View Full Version : I need help with the authenticity of these
sfacujackcat
10-06-2014, 03:24 PM
A lady called my store about a lot of early 1900s cards that her grandfather owned before he passed away, and I am looking for some answers as to their authenticity, if they're fakes, etc.
She sent me pictures via text and email, and there's about 75 or so Goudeys, about 80-100 T200s and some others. In all, it's about 200 cards total from the early 1900s (pre-war). I'm scheduled to meet with her later this week to see them in person, hold and feel them and just get an idea of what we're dealing with.
Just wanted thoughts as to what people thought about them being real or fake.
Thanks.
Jaybird
10-06-2014, 03:27 PM
Fake
Econteachert205
10-06-2014, 03:28 PM
Bad
h2oya311
10-06-2014, 03:30 PM
See my post on the post-war side...these are all fake. Please make sure to out the seller so that others are not deceived! I will venture to guess that this is a craigslist scammer.
sfacujackcat
10-06-2014, 03:39 PM
Thanks for the posts guys. But give me some reasons. I'd like to tell her that they're fake. No, they're not a craiglist find. It's a lady that called my store today. I'd like to explain to her what the deal is and why I think they're fake.
Wrong paper, wrong ink. Corners have all been uniformly rounded. Plus it's pretty unlikely she would randomly have 5 of the biggest cards in the hobby. Occam's razor.
glchen
10-06-2014, 03:50 PM
As others have said, they are all fake. For the Ruth Red Sox card (the first one you have), take a look at this page to see why it's a fake: Link (http://net54baseball.com/forum/content/spottingfakes.html).
For the other cards, the Playball looks took white, the Joe Jax Cracker Jack card stock looks too thick, for the Goudey Ruth, the colors look wrong on the front (e.g., you should see different levels of shading).
Typically, if you have one fake, then all the others are very suspect. If someone found some undiscovered cards that they had for many years, and they are all top rated HOFers worth a lot of money, and there are no commons, then you have to be very careful as typically people should have genuine commons also.
sfacujackcat
10-06-2014, 03:50 PM
Yea, kinda what I was thinking too about the 5 biggest names in the vintage card industry. I need to find out if she has more or what the deal is.
She also had some 50s-60s stuff all the way up to the 2010s. But these were the only scans of the early 1900s card she sent my way.
Wrong paper, wrong ink. Corners have all been uniformly rounded. Plus it's pretty unlikely she would randomly have 5 of the biggest cards in the hobby. Occam's razor.
buymycards
10-06-2014, 03:52 PM
It's funny that these scammers never have any commons. Only Babe, Cobb, etc.
icollectDCsports
10-06-2014, 04:12 PM
If she suggests a high price, the level of the attempted fraud may be high enough to interest the local police. You might want to contact them before turning her down outright in case they want to suggest some sting / investigative action. If she's shopping these things around, she's a threat to successfully find an unwitting buyer -- and who knows how many folks she may have scammed already. She's likely just the face person for the scam and there are one or more other folks in the operation making and marketing these fakes. Needs to be stopped.
sfacujackcat
10-06-2014, 04:23 PM
She's not shopping them around. She wants to be very private about the whole deal and has numerous other cards from the era. She just knows these were the bigger names and knew they'd be the ones I was most concerned about.
In fact, I've taken them off the thread because she asked me not to show them for fear of what could happen if someone finds out what she has, where she's from, etc. Thanks again guys for all of your help.
It's funny that these scammers never have any commons. Only Babe, Cobb, etc.
I've also noticed that. They never have 50 or 100 cards with a Ruth or Cobb in the mix. It's always just the most expensive cards, and always without any provenance. :rolleyes:
glchen
10-06-2014, 04:30 PM
She's not shopping them around. She wants to be very private about the whole deal and has numerous other cards from the era. She just knows these were the bigger names and knew they'd be the ones I was most concerned about.
In fact, I've taken them off the thread because she asked me not to show them for fear of what could happen if someone finds out what she has, where she's from, etc. Thanks again guys for all of your help.
Why would she be afraid if others find out what she has? They're all fake and worthless.
icollectDCsports
10-06-2014, 04:34 PM
Why would she be afraid if others find out what she has? They're all fake and worthless.
Yep. Her desire to be anonymous almost makes me more suspicious. Do you know her? Is she local to you? How does she explain how she obtained these and the other cards? If she contacted you about the cards, how do you know she isn't offering them to others?
sfacujackcat
10-06-2014, 04:38 PM
It was my fault. I jumped the gun asking about their authenticity before finding out more about them/her.
Basically, her lawyer told her not to give out info about the cards except to a trusted dealer and not to tell people where she's from etc because of the value he put on the cards. She asked around, and people told her to call my store.
She got them from her grandfather when he passed away recently. There were 5 grandkids, and each one got a bunch of cards. She's sent several more pictures with what looks to be a near complete set of the '33 Goudeys.
