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bobbyw8469
01-27-2013, 07:01 PM
Just an observation. I believe the influx of new members to the Net54 boards is caused in a major way by the downfall of the PSA boards. Everyone gets so tired of the soapboxing and name calling. That board has really gone downhill since I first joined many years ago. I am so thankful none of that goes on over here.....

CMIZ5290
01-27-2013, 07:05 PM
Just an observation. I believe the influx of new members to the Net54 boards is caused in a major way by the downfall of the PSA boards. Everyone gets so tired of the soapboxing and name calling. That board has really gone downhill since I first joined many years ago. I am so thankful none of that goes on over here.....

Bobby- are you being serious or sarcastic? I hope the later....

whitehse
01-27-2013, 07:30 PM
Bobby- are you being serious or sarcastic? I hope the later....

I agree with this statement.

I just hope that those fleeing the CU boards who have been the cause of their own issues understand it is a whole new world here. And I am not just talking about one poster in particular......

bobbyw8469
01-27-2013, 08:55 PM
I'm being serious.....all the things I am accused of over there. I am guilty of NONE of them...if Leon will allow me to, I can post something once and for all to get rid of all this bashing.

CMIZ5290
01-27-2013, 09:05 PM
Bobby- I wasn't referring to you personally, I'm sorry. I have no clue what goes on with the PSA board or anything pertaining you. I was referring to things that are said on our board, where at times, bashing does go on whether we like it or not...

Leon
01-27-2013, 09:15 PM
I'm being serious.....all the things I am accused of over there. I am guilty of NONE of them...if Leon will allow me to, I can post something once and for all to get rid of all this bashing.

I would prefer not to bring other venue's issues over here....but it's an open board.

Blackie
01-27-2013, 09:19 PM
I must agree with Bobby and must also say ive known Bobby since 2005 and have had several successful transactions, talks, trades and baseball collecting help with him. He is one of the last "class act" guys over on those boards. Welcome Bobby! And hope to hear more from ya brother.

TNP777
01-27-2013, 09:21 PM
sigh

Wow. Just... wow.

Sorry, Leon. I'll do my best to be a good boy. There's a good vibe here, and I'm grateful to be a part of it.

Fred
01-27-2013, 09:25 PM
Let me see... it's a PSA board... Something with those three letters indicates that it can't be a quality board like this one...

PSA = Posts Supervised Always
PSA = Petty Superficial Authority

There have been times in the past where things got a bit crazy and the ensuing train wrecks have been somewhat spectacular on this board... but overall, it's a great board.

bobbyw8469
01-27-2013, 09:29 PM
Geordie....you just don't know....I take alot over there. And am not the most eloquent at speaking when I get riled up. I can squash all this crap once and for all. All you got to do is ask.

Deertick
01-27-2013, 09:34 PM
Leon,
Is there a way to bookmark a thread? ;)

HRBAKER
01-27-2013, 09:35 PM
Board Drama Quotient on the rise.

bobbyw8469
01-27-2013, 09:36 PM
The ironic things is....I am one of the most honest and trustyworthy members of the board. I laugh out loud alot when I read all the stuff about me. But I have heard it for YEARS now.....it gets old alot....especially when it isn't true.

Griffins
01-27-2013, 09:36 PM
Bobby, from my impartial observation, you've deserved all you've gotten and a lot more. My advice is to start fresh here and don't bring that negativity and questionable ethics over here- you were a large part of the problem.
Everyone deserves a fresh start in a new venue.

TNP777
01-27-2013, 09:37 PM
I'm sure I don't know all, Bobby. I've seen a good part of it, though, and my opinion is that a large part could have been diffused if you were willing to step back and be objective and admit that maybe, just maybe, you might be wrong.

Exhibit 1: the Milton Bradley thread.

There's no doubt you've taken a beating on CU, and probably more than you deserve. Some of that abuse has been self inflicted, though. For you to insinuate that everyone else is to blame is just not believable.

That's my opinion, and I'm sticking to it.

bobbyw8469
01-27-2013, 09:40 PM
All...Milton Bradley....let's talk......If I show you a group of twenty cards (in rows of 10 - one Milton Bradley and one Topps). I let you pick 20 of your most 'knowledgable' collectors. How many people do you think would get 100% on the quiz? How many do you think would get 80% on the quiz? You might be surprised that more people would fail than pass.

lsutigers1973
01-27-2013, 09:44 PM
The ironic things is....I am one of the most honest and trustyworthy members of the board. I laugh out loud alot when I read all the stuff about me. But I have heard it for YEARS now.....it gets old alot....especially when it isn't true.

The ironic thing is.......that you have been called out numerous times for various perceived wrong doings not to mention flat out being wrong and refusing to accept it. Then there's the constant name calling and belittling others. Plus the Milton Bradley thread. Plus the '55 Mays that you not only knew was trimmed but had mentioned it in another thread. Then you completely deny having knowledge of it being trimmed when you get called out months later. I could go on for hours but I will digress.

I will give you credit for one thing, once you make a stance you never change that stance or bury your head in the sands like some others do. You will continue to argue with knowledgeable collectors even after they have proven you wrong.

Sean1125
01-27-2013, 09:50 PM
Guys.

Stop.

bobbyw8469
01-27-2013, 09:51 PM
Plus the '55 Mays that you not only knew was trimmed but had mentioned it in another thread. Then you completely deny having knowledge of it being trimmed when you get called out months later. I could go on for hours but I will digress.


Ah....Bill....you've been banned from PSA.....so let's talk about WIllie Mays here....

Bobbyw8469....I hate you!! You TRIMMED CARDS!!

A) False. I have never trimmed a card. I don't know how. Too honest for that. I have also never KNOWINGLY sold trimmed cards.

Well.....what about the 1955 Bowman Willie Mays??

A). Ahh...the Mays. I bought that one raw from TriplePlayVintage off of Ebay. I sent it in to PSA for grading. They rejected it as trimmed. I threw away the rejection flip (as I used to do in the past), and put it in my raw 'trouble' pile. Then cards in my trouble pile got scattered with my normal cards. I honestly forgot all about it until I come across it. I sold it on Ebay raw. The winning bidder sent it into PSA and it got rejected as 'trimmed'. I refunded the buyer. I then sold it on Ebay WITH the rejection Card Saver and it sold. The winning bidder sent it in to BVG where it achieved a high number grade. So is the card trimmed or not? I know it now resides with a numeric grade. And the argument of one grading company saying a card is trimmed and another grading card company saying a card is good has been going on long before I got into the hobby, and will continue to go on if and when I leave this hobby. That is also another argument altogether. Next?

Added: I learned alot after dealing with that Mays. I learned not to throw away the rejection card saver. I keep the cards into those savers until I dispose of them. Check out the recent 1960 Aaron, 1962 Aaron and 1962 Mays I sold as trimmed. I do hope the winning bidder is able to get them into holders. It won't be me. Ok.....next?

