Need help with my m101 research.

[nolemmings]

I am trying to confirm the existence of as many m101-4/5 ad-back combinations as possible–so far at a little over 1400. I therefore would greatly appreciate any front-back scans you could post, pm or e-mail me. Condition does not matter, even trimmed cards are OK so long as I can see the card number. At this time, I am not needing any Famous & Barr or Herpolsheimer scans, as very near sets of each were sold in the last couple of years, thus confirming the existence of all but a handful or so of those cards. I also do not need blank-back scans, as we already know that both m101-4 and 5 have been sold as complete sets.

I am confirming each card by using the PSA and SGC pop reports, except for Sporting News because, like T206, so many backs were simply lumped into that category back in the day. Standard Biscuit and Weil Baking pops aren’t perfect either, as they sometimes include the 1917 E135-like cards. Other than pop reports, I am relying on scans–I’ve collected between 1500-1600, but many of those are blank backs, which are unnecessary for the current project.

Because I have used the pop reports, I likely have accounted for most slabbed cards from the major two TPGs, although I am looking for slabbed Sporting News backs. However, the raw cards are often off the radar, and while I have borrowed many of your scans posted here over the years, I know there are lots in collections that have not been shown or that I neglected to capture in my database, and those are what I would really like to see (along with Beckett and GAI cards).

Please, scans of ad-back m101-4 and m101-5s (I need both front and back) would be very helpful!! These include: Altoona Tribune; Block& Kuhl; Burgess-Nash; Everybody’s; Gimbels, Globe; Green-Joyce; Holmes-to-Homes; Indianapolis Brewing; Mall Theatre; Morehouse Baking; Sporting News; Standard Biscuit; Successful Farming, Ware’s Basement and Weil Baking. Thanks in advance.

[Leon]

I am trying to confirm the existence of as many m101-4/5 ad-back combinations as possible–so far at a little over 1400. I therefore would greatly appreciate any front-back scans you could post, pm or e-mail me. Condition does not matter, even trimmed cards are OK so long as I can see the card number. At this time, I am not needing any Famous & Barr or Herpolsheimer scans, as very near sets of each were sold in the last couple of years, thus confirming the existence of all but a handful or so of those cards. I also do not need blank-back scans, as we already know that both m101-4 and 5 have been sold as complete sets.

I am confirming each card by using the PSA and SGC pop reports, except for Sporting News because, like T206, so many backs were simply lumped into that category back in the day. Standard Biscuit and Weil Baking pops aren’t perfect either, as they sometimes include the 1917 E135-like cards. Other than pop reports, I am relying on scans–I’ve collected between 1500-1600, but many of those are blank backs, which are unnecessary for the current project.

Because I have used the pop reports, I likely have accounted for most slabbed cards from the major two TPGs, although I am looking for slabbed Sporting News backs. However, the raw cards are often off the radar, and while I have borrowed many of your scans posted here over the years, I know there are lots in collections that have not been shown or that I neglected to capture in my database, and those are what I would really like to see (along with Beckett and GAI cards).

Please, scans of ad-back m101-4 and m101-5s (I need both front and back) would be very helpful!! These include: Altoona Tribune; Block& Kuhl; Burgess-Nash; Everybody’s; Gimbels, Globe; Green-Joyce; Holmes-to-Homes; Indianapolis Brewing; Mall Theatre; Morehouse Baking; Sporting News; Standard Biscuit; Successful Farming, Ware’s Basement and Weil Baking. Thanks in advance.

Great project Todd. Can I assume you have cataloged most of my backs as well as other frequent posters on this board? I am glad to help in any way I can...



http://luckeycards.com/pm101backsmaster2.jpg

[nolemmings]

Thanks Leon. Yes I have used several of your scans--THANKS, but I need to know (and preferably get scans of) who is on the front of those cards. I think your site has some of them, but I know I don't have your Burgess-Nash, Gimbels, Globe, Morehouse, Indy Brewing and Successful Farming.

Add Block & Kuhl and Sporting News to that.

[ScottFandango]

What were the few scans of Famous and Barr's you were missing? I have some highest graded 1 of 2's that were not involved in that near set sale...

[Leon]

Thanks Leon. Yes I have used several of your scans--THANKS, but I need to know (and preferably get scans of) who is on the front of those cards. I think your site has some of them, but I know I don't have your Burgess-Nash, Gimbels, Globe, Morehouse, Indy Brewing and Successful Farming.