It's not as fishy as it's sounding. But I'm still trying to find out more. I'm going to be meeting with her and her lawyer (who also collects cards) soon to take a closer look, hold and feel them (the cards), etc.
icollectDCsports
10-06-2014, 04:47 PM
It was my fault. I jumped the gun asking about their authenticity before finding out more about them/her.
Basically, her lawyer told her not to give out info about the cards except to a trusted dealer and not to tell people where she's from etc. She asked around, and people told her to call my store.
She got them from her grandfather when he passed away recently. There were 5 grandkids, and each one got a bunch of cards. She's sent several more pictures with what looks to be a near complete set of the '33 Goudeys.
It's not as fishy as it's sounding. But I'm still trying to find out more. I'm going to be meeting with her and her lawyer (who also collects cards) soon to take a closer look, hold and feel them, etc.
Got it. I was just concerned that she may be part of a larger scam operation of some kind.
If her lawyer collects cards, he should have advised her to have them graded if she is planning to sell.
vintagetoppsguy
10-06-2014, 05:50 PM
She got them from her grandfather when he passed away recently. There were 5 grandkids, and each one got a bunch of cards. She's sent several more pictures with what looks to be a near complete set of the '33 Goudeys.
You don't really believe that, do you?
I'm going to be meeting with her and her lawyer (who also collects cards) soon to take a closer look, hold and feel them (the cards), etc.
Why are you meeting with her attorney? They're fake. If her attorney collects too, he should know they're fake as well.
She got them from her grandfather when he passed away recently. Seems unlikely. She and her attorney are either totally ignorant about vintage sports cards (what attorney would assign such a high value without proper research?) or knowledge is being withheld and it's a scam.
Jaybird
10-06-2014, 11:21 PM
It was my fault. I jumped the gun asking about their authenticity before finding out more about them/her.
Basically, her lawyer told her not to give out info about the cards except to a trusted dealer and not to tell people where she's from etc because of the value he put on the cards. She asked around, and people told her to call my store.
She got them from her grandfather when he passed away recently. There were 5 grandkids, and each one got a bunch of cards. She's sent several more pictures with what looks to be a near complete set of the '33 Goudeys.
It's not as fishy as it's sounding. But I'm still trying to find out more. I'm going to be meeting with her and her lawyer (who also collects cards) soon to take a closer look, hold and feel them (the cards), etc.
Complete set of Goudeys but fakes of everything else? What? Grandfather gave everyone cards. If he knew enough to have a full set of Goudeys he would have known enough not to have these recent creation fakes. C'mon.
sfacujackcat
10-07-2014, 08:07 AM
Grandfather didn't give away cards. He passed, family didn't know what to do, so they split them up. You see it all the time.
Actually, I thought the Goudey set was small (like 100 cards or so), but it's not. So, she doesn't have a set. She has about 75 various Goudeys and about 80-100 T-200s that she showed me. It's a nice-sized lot, fake or not, of vintage (or counterfeit) cards.
drmondobueno
10-07-2014, 09:16 AM
You don't really believe that, do you?
Why are you meeting with her attorney? They're fake. If her attorney collects too, he should know they're fake as well.
Her attorney? Really? Name? Location? My scam sensor is screaming.
vintagetoppsguy
10-07-2014, 09:22 AM
My scam sensor is screaming.
At least yours is still working. Mine got so high it broke.
sfacujackcat
10-07-2014, 09:32 AM
Alrighty, judging by the masses, it's a scam. I'll let her know that she's lying and all of her cards are fake.
Thanks guys for the advice and help. Guess I'm not as well informed in vintage as I thought I was. Lessons learned.
Thanks again. This thread can now be deleted.
Jaybird
10-07-2014, 12:19 PM
Alrighty, judging by the masses, it's a scam. I'll let her know that she's lying and all of her cards are fake.
Thanks guys for the advice and help. Guess I'm not as well informed in vintage as I thought I was. Lessons learned.
Thanks again. This thread can now be deleted.
Why do you feel the need to delete all of your past threads? Everything you sell, you delete pictures of and the record of the sale. I just did a quick search last night and it seems you have a pattern of selling and then deleting. Asking, deleting. Posting, deleting. Hiding something?
Why do you feel the need to delete all of your past threads? Everything you sell, you delete pictures of and the record of the sale. I just did a quick search last night and it seems you have a pattern of selling and then deleting. Asking, deleting. Posting, deleting. Hiding something?
I gave him an infraction this morning for deleting posts and told him why and was as overly polite as I could possibly be. I told him it wasn't personal and nothing else would happen. He PM'd that he would keep it in mind. I almost said something else but let it go. Then a short time (an hour maybe) later he posted right above here, "this thread can now be deleted". He is in time out..
drmondobueno
10-07-2014, 04:36 PM
Are we being scammed? By "this guy"?
That was my first thought when I saw the thread. Other people have brought fakes here hoping to sell them to someone on this forum. They always realize that we are not their target customer and disappear quickly. I checked this guy's posts, and it does look like he is a card dealer. Lots of "1960's commons for sale cheap" type threads. The constant deleting of threads is odd though.