TNP777
01-27-2013, 09:54 PM
All...Milton Bradley....let's talk......If I show you a group of twenty cards (in rows of 10 - one Milton Bradley and one Topps). I let you pick 20 of your most 'knowledgable' collectors. How many people do you think would get 100% on the quiz? How many do you think would get 80% on the quiz? You might be surprised that more people would fail than pass.
See, this response shows me and anyone else that witnessed or participated in that thread that you still don't get it.

We were never talking about 20 cards in two rows of 10. We were talking about one card. One card that even to a layman was obvious that it wasn't a MB. I don't know why you continue to deflect the conversation elsewhere. I'm not a MB expert and have never claimed to be one. However, there's no question in anyone's mind that your card was just a plain ol' Topps.

Whatever. Back to the sidelines for me.

Sean1125
01-27-2013, 09:55 PM
I tried.

Leon
01-27-2013, 09:58 PM
Ok, so there won't be too many of this type of thread so no one has to PM me about it. Moderation.
Now that being said, everyone who gives any opinion, at all, needs to have their name in their post. First and last name. If that is not good then edit your commentary out. This pertains to everyone in this thread (and is a rule anyway). I think this might be the biggest difference in this forum and the one being discussed. No anonymity when arguing or belittling :) someone. If you want to just talk about cards then your name can be private, only known to moderators. Also, anymore arguments from other venues, will need to be in the correct forum here. In other words, I would prefer not to have those issues brought here whatsoever, but if they are, and our rules are followed, then those threads should be in the correct forum (post war if that is how they originated over there) on this site. And lastly it bears reiterating what a few other board members have said. We are a different group. It would be wise to hang out a while and get the general orientation..... Same rules for everyone (no one reads them but still...) and they are posted. Carry on.....

TNP777
01-27-2013, 10:02 PM
http://cardboardtalk.net/images/smilies/face-icon-small-blush.gif

Sorry, Leon.

bobbyw8469
01-27-2013, 10:03 PM
I'm sorry too. I have just been attacked for so long. If anyone wants to hear what REALLY happened, all they have to do is ask me. I am farrrrr from the monster everyone makes me out to be

the-illini
01-27-2013, 10:06 PM
What does this thread have to do with vintage cards?

bobbyw8469
01-27-2013, 10:07 PM
The illni fan, I don't think the title of the thread has ANYTHING to do with vintage cards. The title of this thead was "the downfall of the PSA message board"? If it was about vintage cards, the title would have read (check out my 1951 Bowman Mantle). Not trying to be a smartass here, but come on......

HRBAKER
01-27-2013, 10:07 PM
What does this thread have to do with vintage cards?

Maybe we need a separate forum for carryover PSA Board feuds. :eek:

HasselhoffsCheeseburger
01-27-2013, 10:10 PM
If you run into an a-hole in the morning, then, unfortunately, you ran into an a-hole. If you run into a-holes all day long, then you're the a-hole.

TNP777
01-27-2013, 10:11 PM
Maybe we need a separate forum for carryover PSA Board feuds. :eek:
That. Would. Be. Awesome.

http://cardboardtalk.net/images/smilies/face-icon-small-happy.gif

Here's one of the favorite cards in my collection. NOW it's a vintage conversation. ;)

http://home.comcast.net/~dodgergeo/dodgercollection/prewar/Goudey/goudeyodoul.jpg

drmondobueno
01-27-2013, 10:14 PM
Wow. Learned a LOT about Prewar cards. Thanx a LOT, guys.

bobbyw8469
01-27-2013, 10:15 PM
If you run into an a-hole in the morning, then, unfortunately, you ran into an a-hole. If you run into a-holes all day long, then you're the a-hole.

Now I joined this forum for healthy arguments and rebuttals. If you want to resort to name calling, why dont you just mozie on over to the PSA message board. I never resorted to name calling - that fact that you are shows your mentality.

bobbyw8469
01-27-2013, 10:17 PM
OK....Im gone.....if anyone wants want to ask me anything, I will be more than happy to answer them. Sorry won't respond to name calling. Keep that stuff in grade school, ok? Take care.

the-illini
01-27-2013, 10:38 PM
The illni fan, I don't think the title of the thread has ANYTHING to do with vintage cards. The title of this thead was "the downfall of the PSA message board"? If it was about vintage cards, the title would have read (check out my 1951 Bowman Mantle). Not trying to be a smartass here, but come on......

This isn't my board, but actually there is a separate area for cards issued post 1941; so even your vintage topic would be off-topic.

Griffins
01-27-2013, 10:42 PM
The unfortunate thing is that everytime a board closes down, the baggage from that board gets carried over. Beckett closed down and it dragged down the PSA board, PSA has brought in a moderator again (like they did in '04) that killed it, but hopefully it won't drag down this board.
New board, new start. Don't bitch about what happened elsewhere.

thenavarro
01-27-2013, 10:52 PM
I'm sorry too. I have just been attacked for so long. If anyone wants to hear what REALLY happened, all they have to do is ask me. I am farrrrr from the monster everyone makes me out to be

I like Bobby (except when we are playing fantasy football), therefore I'll ask the question so you can tell whatever it is that you want to tell.

What REALLY happened? (and I don't even know what topic I'm asking about but have at it)

Mike

Fred
01-27-2013, 10:53 PM
Can someone please summarize what just happened in this thread? :confused:

T205 GB
01-27-2013, 10:56 PM
Maybe we need a separate forum for carryover PSA Board feuds. :eek:

I concur.

bobbyw8469
01-27-2013, 10:57 PM
LOL! Mike, if you don't know by now, I can't fill you in...lol.....hope you are doing well. I am sorry that you quit your signed rookie card thread. I was glad I was able to help out in what little way I could.....

thenavarro
01-27-2013, 11:07 PM
LOL! Mike, if you don't know by now, I can't fill you in...lol.....hope you are doing well. I am sorry that you quit your signed rookie card thread. I was glad I was able to help out in what little way I could.....

The collect-a-holic in me is getting to me though. I'm supposed to be saving the proceeds but yet I find myself venturing back into Presidential autographs again. Been eyeing an Abraham Lincoln signed check that I'm very close to sealing the deal on, should have a JFK graph in my mailbox in a couple days, and toying with a deal on a JFK signed Profiles in Courage. I haven't been posting a lot on CU lately cause I'm sick of seeing that Bama avatar from my avatar bet, LOL. Only 10 more days to go ;)

TNP777
01-27-2013, 11:12 PM
The collect-a-holic in me is getting to me though. I'm supposed to be saving the proceeds but yet I find myself venturing back into Presidential autographs again. Been eyeing an Abraham Lincoln signed check that I'm very close to sealing the deal on, should have a JFK graph in my mailbox in a couple days, and toying with a deal on a JFK signed Profiles in Courage. I haven't been posting a lot on CU lately cause I'm sick of seeing that Bama avatar from my avatar bet, LOL. Only 10 more days to go ;)
That bet should have had a condition in it that required the loser to log at least 10 posts a day!

yankeeno7
01-27-2013, 11:32 PM
Im happy this thread didnt turn into auction shilling :)

esd10
01-27-2013, 11:41 PM
i dont go onto psa boards or really any other forums for sports cards but i hope that what ever was going on over there doesnt start on this board. i really like the collectors on this board for the most part they are very helpful and great to get info from. i hope that this board will stay the same with like minded collectors helping each other and none of the bull crap i hear on other about on other forums and i know that leon and other moderators wont put up with the crap.

chaddurbin
01-28-2013, 12:02 AM
the "psa board" is like some inside joke that only 5 people get. most here could care less about CU or what goes on there (or anything happening after 1942). on the other side i don't think most CU members can differentiate a '14 CJ from a '15...so i'm not sure what the mass exodus over here would accomplish? :confused:

maybe you guys can go post on the postware side and beef it up.

