was an approximate figure - a complete set is a complete set. If even one common is missing, it's not what it was advertised to be.

[conor912]

At the end of the day, they either:

A) counted them correctly (860 cards) and then chose to grossly exaggerated "approximately 1000".....dishonest, no mistake
B) counted them incorrectly....honest mistake, but still their mistake
Or C) lied about counting them in the first place

None of these 3 should be acceptable to any buyer.

[savedfrommyspokes]

Thank you all for the advice, it certainly appears to have just been an honest mistake by the AH, as they were indeed financially accountable for their mistake and reimbursed me for the balance of the cards.

[ibuysportsephemera]

Thank you all for the advice, it certainly appears to have just been an honest mistake by the AH, as they were indeed financially accountable for their mistake and reimbursed me for the balance of the cards.

Excellent, glad it worked out for you.

Jeff

[Leon]

Thank you all for the advice, it certainly appears to have just been an honest mistake by the AH, as they were indeed financially accountable for their mistake and reimbursed me for the balance of the cards.

It's always good to hear of positive outcomes.

[bobbyw8469]

I remember one time I won some cards from Lew Lipset that WERE NOT as advertised. They were raw, and at least two grades off from what they were touted as. When I brought them to his attention, I was blocked (which was fine with me, as I had no intention of bidding with him ever again anyway). Lew hasn't had an auction in over two years. Point being, if an auction house is pretty shady, or doing crappy stuff like what you mentioned, chances are real good, that they won't be around much longer anyway. Karma has a way of weeding out the bad ones.

[felada]

I'm pretty sure poor customer service and over grading is not the reason lew has not had an auction in two years

[bobbyw8469]

I'm pretty sure karma has a way of weeding out the bad from the good. Period.