How rare are the OLD MILL cards of the T206 "Exclusive 12" of the 460-only series ?

[tedzan]

Most T206 collectors do not consider the OLD MILL back to be that tough in the general ranking order of the various Tobacco advertising backs.

Sure, we have proven that these Exclusive 12 subjects are quite available with PIEDMONT, SOVEREIGN, SWEET CAP, POLAR BEAR, and even the
availability of the tough AMERICAN BEAUTY 460 backs. Furthermore, these 12 are more available with the rare Red HINDU back than the other 31
subjects printed with this back.

http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/1stEx12gpSC460x42x9x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/2ndEx12gpSC460x42x9x.jpg


Now, while these 3 cards are not pretty looking, I challenge anyone to try and find them....or any of the other nine Exclusive 12 subjects....
in any condition with OLD MILL backs. Incidently, all 12 subjects have been confirmed with the OLD MILL back.

.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/large/OMMcGrawFordDevore50x.jpg
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/large/OMMcGrawFordDevore25b.jpg


The point here that is being emphasized is that certain series of T206 subjects do not always conform to the general pattern applicable to most
T206 subjects. And, with these 12 guys, it's the OLD MILL back.

These 3 cards are from a recent find of an original collection in Northern California, which included a group of T206 OLD MILL cards.


So, show or tell us of your Exclusive 12 cards with OLD MILL backs. Or, just chime in with your experiences and/or questions regarding this subject.



TED Z
__________________________________________________ _________________________________
LOOKING for this T206 guy to complete my EXCLUSIVE 12 red HINDU sub-set (12 subjects)

SHECKARD (glove)
.

[Harford20]

Ted,
Although I agree that Old Mill is not usually considered a tougher back to obtain, In my recent collection of a complete back run of Nap Lajoie throwing, the Old Mill back was FAR tougher to find than either the EDPG or the brown Hindu (both of which most consider tougher backs than Old Mill). I estimate that I was able to come across at least 4-5x more EDPG and brown Hindu Nap backs before an Old Mill was seen. The Old Mill I finally caught was a beater, folded in 5 different directions.

There may be more than just the "Exclusive 12" that have a difficult front/Old Mill back to obtain.

Dave

[CMIZ5290]

Great stuff Ted....

[tedzan]

Dave

There certainly are quite a number of 150 series subjects that are tough to find with Old MILL backs. The pink Chase and green Cobb
immediately come to my mind.

What is interesting about the Exclusive 12 is that here we have a group of cards that are very available with PIEDMONT, SOVEREIGN,
SWEET CAP, POLAR BEAR, and even the the tough AMERICAN BEAUTY 460 backs....yet these 12 are very tough with a back that we
normally do not consider tough....OLD MILL.


Congratulation on completing your Lajoie (throwing) sub-set.


TED Z

__________________________________________________ _________________________________
LOOKING for this T206 guy to complete my EXCLUSIVE 12 red HINDU sub-set (12 subjects)

SHECKARD (glove)
.

[Harford20]

Ted,
Thanks for the explanation.
Certainly have not found any of the "Exclusive12" Old Mills around my house.

Dave

[Tao_Moko]

Ted,

My notes show that I had a Sheckard with OM back. It was part of a 50 card Cubs collection that I sold to a board member 4-5 years ago. I'll email him and see if he still has it to post an image.

Of all of my notes/lists dating back to the mid eighties - I have no other mention of any of these 12 with OM back.

Regards,

Eric

[tedzan]

Eric

An OLD MILL Sheckard (glove) is a real toughie. The PSA POP Report indicates just 1 has been graded.
It is a PSA 1.

Could it be the same card that was in your Cubs collection ?


Regards,

TED Z

__________________________________________________ _________________________________
LOOKING for this T206 guy to complete my EXCLUSIVE 12 red HINDU sub-set (12 subjects)

SHECKARD (glove)
.

[Rollingstone206]

...

[Tao_Moko]

Ted,

It is possible that it's the same one. I have never used grading services so it may have been graded after I owned it. I also bust slabs but the majority of that collection came from a dealer at a show and all cards were raw.

Not much help I know. I will say that if I sold it cheap than it's probably rare.

E

[PEEK enterprises]

As usual, Ted is absolutely correct, these (12) are really tough in any grade. Here is a Crandall w/ Cap (for sale/trade if anyone is interested).