70ToppsFanatic
01-28-2013, 12:06 AM
i dont go onto psa boards or really any other forums for sports cards but i hope that what ever was going on over there doesnt start on this board. i really like the collectors on this board for the most part they are very helpful and great to get info from. i hope that this board will stay the same with like minded collectors helping each other and none of the bull crap i hear on other about on other forums and i know that leon and other moderators wont put up with the crap.

There are many like-minded, great people here and over on the CU boards. Sadly, there are always a few people in every bunch that allow the anonymity of the internet to go to their head and we start to see personal attacks and all sorts of unnecessary ugliness. It will never be completely eliminated, but my faith is in the vast majority of decent people who know how to behave in a civilized manner.

Cheers

Dave

sdkammeyer
01-28-2013, 12:12 AM
the "psa board" is like some inside joke that only 5 people get. most here could care less about CU or what goes on there (or anything happening after 1942). on the other side i don't think most CU members can differentiate a '14 CJ from a '15...so i'm not sure what the mass exodus over here would accomplish? :confused:

maybe you guys can go post on the postware side and beef it up.

+1

bubblebathgirl
01-28-2013, 12:22 AM
There are many like-minded, great people here and over on the CU boards. Sadly, there are always a few people in every bunch that allow the anonymity of the internet to go to their head and we start to see personal attacks and all sorts of unnecessary ugliness. It will never be completely eliminated, but my faith is in the vast majority of decent people who know how to behave in a civilized manner.

Cheers

Dave


Very well said.

IMO, the PSA boards are actually stronger than ever now that they've laid down the law on proper behavior. Basically act like an adult and you'll be treated as such - same as on here, or any board for that matter.

I'm still very much contributing there and I simply want to augment my own fun with this hobby by posting here also. I think there will be some, particularly those who got in trouble with CU or kicked off, that will be badmouthing PSA here ... that's to be expected. But in general, most people there and here seem to have a degree of decency to them that I think will keep this hobby fun.

TNP777
01-28-2013, 12:27 AM
the "psa board" is like some inside joke that only 5 people get. most here could care less about CU or what goes on there (or anything happening after 1942). on the other side i don't think most CU members can differentiate a '14 CJ from a '15...so i'm not sure what the mass exodus over here would accomplish?if they don't know, perhaps some/most will stick around long enough to learn. Unless you fell out of bed one day and suddenly knew all there was to know about CJs, you had a learning curve, too. ;)

Drama ebbs and flows in any online community. This isn't the first time acrimony from CU has spilled over here and it won't be the last. It has already been pointed out that there is a new mod on CU, and he/she is being very aggressive in enforcing the recently posted Forum Rules. There was a wave of bannings on Tuesday (that I myself was temporarily caught up in), and I'm sure there will be more. That is going to lead to mode new members seeking a place where there is a little more latitude. Some will quickly find this isn't the place for them, while others will stick around and learn new things.

As anyone can see, I joined back in '09, mostly to finish my T206 Superbas set. Once I finished I stopped coming around. When I got hit with the banhammer on Tuesday, I came back on to check things out. I quickly joined a few discussions and started learning. I'm glad I did. I plan/hope to stick around and become more knowledgable about prewar. Be patient with me and other CU refugees - we're not all bad seeds.

Geordie

jcmtiger
01-28-2013, 12:30 AM
Maybe we need a separate forum for carryover PSA Board feuds. :eek:

I agree, this is for vintage cards, not carry over arguments from another board.

Maybe these discussions should be moved to the chat room???

Anyone want to talk about Old Judge or T206?

Joe

Leon
01-28-2013, 12:37 AM
I agree, this is for vintage cards, not carry over arguments from another board.

Maybe these discussions should be moved to the chat room???

Anyone want to talk about Old Judge or T206?

Joe


This is one thread Joe. It won't spill over into others.

pariah1107
01-28-2013, 12:41 AM
Not to overstep my bounds Leon... I am sick of this! There is more to talk about than baseball cards, though not here. If you are looking for intellectual freedom leave your basements. This was an open forum for discussion of baseball history and/or cards, period. Not the 2nd amendment, mental health, criminal/justice system. Please don't make it more....

Please blackball me from this site. I officially resign.

teetwoohsix
01-28-2013, 04:45 AM
Here's some cards :D

sdkammeyer
01-28-2013, 05:21 AM
Here's some cards :D

I'll second that .... never gonna pass up the chance to see/show some cards.
Good porn there Clayton! :) :) :)

bobbyw8469
01-28-2013, 05:25 AM
Not to overstep my bounds Leon... I am sick of this!

You need to have your WHOLE name in the thread Ty. Not just your first name. Even I know that, the most basic board rule here there is! Again, I don't mean no disrespect, but if you don't like the topic, stay out of the thread. You can learn alot just by reading the title of the thread. If the thread was about baseball cards, then the title of the thread would read 'Check out my T205 Rube Marquard'. (insert card here)..

http://img2.sellersourcebook.com/users/73693/dsp_img924.jpg?1359085658

To make a point, I don't like the home shopping network. My cable box has loads of those channels. I am not going to sit and watch the channels and then complain about it. I simply don't tune in to those channels. On a forum, you can choose what threads to go in to and read. You chose to look at this thread. You probably shouldn't complain when you chose to come in this thread on your own accord. There are alot of good members on the PSA boards (me included), that can and will contribute to this site. All we need is a chance.

sdkammeyer
01-28-2013, 05:56 AM
I am pretty sure, that in a crude jest, we were attempting to make light of the subject and ingest a bit of subliminal humor. No harm, no foul.

There have been many threads in the past couple of days about the Exodus from the CU boards, and really ........ it is what it is.

This is the internet and things move faster than "real time" as we know it.

Personally, and I hope to substantially humble myself here, I love this forum and everyone here. I feel no ill will at all. I know that many members feel that this is their "online card family" and I 100% respect that. I, as a newbie, can only hope that someday I will be accepted into that family. Respect is the magical word in that sentence.

