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GKreindler
08-16-2013, 12:15 PM
Hey all,

I don't normally post on this side of the boards, but I think that y'all might be able to really help with my latest conundrum.

For those of you who know me, you may or may not remember that I have a business card that's designed to look like a T206 tobacco card. When I exhibited at the National in Cleveland of '09, I had piles of 'em at our table, and still continue to give them out to this day.

Now, here I am 4 years later and I'm pretty much out. I wanted to continue with this theme for my cards, and have now added different players to the set, as well as continued switching up the backs when I can. Here's what I have designed thus far:

http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b158/GKreindler/BusinessCards_zpsdc9730a0.jpg (http://s19.photobucket.com/user/GKreindler/media/BusinessCards_zpsdc9730a0.jpg.html)

So, my big issue is this: I'm having a good amount of trouble getting the proper paper/card stock for these badboys to be printed on. Originally, the Mathewson (which was the first) had a somewhat glossy front and a matte back, but now that I have an actual tobacco card in hand, I can see that I was pretty off. It also doesn't help much that Dean (my agent) has been trying to find the proper printers to make this thing into a reality, and they even they seem to be mystified on a more remedial level.

What I was wondering is whether any of you know anything about the stock that was used for the T206. I'm most interested in the technical specs, like paper weight, press, and the like. Being that this info is over 100 years old now, I'm not really getting my hopes up, but I know that some of you know just about everything there is to know about this set, so I thought asking here was worth a try.

And just in case it's an issue for anyone that finds this query a bit suspicious, know that there is no intention to make any fraudulent cards or anything like that - I wouldn't even dream of it. I'm just hoping that the business cards can both show my paintings in a cool light and also be somewhat true to the original cards themselves.

So yeah, any help you guys can provide is GREATLY appreciated.

Thanks!

Graig

Clydewally
08-16-2013, 12:19 PM
I can't help you on the paper stock, but those are some very cool business cards.

bobbyw8469
08-16-2013, 12:23 PM
can you not just buy an old common beater PSA 3 or a raw card, and take it to the printer and have him/her examine the paper stock? It seems like a pretty easy task if you ask me. And no, glossy would be out. You would want matted for the front and back.

bobbyw8469
08-16-2013, 12:24 PM
Also, do you want these the same sizes as the original T206's or would you want them business card size?

GKreindler
08-16-2013, 12:31 PM
Thanks, Ken!

Bobby, it's funny you say that: I actually sent the beater that I bought in Chicago to the printers last week, so I'm hoping that they'll be able to figure it out from there. If not, I guess it's obvious that I need new printers. But I was just hoping to get as much info as possible, regardless. And 'yes', these are the same size as the T206s (1 7⁄16 x 2 5⁄8 inches, right?).

Thanks for the responses!

Graig

ethicsprof
08-16-2013, 12:38 PM
no idea about the paper stock issue but have to say those are gorgeous
cards and quite inventive as well.
Your talent knows no bounds. We are fortunate to have you with us on
good ole net54.
Congrats, Graig!!!
best,
barry

Gobucsmagic74
08-16-2013, 12:39 PM
Would you consider offering these cards for sale to board members? I'd be interested in a complete "Kreindler set" of business cards.

GKreindler
08-16-2013, 12:58 PM
Wowzas, thank you Barry. It's really I who am honored to be here. Y'all are wonderful.

Dan, I won't sell them, but I'd be happy to send you a set for free whenever they're done (which, fingers crossed, will hopefully happen before I turn 86 years old). That goes for everyone, really. The only thing I might ask for is a SASE...

T206Collector
08-16-2013, 01:00 PM
Would you consider offering these cards for sale to board members? I'd be interested in a complete "Kreindler set" of business cards.

+1

Gobucsmagic74
08-16-2013, 01:08 PM
Wowzas, thank you Barry. It's really I who am honored to be here. Y'all are wonderful.

Dan, I won't sell them, but I'd be happy to send you a set for free whenever they're done (which, fingers crossed, will hopefully happen before I turn 86 years old). That goes for everyone, really. The only thing I might ask for is a SASE...

That's awesome Graig! Obviously, no problem on the SASE.

GKreindler
08-16-2013, 01:11 PM
Then, you got it!

:)

7nohitter
08-16-2013, 01:14 PM
Craig,

If you're giving these away count me in as one who would gladly send the postage to you!

Andrew

Beautiful work!

brob28
08-16-2013, 01:18 PM
Would you consider offering these cards for sale to board members? I'd be interested in a complete "Kreindler set" of business cards.

+1 - those look incredible Craig - just love the Matthewson and Cobb in particular. In all seriousness your work is amazing stuff!

rp12367
08-16-2013, 02:07 PM
+1 Nice business cards, also your paintings are amazing!!!