[jimivintage]

See.....all this makes me want to do is start working on a back run again! Dang it, Ted! :)

[atx840]

These are extremely difficult and only a few have been found.

Devore Authentic sold for $1659 - auction (http://www.robertedwardauctions.com/auction/2014_spring/371.html)

Sheckard PSA 1 sold for $3850 auction (http://www.robertedwardauctions.com/auction/2014_spring/1781.html)

Tannehill PSA 2 sold for $4150 auction (http://www.robertedwardauctions.com/auction/2014_spring/1782.html)

A steal here, McGraw and Gandil in a lot for 5k auction (http://www.robertedwardauctions.com/auction/2014_spring/1785.html)

There were another three of four hidden in REA lots.

I used to own a Duffy.

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8365/8495828380_3d5f0437ef_z.jpg

[DerekMichael]

I know of a board member who has a Zach Wheat - Old Mill in a PSA 7.

Wild, wild stuff ...

[tedzan]

That's really amazing....there is only one Zach Wheat/OLD MILL graded by PSA, and it's a "7".


Best regards to you and your family,

TED Z
.

[tedzan]

Well, I'm now 33 % on my way to putting together an OLD MILL run of the Exclusive 12 cards. Unlike my red HINDU adventure last year, I'm anticipating
a long OLD MILL odyssey. My red HINDU challenge a year ago was too short. I acquired 10 of these Exclusive 12 red HINDU cards in just 2 months.

http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/1stEx12gpSC460x42x9x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/2ndEx12gpSC460x42x9x.jpg

I started collecting these particular twelve T206 subjects that I refer to as the "Exclusive 12" since 2004....when I acquired an AMERICAN BEAUTY 460
Zach Wheat and a red HINDU Lee Tannehill.

What intrigued me about these 12 guys is three-fold............

* they are more available than the other 36 subjects that were printed only with 460 series tobacco adv. backs (except OLD MILL & UZIT).

* these 12 guys were NOT printed with certain backs that the other 36 subjects in this series were.

* and yet, they were printed with certain backs that the other 36 subjects in this series were NOT printed with.


Anyhow, I now have completed the Exclusive 12 with the following T206 back runs......

AMERICAN BEAUTY 460
PIEDMONT 460, Factory #25
POLAR BEAR
SOVEREIGN 460
SWEET CAPORAL 460, Factory #30
SWEET CAPORAL 460, Factory #42

Near completed these Exclusive 12 sub-sets............

red HINDU......................need Sheckard
El PRINCIPE de GALES......need 4 more
SWEET CAPORAL 460, Factory #42 (overprint)....need 6 more
TOLSTOI.......................need 8 more

Furthermore, there is the impossible:
UZIT (extremely rare......still looking for any)

And finally,

LENOX (NOT PRINTED)
PIEDMONT 460, Factory #42 (NOT PRINTED)


T-Rex TED

__________________________________________________ _________________________________
LOOKING for this T206 guy to complete my EXCLUSIVE 12 red HINDU sub-set (12 subjects)

SHECKARD (glove)
.

[tedzan]

absolutely amazing research!

are you working on other anomalies like this Ted!? others like this already found?


Thanks for the compliments.

I have posted numerous threads these past 9 years on this forum regarding the T206 set and its "complexities".

Check out TedZ T206 info (http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=132611&page=5) for starters.


TED Z
.

[T206.org]

Apparently someone thought this also applied to Sovereign 460:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/T206-Hugh-Duffy-HOF-Chicago-Sovereign-460-RARE-BACK-/381011379326?pt=US_Baseball&hash=item58b60c447e

With that said though, are there any other backs that these "Exclusive 12" are as difficult to find with as Old Mill?

[tedzan]

That ebay description is incorrect.

The Exclusive 12 subjects are more available than any of the other 40 subjects printed with the SOVEREIGN 460 back.

The Exclusive 12 are really scarce with OLD MILL and UZIT backs.


Thanks for asking.


TED Z
.

[T206.org]

Much appreciated, Ted.

[Tao_Moko]

Eric

An OLD MILL Sheckard (glove) is a real toughie. The PSA POP Report indicates just 1 has been graded.
It is a PSA 1.

Could it be the same card that was in your Cubs collection ?


Regards,

TED Z

__________________________________________________ _________________________________
LOOKING for this T206 guy to complete my EXCLUSIVE 12 red HINDU sub-set (12 subjects)

SHECKARD (glove)
.