This isn't a place to b*tch and complain about the same things over and over again. I'm new and already tired of it. No I don't have to "read" it .... but I have to see it if I want to see net54 at all.

abothebear
01-28-2013, 11:16 AM
Bobby,

The point about the topic isn't about your title. It is the category you posted it in. This is the pre-war forum. Your topic is more appropriate for the water cooler forum. or maybe the post war forum if you want to talk about the specific card issues you had over there. Your title and topic are fine, it is just living in the wrong place.

I know some people don't care for these kinds of topics but I enjoy them in their place. I can be naive and reading about these conflicts helps me have a better understanding of an aspect of the hobby I am ignorant of due to the very few transactions I am personally involved in.

I hope you have a better experience here. If you take it slow, and keep your head down, you will win friends over time. I find that vigorously defending myself rarely achieves what I hope it will achieve. I know the temptation is overwhelming to clear your name, but the truth will bear out over time. Don't get baited into responding to every grumpy comment. You will lose even when you win. I have been arguing on the internet for 10 years, and silence, though it is the hardest argument for me to make, is almost always my best argument.

Runscott
01-28-2013, 12:19 PM
I'll second that .... never gonna pass up the chance to see/show some cards.
Good porn there Clayton! :) :) :)

Steve, is your Cobb in an 'Auth' holder? It looks seriously manipulated on the bottom border, but my eyes aren't so great.

Scott <=== starting new, vintage, this-board drama

lsutigers1973
01-28-2013, 01:14 PM
If you have to go to an almost anonymous forum and tell everyone how good of a guy you are, you probably aren't.

So you do not say I'm hiding behind a keyboard:

Bill Holler
2401 E. Travis St
Marshall, TX 75672
https://www.facebook.com/bill.holler.5
Twitter: Bill_Holler73
www.maverickbowling.com
Kik.com: m_bowling

Runscott
01-28-2013, 01:19 PM
If you have to go to an almost anonymous forum and tell everyone how good of a guy you are, you probably aren't.


Here's a good bit of wisdom for Bobby (of course, not from me), especially given all the recent 'Hey, LOOK AT ME!' threads:

You are just an extra in everyone else's play

Of course, you probably have a more important role in your family member's individual plays, but that's really about it. If you disappeared from a forum, 99.9% of the members would forget about you within a couple of weeks.

Leon
01-28-2013, 01:31 PM
If you have to go to an almost anonymous forum and tell everyone how good of a guy you are, you probably aren't.

So you do not say I'm hiding behind a keyboard:

Bill Holler
2401 E. Travis St
Marshall, TX 75672
https://www.facebook.com/bill.holler.5
Twitter: Bill_Holler73
www.maverickbowling.com
Kik.com: m_bowling

My wife is from Naples TX.....we go through Marshall when we go to the boats. Also, I think we go there to see some pretty cool Christmas lights, sometimes, too. Nice neck of the Piney Woods......

bobbyw8469
01-28-2013, 01:49 PM
Bill.....since you must throw stones, let's chunk a couple your way? Just why/how did you get kicked off the PSA boards again?

Not trying to be a smartass....I really don't know, and I would like to know.

I've heard rumors it involved a bogus autograph but I want to hear it from you.

Taxman
01-28-2013, 01:58 PM
If you have to go to an almost anonymous forum and tell everyone how good of a guy you are, you probably aren't.

So you do not say I'm hiding behind a keyboard:

Bill Holler
2401 E. Travis St
Marshall, TX 75672
https://www.facebook.com/bill.holler.5
Twitter: Bill_Holler73
www.maverickbowling.com
Kik.com: m_bowling

Bill you moved since the big find or long Uhaul drive...You sure do look like Tickle from the TV show Moonshiners.

whitehse
01-28-2013, 02:38 PM
Bill.....since you must throw stones, let's chunk a couple your way? Just why/how did you get kicked off the PSA boards again?

Not trying to be a smartass....I really don't know, and I would like to know.

I've heard rumors it involved a bogus autograph but I want to hear it from you.

Bobby....In case you didnt get the drift from many other board members.....nobody wants to hear about crap that is spilling over from other boards. Why do you just take this to PM or better yet, Bill has given you his contact information. Call him and clear the air instead of clogging up these boards with this nonsense.

rjackson44
01-28-2013, 02:40 PM
leon wont ever allow that ;)

sdkammeyer
01-28-2013, 02:45 PM
steve, is your cobb in an 'auth' holder? It looks seriously manipulated on the bottom border, but my eyes aren't so great.


psa 3

pepis
01-28-2013, 02:56 PM
psa 3
That Cobb looks better than most 4 or 5s even if it has a light crease
or any problem in the back the eye appeal is vey nice

sdkammeyer
01-28-2013, 02:59 PM
That Cobb looks better than most 4 or 5s even if it has a light crease
or any problem in the back the eye appeal is vey nice

Thank you very much. It truly is a beautiful card. I am considering crossing it over.

lsutigers1973
01-28-2013, 03:03 PM
Bill.....since you must throw stones, let's chunk a couple your way? Just why/how did you get kicked off the PSA boards again?

Not trying to be a smartass....I really don't know, and I would like to know.

I've heard rumors it involved a bogus autograph but I want to hear it from you.


After a warning or two from Carol, i posted a picture of Craig from his Facebook profile ONLY after he did the same. I got banned, he didn't.

The ONE auto in question was a Wilt Chamberlain auto that was included in a medium size collection that I bought on the BST board on CU. It was pulled from eBay once I was informed of his questionable authenticity. Card was sent to PSA and deemed a fake and eventually destroyed by Mike Navarro at my request.

Anything else?

EDIT TO ADD: Yes I moved about 30 miles west from Shreveport. Bought a bowling and now live here in Marshall.

Leon I apologize for continuing this childish thread, but once again, my integrity was questioned. Stop by and say hello next time you pass through.

pepis
01-28-2013, 03:24 PM
Thank you very much. It truly is a beautiful card. I am considering crossing it over.

Is your card and i enjoy looking at it! and i think that is the important thing
that you enjoy and cherish it! i have something similar here it is;

bcbgcbrcb
01-28-2013, 03:29 PM
WOW. 68 posts in less than 24 hours and "T206" was not even included in the title.......

CMIZ5290
01-28-2013, 03:34 PM
Bobby- Just out of curiousity, are you looking to sell any T206s? Sorry Phil, I couldn't resist....:D

teetwoohsix
01-28-2013, 03:39 PM
WOW. 68 posts in less than 24 hours and "T206" was not even included in the title.......

True, but we managed to sneak a few in there :D

Beautiful Cobb Steve !!! Love that card :)

Carry on folks....

Sincerely, Clayton

bobbyw8469
01-28-2013, 03:58 PM
Bobby- Just out of curiousity, are you looking to sell any T206s? Sorry Phil, I couldn't resist....


I have a couple. They look like they are cut funny, and I have no idea what to ask for them, as they aren't my area of expertise. Should I put them on the live auction thread?

Runscott
01-28-2013, 04:01 PM
I have a couple. They look like they are cut funny, and I have no idea what to ask for them, as they aren't my area of expertise. Should I put them on the live auction thread?