Add Block & Kuhl and Sporting News to that.

Sure thing Todd.....I will see what I can do for you....

[nolemmings]

Thanks Leon.

Scott, I don't seem to have (or can't presently find) front-back Famous & Barr scans of Gibson, Hoblitzell, Howard, James, Jones, Lavan, and Schalk from m101-5 and Veach, Vitt and Viox from m101-4. Also any other m101-4 F&Bs that may exist numbered before Turner and after Walker.

I'm kind of anal about having matching scans--I have a couple of slabbed front scans that I don't "count" because I do not have the back to confirm that the grading company got it right--certainly with Sporting News but with F&B also.

[RCMcKenzie]

Todd,

Here are a few that I have. I may be able to find more, but I think the other few are graded. I did not realize until I went to scan these that the Demaree has an upside down back...

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5340/9335798781_58fd5d2e6c_b.jpghttp://farm8.staticflickr.com/7404/9338581220_a155e96db8_b.jpg

[ScottFandango]

Thanks Leon.

Scott, I don't seem to have (or can't presently find) front-back Famous & Barr scans of Gibson, Hoblitzell, Howard, James, Jones, Lavan, and Schalk from m101-5 and Veach, Vitt and Viox from m101-4. Also any other m101-4 F&Bs that may exist numbered before Turner and after Walker.

I'm kind of anal about having matching scans--I have a couple of slabbed front scans that I don't "count" because I do not have the back to confirm that the grading company got it right--certainly with Sporting News but with F&B also.

I have a few of those and will scan them soon for you (back and front:D)

[kdixon]

A few Wheats.

[nolemmings]

Thanks guys. So far, I have confirmed 155 subjects for Weil Baking and 137 for Standard Biscuit. 204 for Famous and Barr.

[ValKehl]

Kenny, just in case you are not aware, your Standard Biscuit-Wheat card is not a 1916 M101 type - rather, it is an E135 type from 1917. The specific ACC designations for these two Standard Biscuit issues are D350-1 for the 1916 cards and D350-2 for the 1917 cards.

Todd, I won this lot of 51 raw Indy Brewing cards http://www.legendaryauctions.com/LotDetail.aspx?inventoryid=73575 in Mastro's August 2007 auction. I subsequently got all but the 7 Washington players graded by SGC, and I have sold/traded most of these over the ensuing years; the remaining graded cards are currently on eBay. I do have scans of many, but not all, of the cards I have sold/traded, and I will gladly scan any of the Washington players you need. So, if you will let me know which, if any, of these 51 Indys you need scans of, I'll do my best to oblige.

Best to you both,
Val

[nolemmings]

Thanks alot Val. I need 26 of them but will check your ebay listings and some scans you sent me a while ago to whittle it down. I know I need the 7 Senators that you may have: 61 Foster, 80 Henry, 93 Judge, 115 McBride, 120 Milan, 126 Morgan and 160 Shanks. I also see that #70 Gowdy was in the lot you won, and I have not confirmed him from the pop reports, so maybe you have that one too? Anyway, if I could get scans of the Washington guys plus Gowdy that would bring the total to 109 Indy Brewing confirmed.

[nolemmings]

Thanks for the responses thus far. Some have contacted me privately as well which is certainly fine by me--I will keep your information to myself,--although I may share ultimate findings, I will not disclose ownership if that is your preference.

[kdixon]

Thanks Val, I was noticing I had two different pictures. Sorry I guess I got in too big of a hurry to post.

[Rob D.]

If you'd like scans of any of the following, just let me know:

Block & Kuhl, Steve O'Neill

The Globe Stores, Terry Turner

Indy Brewing, John Graney

Weil Baking, Steve O'Neill

Gimbels, Bob Roth

Morehouse Baking, Willie Mitchel

Holmes to Homes, Steve O'Neill

[HRBAKER]

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s172/hrbaker/ECm1014GG.jpg (http://s152.photobucket.com/user/hrbaker/media/ECm1014GG.jpg.html)http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s172/hrbaker/ECM1014GGbk.jpg (http://s152.photobucket.com/user/hrbaker/media/ECM1014GGbk.jpg.html)

[nolemmings]

Thanks again guys. I've had a few more contact me privately and I know there are still more out there. Keep 'em coming, por favor.