The one sold in REA is almost certainly not the one that I had documented. I've owned hundreds of T206 Cubs since the mid eighties so there is always a chance that I listed it incorrectly, but I don't think so. Looks more like I let a nice card slip for probably less than $40.

[tedzan]

The one sold in REA is almost certainly not the one that I had documented. I've owned hundreds of T206 Cubs since the mid eighties so there is always a chance that I listed it incorrectly, but I don't think so. Looks more like I let a nice card slip for probably less than $40.


Do you recall what grade that Sheckard was in the REA auction ?

Four cards of Sheckard (glove) have been graded. Although, the cards graded by SGC appear to be the result of a "cross-over" (or two).


TED Z
.

[tedzan]

The sum of the SGC & PSA POP Reports regarding these 12 subjects with OLD MILL backs is "Slim Pickens"....an average of only 3 examples per each guy.

Therefore, I cannot pass up this challenge. I will endeavor to acquire all 12 with OLD MILL backs. Condition is immaterial.


http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/1stEx12gpSC460x42x9x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/2ndEx12gpSC460x42x9x.jpg



TED Z
__________________________________________________ _____________________________________________
LOOKING for these T206 guys to complete my EXCLUSIVE 12 run of OLD MILL cards (12 subjects)

..... Duffy ..... Gandil ..... Geyer ..... Hummel ..... Pfeffer ..... Sheckard ..... Tannehill ..... Wheat
.
.

[JerryTotino]

Ted best of luck on your quest to acquire all 12 of these subjects with old mill backs.

I don't believe you have mentioned these same subjects with a possible Cycle 460 back. I collected Cycle 460's for about 2 years and some of these subjects are also extremely difficult to find.

Jerry

[tedzan]

You are absolutely correct regarding the Exclusive 12 subjects with the CYCLE 460 backs.

I have not mentioned this back with respect to the Exclusive 12, since I did not go after these cards
because I knew that you and Lee B. were collecting this run.



TED Z
.

[tedzan]

Although all the Exclusive 12 subjects have been confirmed with the OLD MILL back......they are very, very rare !


http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/1stEx12gpSC460x42x9x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/2ndEx12gpSC460x42x9x.jpg


I've completed most of the T206 back runs on these 12 guys, so I left this challenge for my last.

Only the UZIT run of these 12 guys is more difficult; and, I don't expect to ever complete the "impossible".


.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/OldMillCrandall25x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/websize/OMMcGrawFordDevore50x.jpg
.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/OldMillCrandall25xb.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan77/images/websize/OMMcGrawFordDevore25b.jpg


__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ____________
LOOKING for these T206 guys to complete my EXCLUSIVE 12 run of OLD MILL cards (12 subjects)

..... Duffy ..... Gandil ..... Geyer ..... Hummel ..... Pfeffer ..... Sheckard ..... Tannehill ..... Wheat



"With a Little Help from My Friends" (Beatles, 1967)......on this great forum, I hope to complete this mission.


You guys really helped me acquire 10 of my red HINDU cards of these Exclusive 12 in just a matter of 2 months last year.... Thanks again.

Hey guys....I still need SHECKARD (glove) with the red HINDU back.



TED Z
.

[Tao_Moko]

Do you recall what grade that Sheckard was in the REA auction ?

Four cards of Sheckard (glove) have been graded. Although, the cards graded by SGC appear to be the result of a "cross-over" (or two).


TED Z
.

Sorry that I'm just now seeing your question. Here is the PSA1 sold in REA

[tedzan]

A nice looking Sheckard......thanks for posting it.

I will be on the lookout for one like it.


TED Z
__________________________________________________ _____________________________________________
LOOKING for these T206 guys to complete my EXCLUSIVE 12 run of OLD MILL cards (12 subjects)

..... Duffy ..... Gandil ..... Geyer ..... Hummel ..... Pfeffer ..... Sheckard ..... Tannehill ..... Wheat
.

[Drew]

Top of page easier to find!:)
drew

[DICKTOWLE]

I have the Hummal in the old mill, looking to sell, I have pictures but don't know how to get them to this post

[MR RAREBACK]

what are the hard hindu browns to find?
does anyone have a complete run

[Luke]

Just check the pops. There are no patterns, pretty much a normal distribution.

[tedzan]

I have the Hummal in the old mill, looking to sell, I have pictures but don't know how to get them to this post


Hi Dick

I sent you an email.


TED Z
.