No, you should study them intently for about three days - do nothing else other than eat and maybe some calisthenics. You can also take incoming calls, but only from family members.

bobbyw8469
01-28-2013, 04:06 PM
You can also take incoming calls, but only from family members.

I have no family, and I refuse to stare at a T206 that long. I will put them on Ebay...will send a link when I do.

sdkammeyer
01-28-2013, 04:06 PM
No, you should study them intently for about three days - do nothing else other than eat and maybe some calisthenics. You can also take incoming calls, but only from family members.

I can't stop smiling :D

Runscott
01-28-2013, 04:13 PM
I can't stop smiling :D

shhhh - he's off creating ebay listings.

ullmandds
01-28-2013, 04:50 PM
Personally...along with the downfall of the PSA boards...I hope the downfall of PSA follows!!!!!:)

Matthew H
01-28-2013, 04:53 PM
Personally...along with the downfall of the PSA boards...I hope the downfall of PSA follows!!!!!:)

I dream of a world where we all buy and sell cards in top loaders.

1all
01-28-2013, 04:57 PM
...and sold to kids in a pack of cigarettes... Ah those were the days. ;)

Non-Troublemaking refuge here....Cheers! -Doug

ullmandds
01-28-2013, 04:59 PM
Matt...those days are gone forever...I'd be very happy with accurate...unbiased grading myself!!!!!

Matthew H
01-28-2013, 05:59 PM
Question for all the new members: What's your favorite background color on a T206?

Sean1125
01-28-2013, 06:00 PM
If you have to go to an almost anonymous forum and tell everyone how good of a guy you are, you probably aren't.

So you do not say I'm hiding behind a keyboard:

Bill Holler
2401 E. Travis St
Marshall, TX 75672
https://www.facebook.com/bill.holler.5
Twitter: Bill_Holler73
www.maverickbowling.com
Kik.com: m_bowling

I will need your social security number and credit card numbers to verify you are who you say you are.

bobbyw8469
01-28-2013, 06:29 PM
Anything else?


Sure....what happened on Ebay with all those silver proof coins?

added info: On 2nd thought, I am gonna bail you out here. You don't have to answer that. The 5th amendment protects you from that. All I am going to say to you, is how dare you chunk rocks at me for my "sins", if you can even call them that, when you have wayyyyyyyyyyyy more glass windows in your house than I do. I have explained my actions. You don't have to say anything else to me. But I am like a boy scout compared to you!

I am going to take Sean's advice now and let this thread die. Everyone take care.

OTWCards
01-28-2013, 08:42 PM
Just in from the department of redundancy department . . . This is like deja vu all over again!

The Cliff-notes version will soon be available as an iBook download. Please check back after Page 12.

nam812
01-29-2013, 08:51 AM
As per Net54 rules, my name in Ni.ck Mu.nafo

Here's a old thread I started on CU to show some of bobby's "high moral character"

http://forums.collectors.com/messageview.cfm?catid=11&threadid=788421

ullmandds
01-29-2013, 09:04 AM
Perhaps A new message board Should be created for all of these PSA refugees?

rainier2004
01-29-2013, 09:09 AM
Is this the January pick up thread?

Leon
01-29-2013, 09:30 AM
Perhaps A new message board Should be created for all of these PSA refugees?

It's one thread, I don't think a new board is needed for one thread. I hope we convert some of them to Pre-WWII but most of their talk is poppage and ripping packs, which is fine, but not really our main game. I already see it dying down and there are some really good conversations going on, on the front page. Can you tell I am beating my drum?

http://luckeycards.com/pt206drum.jpg

Taxman
01-29-2013, 09:51 AM
As per Net54 rules, my name in Ni.ck Mu.nafo

Here's a old thread I started on CU to show some of bobby's "high moral character"

http://forums.collectors.com/messageview.cfm?catid=11&threadid=788421

Now I know why you always come out "smelling" like a Burberry rose. Interesting

bobbyw8469
01-29-2013, 10:09 AM
I have already responded about the Mays, Nick. I think you need to reread this whole thread. You are arriving a little late to the party. Nothing new to see here boys.

Taxman
01-29-2013, 10:13 AM
Bobby that comment was directed towards Nam. Google search will explain it.

eomint
01-29-2013, 11:05 AM
This is my first post on these boards, I have been a member of the CU forums for many years and a collector of high end vintage. I have read the Net54 forums for a # of years, observing only...some of the posts are informative and in the true spirit of educating and sharing...others, such as this one bashing PSA, just serve to undermine the very hobby we all theoretically find so special.

I am a realist and not a sentimentalist, and good debate is valuable, I didnt even mind when people were questioning if I overpaid for the 55 Clemente 10, maybe I did and maybe I didnt, only time will tell. But most collectors, regardless of what they collect, wouldnt buy something if that something didnt have higher utility for them than the money/opportunity cost. And I think it's worth contemplating that and trying to be respectful of it.

PSA is the standard and clear market share leader in what they do. They are human and therefore mistakes can and will be made, but that does not mean that there is willful deceit or malice, I think David Hall, Joe, etc have always tried to do the right thing. Food companies have recalls, Tylenol had a big recall/scandal many years ago that has become an HBS case study in how to deal with crisis, and the bottom line is that while no entity is perfect, the way such entity handles tough issues or mistakes, admitting them, taking responsibility, offering to indemnify people, etc. is what determines longevity and whether any brand, including PSA, has enduring value.

I've really enjoyed the commradery of the CU boards and hope that Net54 will also continue to evolve into a forum for constructive dialogue about the hobby.

EOMINT

Runscott
01-29-2013, 11:15 AM
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-2nfDbIoYvFc/UOZP2dGZXrI/AAAAAAAAANg/LR4jeVdF7jU/s1600/jump_off_cliff.jpeg

HRBAKER
01-29-2013, 11:16 AM
Net54 already is a constructive forum about the hobby. Not
everyone is cut out to be a cheerleader. Welcome to posting.

mwilliams
01-29-2013, 11:16 AM
Just wow..."and hope that Net54 will also continue to evolve into a forum for constructive dialogue about the hobby"

mikemcgrail
01-29-2013, 11:19 AM
No, you should study them intently for about three days - do nothing else other than eat and maybe some calisthenics. You can also take incoming calls, but only from family members.

This is great on many levels! Well fielded Scott

bobbyw8469
01-29-2013, 11:24 AM
others, such as this one bashing PSA, just serve to undermine the very hobby we all theoretically find so special.


I am the originator of the thread. The thread was never made to bash PSA. The thread was talking about the steady decline of theme and character of the PSA boards, to the point that the board now needs "chaperones" to get rid of the wild west mentality that has long prevailed on the boards, because some members refuse to act like adults. I'm sorry if you misconstrued it as a bashing of PSA. I don't bash PSA. I like PSA. Sure, they make mistakes like the rest of us. I don't have anything against them though. At least if I know I am sending them something, I am going to get it back (wink wink @ GAI).