Rob, I lack scans of all the cards you listed except O'Neill Weil Baking and O'Neill Holmes2Homes. Scans of the rest very much appreciated.

BTW, I've only confirmed 9 Mall Theatres and have scans for 7. Now I know this is a toughie--probably the toughest-- but if anyone out there cares to add to this paltry pop now would be a good time :)

[Leon]

Hey Todd
You know I just picked up (and just signed for at my door :)) the Promo Successful Farming Jackson. But other than that here is what you asked for. If there are others you need let me know asap please.....Thanks for doing this too...

[markf31]

Fantastic research project, especially since a month ago I decided to begin pursuing a -4 and -5 set. I will provide scans for anything I collect moving forward that would seem uncommon.

[Rob D.]

Rob, I lack scans of all the cards you listed except O'Neill Weil Baking and O'Neill Holmes2Homes. Scans of the rest very much appreciated.
 

http://photos.imageevent.com/ineedanap/otherphotos/4-front.jpg
http://photos.imageevent.com/ineedanap/otherphotos/4-rev.jpg
http://photos.imageevent.com/ineedanap/otherphotos/single.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/ineedanap/otherphotos/single-rev.jpg

[nolemmings]

Thanks Leon and Rob. Congrats Leon on that SF Joe Jax promo card--that is a very special card.

[nolemmings]

I entered several dozen cards in the database last night, thanks to many who have contacted me privately. Thus far, here is the tally of confirmed backs

Famous & Barr 204
Herpolsheimer 197
Weil Baking 155
Standard Biscuit 139
Globe Clothing 129
Sporting News 121
Morehouse Baking 114
Indy Brewing 110
Holmes to Homes 75
Gimbels 61
Ware's Basement 40
Altoona Tribune 34
Block & Kuhl 32
Successful Farming 27
Everybody's 23
Green-Joyce 19
Burgess-Nash 17
Mall Theatre 9

[MMarvelli]

Below are the four variations of the back of Everybody's Boys' Clothing Department. Don't mean to turn this thread into a back variation thread, just showing four of the five Everybody's I have.

The differences in the variations are very subtle and probably cant be fully appreciated with such low res scans, but are rather detectable in person. The difference between the Thin and Very Thin can best be seen in the apostrophe. The difference between the Thick and Very Thick can best be seen in the font of 'Boys' Clothing Department'.

107790

George Burns [Very Thin Font]

107791

Donnie Bush [Thin Font]

107793

Shauno Collins [Thick Font]

107795

Bobbie Byrne [Very Thick Font]

[nolemmings]

Thanks for the input. Yes there are back variations, although I'm not into populating them per se right now. There are 3 Gimbels backs--see Leon's post above, 4 Everybody's, and upside down backs confirmed for Successful Farming and Standard Biscuit. Block & Kuhl, Famous & Barr and Herpolsheimer also can all be found with the backs reading top to bottom or bottom to top.

BTW, I do not really discern the differences in your "thick" and "very thick" examples, although my eyes aren't what they used to be. If there is a difference it would make five different backs for Everybody's. There is one missing from your group--I'll try and post scan later but it can be seen on the Old Cardboard site under m101 back "Gallery of all known backs"--it's the one far right.

The way I use to tell these apart is to look at the "E". If both the top and bottom serifs point out at about 45 degree angles, that's one type back (it also has a very broad middle serif). This is the one lacking from the four above. If just the bottom serif points out at that angle and the top and middle "stems" extend the same distance, that's type two (also has long apostrophe, if you're unsure). The third appears to have the top and bottom serifs pointing more directly straight and the middle stem is shortest (also has short-tailed apostrophe if you're unsure). The fourth just has a thicker font by far throughout and is easily distinguished from the others by that feature.

Hope that helps.

[ScottFandango]

May have one more you need after these...I'll post it if I find it...cool project!

http://i.imgur.com/q78HnuP.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/4s23zrO.jpg

[nolemmings]

Thank you Scott, and the 3-4 others who have sent me scans privately since I last posted in this thread.