Runscott
08-16-2013, 02:13 PM
Graig, go to an art store and look at watercolor paper - there are various weights and surfaces and you should be able to find one that matches up well.

freakhappy
08-16-2013, 04:29 PM
Seems like we are going to have to start a new thread for members that want a set of "The Kreindler Collection Business Cards"! :D They look awesome and I want to be included as well.

Good luck with everything, Graig...you do outstanding work!

nebboy
08-16-2013, 05:21 PM
There is a stock that is used in making folding cartons (things like those cheap pizza boxs). Its called (Clay Coated Newsback & Kraftback Clay Coated News Back (CCNB) it comes in many diffrent paper weights. It can be ordered with easy. Call a paper supply company and they may indeed lead to to a diffrent printer.

Nice Cards - Good Luck

GKreindler
08-16-2013, 06:44 PM
Thanks for all of the lovely compliments, everybody - I very much appreciate it. In all seriousness, if any of you want a set, I'll be happy to send you one if you provide a SASE. I'll just have to make an announcement or something about when they're done.

Scott, a good call, indeed. I guess I'd just have to find a nice hot press paper and perhaps I'll be able to find the bounce I'm looking for.

John, I'll look into CCNB - it sounds like it could possibly work. I just hope that in the end, whatever I end up picking, I don't want someone to get a card or two and say that it's completely off. That's most certainly a nightmare.

Thanks again, everybody.

Graig

Runscott
08-16-2013, 06:52 PM
Scott, a good call, indeed. I guess I'd just have to find a nice hot press paper and perhaps I'll be able to find the bounce I'm looking for.


I used watercolor paper for a set of OJ reprints I created, and it worked great. I printed the photos on photo paper, trimmed the edges so that the sheet was smaller than the watercolor paper, then sprayed glue on the back of the photo paper and pressed it on. I also created a test run with stats, and used the same technique to glue that sheet to the other side. The trickiest part was creating accurate crop marks, but I developed a good system that I can discuss with you if you'd like.

steve B
08-16-2013, 10:15 PM
T206s are right around .013 thick. The weight it's called will depend on the type of stock. The coated stuff mentioned earlier sounds about right. I'm not sure what category it fits into.

There's some good info here

http://www.businesscards.org/design-guide/printing/paper-guide/

Comparing stock, it's very similar to the acid free comic backing boards, which are a bit thicker.

If the printer is still clueless you could try the place I worked for. Not cheap, but good quality.
http://www.arlingtonlithograph.biz/

Steve B

GKreindler
08-17-2013, 05:55 PM
Scott, if we end up going that route in the end, I'd definitely love to talk to you about it, if possible.

Steve, thanks so much for that info. At this point, the prices don't concern me a hell of lot, since I really just want to make sure it's done right. How long did you work for Arlington? What did you do?

Thanks again,

Graig

steve B
08-17-2013, 07:38 PM
I worked for them for a bit over two years while in Highschool. But before any one dismisses that, they had high but reasonable standards for us. They cross trained nearly everyone, including the highschool help. That way of someone was out sick or hurt or something and there was a real need for particular work they were covered. If you weren't full time at a particular job they expected quality but maybe not speed. And the Highschool kids like myself got a bit of a pass on arriving late as long as it wasn't abused. I was part time during school, full time during summer.

Over the two years I spent some small ammount of time in almost every department. I didn't do sales, or run the papercutter.

But I did do a bit in the camera room, platemaking, The Stripping department:eek: Not that kind, the kind where you arrange the negative on the mask so the plate can be made. A good deal of time in the bindery with folders, gatherer/stitchers, 3 hole drill for stuff eventually going into a binder, round corner cutter (which was actually from 1910 or so and one of my favorites) Shrink wrapper.....Some time doing both shipping and recieving,
And my last week, one of the press operators got hurt so I ran the press with instruction. He'd been injured before and the injury wasn't work related event hough it happened at work -After hours, at the beer party for a full time guy who was leaving a week before I was - Good news , a week running the 35 inch Heidelberg :D. Bad news - No beer party for me.

The paper cutters were in the bindery which was my area to be responsible for. Some would view it as only cleaning up, but they made sure we knew that without the cleaning, the other work would be less safe, and slower, both of which would lead to poor quality work. It gave us all a very real sense of every job mattering in getting the work done quickly and correctly.

While I was there they did a lot of stuff for MIT and the government. I still have a few things somewhere. The most impressive were some air force recruiting book covers. Which were more poster than book cover. Glossy pic of a fighter plane around 14x20 and really fussy for registration. A very fine screen, and if it was slightly off the colors would be all wrong. There was one older guy who got all those type jobs, His registration was always exactly right.
My first day on the press they said they'd be happy if I got the first job setup an running by the end of the day. They were really happy to see it up and running before noon, and I got 3 of the 4 colors done by quitting time. By the end of the week I was only marginally slower than anyone else and still getting it right. So a great week for them and for me:D

Jake who is running it now was around once in a while. Being maybe 13-14 he did some cleaning in the office. Yeah, EVERYONE started at the bottom and ended up doing everything.

Steve B