Runscott
01-29-2013, 11:35 AM
Bobby, your phone is ringing.

Runscott
01-29-2013, 12:01 PM
...
PSA is the standard and clear market share leader in what they do. They are human and therefore mistakes can and will be made, but that does not mean that there is willful deceit or malice, I think David Hall, Joe, etc have always tried to do the right thing.
...

EOMINT

For Eomint:

http://www.sportscollectorsdigest.com/wp-content/uploads/T-206-Honus-Wagner-PSA-8-640x1024.jpg

novakjr
01-29-2013, 12:11 PM
Sorry to chime in so late on this one. But the PSA boards are fluff. Just another marketing tool for the company. If PSA is policing and poofing any thread or comment that sheds any sort of negative light on them, then the forum is not being allowed to be fully productive..

Ideally, it would be nice if our hobby was limited to sharing our pickups and digital pats on the back, or talking about pop numbers or registry rankings..But let's face it, this hobby is MUCH, MUCH more than that.. And the negative comes with the positive.

That's one of the best things about a board like this one. Absolute freedom. Well, as long as you post your name. We can tackle the good and the bad. And openly discuss and debate any matter, no matter how insignificant or controversial it may seem to some. You just don't get that when the hosting corporation is also the main topic of discussion.. The PSA boards have grown to the point of irrelevancy(would it be too far to say that they were irrelevant from their inception), because anything worth its weight that has been discussed over there, has or can or will be discussed over here openly and honestly, without the policing.

I am NOT trying to pick on PSA with this. Only the merit and character of the forum and the relation to it's hosts. It's just an observation about the nature of discussions about a company being held in a forum run by the same company.. The same would apply to just about any company.

teetwoohsix
01-29-2013, 12:23 PM
It's one thread, I don't think a new board is needed for one thread. I hope we convert some of them to Pre-WWII but most of their talk is poppage and ripping packs, which is fine, but not really our main game. I already see it dying down and there are some really good conversations going on, on the front page. Can you tell I am beating my drum?

http://luckeycards.com/pt206drum.jpg

:D That's a beautiful Drum you are beating there Leon.

Sincerely, Clayton

eomint
01-29-2013, 12:34 PM
I am highly confident that if Ken Kendrick wanted PSA to take back the card that they would if the Mastro allegations are proven to be true beyond a reasonable doubt. PSA stands behind its product. It is my understanding that Ken likes the story and mystique around "The Card" though and has no intention of unloading it. He has a wonderful collection and the Wagner, while a trophy card, is an insignificant % of his net worth.

There is a reason that Merkel, Branca, Spence, Ireland, and other great collectors are either pure PSA guys or predominantly so. And Fogel is exclusively a PSA guy, never have seen any of his cards in other holders.

In any event, it is not my job to defend PSA, but I do believe that over time rare, vintage, and iconic PSA graded cards, especially at the top of the condition scale, will continue to be in high demand.

BTW, if anybody can locate any of the following cards for me in PSA 9 it would be much appreciated, not an easy wantlist:

1948 Leaf Musial
1948 Leaf J Robinson
1951 Bowman Ford
1951 Bowman Mays
1951 Bowman Mantle
1952 Topps Matthews
1954 Bowman Williams
1955 Topps Snider

EOMINT

whitehse
01-29-2013, 12:41 PM
I am the originator of the thread. The thread was never made to bash PSA. The thread was talking about the steady decline of theme and character of the PSA boards, to the point that the board now needs "chaperones" to get rid of the wild west mentality that has long prevailed on the boards, because some members refuse to act like adults. I'm sorry if you misconstrued it as a bashing of PSA. I don't bash PSA. I like PSA. Sure, they make mistakes like the rest of us. I don't have anything against them though. At least if I know I am sending them something, I am going to get it back (wink wink @ GAI).

Why did you bring this up on these boards and NOT post it on the PSA boards? It seems to me you would find a whole lot of people over there that would actually care about this subject. I swear sometimes you just cannot see the forest for the trees!

Leon
01-29-2013, 12:42 PM
EOMINT- As you well know all of your opinions are fine and dandy. You are very close to needing to put your full name out here though. Reason being, how do we know you don't work for PSA? I like PSA and have nothing against them at all. It could be any company or person, same rules for everyone.
Personally, I think SGC and BVG grade vintage better but that is just my biased and experienced opinion. Everyone has one. Just be careful in what you say if you don't want to put your name out here. Also, some anonymous POS tattled on you right before your last post... I can't stand anonymity so would almost do the opposite of what someone tells me to do, if they are anonymous. But with your last post I felt the need to let you know. No worries, just be careful and welcome to the forum.

eomint
01-29-2013, 12:51 PM
I'm not even sure what tattleling means in this context, but I am an independent collector with no affiliation to any grading company whatsoever. But this will be my final post. Thank you Leon for admitting me to this forum, I just dont think it's for me. Happy collecting to everyone!

glchen
01-29-2013, 12:52 PM
Eomint's pretty well known on the PSA boards, btw, especially for having an incredibly nice collection. I'm almost positive he doesn't work for PSA. He still may need to put his full name, however, for any controversial posts if Leon decides, of course.

Leon
01-29-2013, 12:56 PM
I'm not even sure what tattleling means in this context, but I am an independent collector with no affiliation to any grading company whatsoever. But this will be my final post. Thank you Leon for admitting me to this forum, I just dont think it's for me. Happy collecting to everyone!

They told me that you need to have your full name in your posts. They were anonymous so I could care less.
Independent collector, President of the US, grader, manager at a TPG, person that stumbled on our board....it's all the same for the rules. And as I said earlier, I am sure this influx of new visitors will thin out over time. A lot of people don't want to have their name in the public domain so this forum isn't best for them. Also, we are mainly a vintage forum and most collectors don't collect vintage. But our goal is for everyone to!! :) Good luck in your endeavors EOMINT. Don't be shy about posting but remember if you give opinions of a person or company your name needs to be in your post. thanks again

Runscott
01-29-2013, 01:00 PM
There is a reason that Merkel, Branca, Spence, Ireland, and other great collectors are either pure PSA guys or predominantly so. And Fogel is exclusively a PSA guy, never have seen any of his cards in other holders.


Bobby is also a PSA collector, or was.

There is no such thing as a 'great' collector. We all end up in the same place, just some get mahogany and some get pine.

AustinMike
01-29-2013, 02:16 PM
There is no such thing as a 'great' collector. We all end up in the same place, just some get mahogany and some get pine.

I would have given this a +1, but I'm offended because people like me, with a particle board collection, weren't included. :D

HRBAKER
01-29-2013, 03:35 PM
What is a great collector? In the context used it seems to also
mean great customer.

vintagetoppsguy
01-29-2013, 03:41 PM
There is no such thing as a 'great' collector. We all end up in the same place, just some get mahogany and some get pine.

+1 very well said, Scott.