For those of you who like back runs, I have compiled a list of all subjects who so far have 10 or more different m101-4/5 ad backs confirmed. (this excludes blank backs) This list will grow as I receive more data, as many are at 8 or 9 now and I still need Sporting News scans. Anyway, here goes:

13 backs: Joe Tinker
12 backs: Joe Jackson
11 backs: Charles Commiskey
Gavvy Cravath
Babe Ruth
George Stallings
Hans Wagner
Clarence Walker
10 backs: Grover Alexander
Leon Ames
Eddie Burns
Geo J. Burns
Jimmy Callahan
George Chalmers
Eddie Collins
Geo. Moriarty
Nap Rucker
Dick Rudolph
Ray Schalk
Everett Scott
Burt Shotton
Billy Sullivan
Carl Weilman

Finally, if you can add to my Sporting News scan collection, I would appreciate front-back scans of any of the following:
AGNEW, SAM 2
AINSMITH, EDDIE 3
ARCHER, JIMMY 6
BANCROFT, DAVE 10
BARRY, JACK 11
BECK, ZINN 12
BESCHER, BOB 15
BURNS, GEORGE 19
BURNS, GEO. J 20
BUSH, "DONIE" 22
CALDWELL, RAY 27
CHALMERS, GEORGE 29
CHAPMAN, RAY 30
CLARKE, TOM 33
COMISKEY, CHARLES 36
CONNOLLY, JOE 37
COVELESKIE, HARRY 39
CRAWFORD, SAM 41
DAUBERT, JAKE 43
DEMAREE, AL 45
DOAK, WILLIAM 47
DONOVAN, BILL 48
DUBUC, JEAN 52
FELSCH, "HAP" 56
FLACK, MAX 59
FLETCHER, ART 60
FOSTER, EDDIE 61
FOURNIER, JACQUES 62
GAINER, DEL 63
GANDIL "CHIC" 64
GETZ, GUS 67
GIBSON, GEO. 68
GOOD, WILBUR 69
GRANEY, JOHN 71
GRIFFITH, TOM 73
GROH, HEINIE 74
HAMILTON, EARL 75
HARMON, BOB 76
HARTZELL, ROY 77
HENDRIX, CLAUDE 78
HENRIKSEN, OLAF 79
HENRY, JOHN 80
HOBLITZELL, DICK 83
HUGGINS, MILLER 86
JANVRIN, HAROLD 89
JENNINGS, HUGH 90
KILLEFER, WM. JR. 95
LAVENDER, JIMMY 100
LEONARD, H. B. 102
LOBERT, HANS 104
MAMAUX, AL. 110
MERKLE, FRED 118
MEYERS, CHIEF 119
MILAN, CLYDE 120
MILLER, OTTO 122
MYERS, "HY" 131
NIEHOFF, J.A. 132
ROTH, BOB 145
RUCKER, "NAP" 148
SAIER, VIC 152
SCHULTE, FRANK 156
SCOTT, EVERETT 157
SEATON, TOM 159
SHORE, ERNIE 162
SMITH, J. CARLISLE 165
STANAGE, OSCAR 168
STOCK, MILTON 170
TONEY, FRED 175
VEACH, BOB 179
WAMBGANSS, W. 185
WHITTED, GEO. 189
WILSON, ART 191
WILSON, J. OWEN 192
WINGO, IVY 193
WOOD, JOE 195
YOUNG, "PEP" 197
ZIMMERMAN, HEINY 199

As always, I am grateful for the help.
~todd

[buymycards]

Hi Todd,
You probably have these already, but I will put the scans up anyway just in case.

Rick

[nolemmings]

Thanks Rick. I did not have the Marquard scan, and the others were nicer/larger than what I already had so I used them too--besides I like to track ownership. BTW, I have confirmed 158/200 Weil Baking cards--nearly 80% of a virtual set. I know there are many more out there--it's the raw ones that fly under the radar, since they're not in the pop reports.

Don't be shy boys and girls--I need whatever scans of m101-4 and m101-5 ad backs you care to share. I continue to greatly appreciate your help.

[ErikV]

Hope these scans can help.

ErikV

[Mark]

I've got two more Gimbels, but they aren't where they are supposed to be. But I have got these on hand:

[nolemmings]

Continued thanks guys. Check those raw cards--I know there's more out there.

Here's one I've owned for many years but don't believe I have posted before.
http://photos.imageevent.com/imoverhere/mym101s/backsmalltheatre/huge/16m1014strunk2.jpg

[TheBig6]

Heres a couple Todd, The Walsh is mislabeled
Love the Mall Theatre, it has the perfect home for sure
http://photos.imageevent.com/ruckers/cardbacks/websize/walsh.jpg
http://photos.imageevent.com/ruckers/cardbacks/websize/weilshuggins.jpg