We do not own cards or anything else in life. We're simply borrowing it for a short time. One day, someone else will have our "stuff." We will all leave this life with exactly what we brought into it.

Matthew H
01-29-2013, 03:49 PM
I'm not even sure what tattleling means in this context, but I am an independent collector with no affiliation to any grading company whatsoever. But this will be my final post. Thank you Leon for admitting me to this forum, I just dont think it's for me. Happy collecting to everyone!

Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

BTW, those collectors you listed aren't even that great. Some of the most mind boggling amazing collections out there are pretty private.

-Matt Hall

Edit: I mean no disrespect to any of the names on your list.

I also don't mean any disrespect toward flip collecting.

Runscott
01-29-2013, 04:25 PM
Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

Sometime's it's hard to beat the classics.

We do need to thank eomint for planting the seed of "greatness" in our minds. I always feel vaguely discomfortable when someone expresses petty jealousy over one of the deep-pockets guy's posting of a very expensive auction win. But I feel similar discomfort when someone else tells them what a "great job" they did buying something that simply took a nice bank account. Admittedly, there are a few guys on this board that WILL win certain items, and some of us don't bother bidding against them. On the other hand, the fact that we know which items they will bid on, implies that they are selective and minimally have good taste.

So what is greatness in a hobby? There is no such thing. If we are going to judge someone as a hobbyist (which we probably should not), it should be for their contributions. Their collections are merely things that will some day be broken up and disbursed to younger people in the hobby, who may or may not be all that "great". Of course, I state the above as someone who, if judged for his collection, would be an insect, or at best, a small mammal.

Matthew H
01-29-2013, 04:38 PM
Sometime's it's hard to beat the classics.

We do need to thank eomint for planting the seed of "greatness" in our minds. I always feel vaguely discomfortable when someone expresses petty jealousy over one of the deep-pockets guy's posting of a very expensive auction win. But I feel similar discomfort when someone else tells them what a "great job" they did buying something that simply took a nice bank account. Admittedly, there are a few guys on this board that WILL win certain items, and some of us don't bother bidding against them. On the other hand, the fact that we know which items they will bid on, implies that they are selective and minimally have good taste.

So what is greatness in a hobby? There is no such thing. If we are going to judge someone as a hobbyist (which we probably should not), it should be for their contributions. Their collections are merely things that will some day be broken up and disbursed to younger people in the hobby, who may or may not be all that "great". Of course, I state the above as someone who, if judged for his collection, would be an insect, or at best, a small mammal.


Who was that member that used to brag about having like, a million PSA 8s? He almost never mentioned anything about the actual cards, just that they were PSA 8s... Anyway, I can't remember his name but I think it is he who is the greatest collector.

tiger8mush
01-29-2013, 04:38 PM
funny how much value can be placed upon a card that is entombed in plastic with a flip on it reading "Mint" yet when that SAME card is removed from the plastic, its value changes

isn't it the same card?

if you have a set graded "MINT" by a TPG, then remove the cards from their plastic holders, aren't they the SAME CARDS? Its like some people don't believe a card is a card unless its covered plastic with his/her favorite TPG stamp on it.

Didn't we all grow up collecting cardboard? Whats happened to that? Isn't it still cardboard?

Leon
01-29-2013, 04:45 PM
Sometime's it's hard to beat the classics.

So what is greatness in a hobby? There is no such thing. If we are going to judge someone as a hobbyist (which we probably should not), it should be for their contributions. Their collections are merely things that will some day be broken up and disbursed to younger people in the hobby, who may or may not be all that "great". Of course, I state the above as someone who, if judged for his collection, would be an insect, or at best, a small mammal.

I feel like posting that as a sticky, Scott. Very well said!!

My saying, that I stole from someone but I don't remember who, is-

When we are on our deathbed it won't matter what we have (materially), it will matter more what we have done.



I will be here till Thursday please tip the bartender on the way out.

.

TNP777
01-29-2013, 04:52 PM
A man's tombstone typically has the year he was born and the year he dies, with a dash in the middle. A question worth thinking about... what did you do (or are you doing) with your dash?

Certainly cardboard is our commond bond, but I find some of the relationships I've gained on various boards to be worth far more than the cardboard that brought us together.

'Course, the opposite also applies. I'm certainly sorry the common bond of cardboard brought certain people into my life. I could have definitely done without "meeting" them. On the flip, I'm certain the same could be said of me. It all depends on the perspective of the individual.

smotan_02
01-29-2013, 04:58 PM
If PSA were to grade me I'd probably come back a 4(O/C)

slidekellyslide
01-29-2013, 05:05 PM
I like PSA. Sure, they make mistakes like the rest of us. I don't have anything against them though. At least if I know I am sending them something, I am going to get it back (wink wink @ GAI).

Tell that to Dan McKee.

bubblebathgirl
01-29-2013, 05:11 PM
"Non fui, fui, non sum, non curo"

TNP777
01-29-2013, 05:17 PM
"Non fui, fui, non sum, non curo"God, I admire you. (Mr. Poon, a.k.a Irwin Fletcher)

Runscott
01-29-2013, 05:18 PM
I feel like posting that as a sticky, Scott. Very well said!!

You just liked hearing me describe myself as an insect :)

Thanks.

BPorter26
01-29-2013, 05:59 PM
I can not believe this thread is still going.

cobblove
01-29-2013, 06:28 PM
Here is the jist of what I've learned from this thread.
Dont waste your time reading it. It has nothing to do with anything.

OTWCards
01-29-2013, 08:32 PM
We are all just moons circling the respective planets in the hobby. Fault comes when some think that they are the sun... Sadly, they usually end up a supernova.

lsutigers1973
01-30-2013, 12:17 PM
We are all just moons circling the respective planets in the hobby. Fault comes when some think that they are the sun... Sadly, they usually end up a supernova.

Just like BBG, that is deep

EDIT TO ADD: Bill Holler

T205 GB
01-30-2013, 12:59 PM
Who was that member that used to brag about having like, a million PSA 8s? He almost never mentioned anything about the actual cards, just that they were PSA 8s... Anyway, I can't remember his name but I think it is he who is the greatest collector.

Must be a lot of 1980-90's cards Must have submitted them in bulk with a few vintage 50-70 to get the perk +1-2 grade bump that PSA gives on cards. :eek:

smotan_02
01-30-2013, 01:31 PM
What was the essence of this thread? Oh yeah, shaddy selling practices.

Exhibitman
01-30-2013, 01:37 PM
I'm not even sure what tattleling means in this context, but I am an independent collector with no affiliation to any grading company whatsoever. But this will be my final post. Thank you Leon for admitting me to this forum, I just dont think it's for me. Happy collecting to everyone!

http://photos.imageevent.com/exhibitman/dropins/websize/well_bye_2.jpg

CMIZ5290
01-30-2013, 02:25 PM
http://photos.imageevent.com/exhibitman/dropins/websize/well_bye_2.jpg

I'm your huckleberry......

HRBAKER
01-30-2013, 02:26 PM
Must be headed back to where the "great" collectors hang out.

Runscott
01-30-2013, 02:32 PM
Must be headed back to where the "great" collectors hang out.

http://landark.tripod.com/python/uppercla.jpg

Are those PSA GPA's !?! Then I guess I'm wrong :(

http://www.id-wall.com/images/large/MP010117-Twits-MPFC-90.jpg

E93
01-30-2013, 03:08 PM
Eomint came on and seemed to be very polite and measured in expressing his opinions. Others are free to disagree, but does it have to be mean and childish?
JimB

HRBAKER
01-30-2013, 03:36 PM
Jim,
Don't disagree totally but when you are here for 2 days and 2 posts and express your hope that the board would evolve into constructive dialogue about the hobby and you make note of "great" collectors I think you might open yourself up for some good natured ribbing.

JeffD

Matthew H
01-30-2013, 03:49 PM
You're probably right Jim, but his "last post" seemed a bit condescending in my overly sensitive mind.

Leon
01-30-2013, 03:51 PM
Jim,
Don't disagree totally but when you are here for 2 days and 2 posts and express your hope that the board would evolve into constructive dialogue about the hobby and you make note of "great" collectors I think you might open yourself up for some good natured ribbing.

JeffD

I am a member of the CU boards and read them most days. The amount of actual info there vs here is not in the same league, imo. I would politely have to disagree with EOMINT on that. I think EOMINT is probably a real nice guy and didn't mean anything too negative by his comments. (see me taking the high road)

Runscott
01-30-2013, 03:57 PM
Eomint came on and seemed to be very polite and measured in expressing his opinions. Others are free to disagree, but does it have to be mean and childish?
JimB

No, he was condescending, just as you are being. I understand the appeal, but for that you get....

http://ak5.picdn.net/shutterstock/videos/2303174/preview/stock-footage-beautiful-warm-cloudscape-with-man-silhouetted-standing-atop-pedestal-structure-looking-out-among.jpg

whitehse
01-30-2013, 04:04 PM
I am a member of the CU boards and read them most days. The amount of actual info there vs here is not in the same league, imo. I would politely have to disagree with EOMINT on that. I think EOMINT is probably a real nice guy and didn't mean anything too negative by his comments. (see me taking the high road)

I dont think I can agree with you more Leon. There was a time the CU boards had some great people over there with unbelieveable hobby knowledge but it seems the boards over there have degenerated into a place that is just a step above the Blowout boards and many times they are right there in the gutter with them.

I am still a member there and will post on occasion as there are some decent people I respect and like and can appreciate their knowledge but it has certainly become less "fun" to hang out there.

novakjr
01-30-2013, 05:17 PM
I think the problem that EOMINT is running into regarding this board, is threads like this one. I think he just came on board at the wrong time, and possibly for the wrong reasons. Most other boards tend to make threads like this go away, and it's understandable, because these types of topics can get very heated, and tend to turn people off and/or piss them off. I will admit that sometimes they get out of hand, but that's ultimately besides the point.

Wanting to avoid it is fine and dandy, however neglecting to acknowledge that threads like this are sometimes necessary in the hobby isn't. These type of threads often result in more good in the overall scheme of things, than they do bad. Sure they may make someone look bad, but then again, if that person or company didn't do something worth pointing out, then the whole thing would be unnecessary..

The fact that these type of things needed to be pointed out is the "bad" thing, NOT pointing them out and/or discussing them..

The problem here is that the TPAs have worked themselves into a position where they are somewhat large part of this hobby, and some people fear that tearing them down for their faults is bad for the hobby. The value of many collections out there are pretty much based on the legitimacy of the TPGs. And tearing them down WILL hurt a lot of collectors and/or general interest in the hobby. Maybe short-term this could be a bad thing. But long term, straightening out these issues is best for all involved.

Runscott
01-30-2013, 05:24 PM
I think eomint is intelligent enough to realize that these anti-PSA threads were started by disgruntled PSA'ers who were run off the PSA forum. Those people (like Bobby) are only here to complain about PSA - not to contribute to vintage card discussions. You'll also notice that these anti-PSA threads have brought quite a few <50 posters out of the woodwork who I bet are also, for the most part, disgruntled PSA'ers who have very little interest in vintage cards.

In essence, these threads are not vintage card collectors discussing PSA-encapsulated vintage cards and bashing them. We used to have a lot of that - now, not so much. It wasn't fun, so we stopped.

Most of the stuff posted since eomint announced his leaving (with a minor parting shot at this board) has been joking around, not PSA-bashing. I really don't see what the big deal is.

HRBAKER
01-30-2013, 05:57 PM
I am a member of the CU boards and read them most days. The amount of actual info there vs here is not in the same league, imo. I would politely have to disagree with EOMINT on that. I think EOMINT is probably a real nice guy and didn't mean anything too negative by his comments. (see me taking the high road)

You're probably right and the ribbing again from my POV was pretty good natured. I think Scott hit an important nail on the head, there is a fear in some quarters about people continuing to point out the seeming shortcomings of TPG. Particularly among people who have collected numbers in addition to cards. I meant no ill will, I just thought he took a back handed shot at this board. Also I will agree, I used to frequent the CU boards for awhile, not much there for me and the amount of actual info there is (IMO) significantly less than here.

Edit to add: I am not entirely disinterested either as I have several hundred slabbed cards.

triwak
01-30-2013, 06:27 PM
http://www.id-wall.com/images/large/MP010117-Twits-MPFC-90.jpg

The secret of 54???

Runscott
01-30-2013, 06:35 PM
The secret of 54???

SHHHHHH!!!! (Frank will kill me for giving away the answer!)

frankbmd
01-30-2013, 07:50 PM
SHHHHHH!!!! (Frank will kill me for giving away the answer!)

Take off your shoes, Scott.

My hearing isn't all that good.

Feel free to share your secret on the other thread.

eomint
01-30-2013, 07:51 PM
I do appreciate the need for an independent site such as this and that a forum exists for folks to share their views uncensored as long as they are not libelous of course.

In terms of my citing "great collectors" i probably should have worded it more carefully as there seems to be same 99%/1% divide on this board that is dividing the entire country. What I meant to say is that many of those who have arguably some of the rarest and most valuable stuff have entrusted their collection to PSA. That is a fact, not an opinion. That does not diminish in any way, however, the fact that there are a ton of of other passionate collectors out there who are great people.

I think it's pretty obvious that we all eventually die and cant take our cards with us and that material things are not the measure of an individual.

Love the debate, love free speech, dont love the feeling of hostility some (not all) convey.

Thanks,

EOMINT

ALR-bishop
01-30-2013, 08:15 PM
I am currently debating whether or not to take my cards along with me.

Matthew H
01-30-2013, 08:15 PM
In terms of my citing "great collectors" i probably should have worded it more carefully as there seems to be same 99%/1% divide on this board that is dividing the entire country.

EOMINT


I think you need to look further than the PSA registry leader boards before you decide where the 1% is.

It's not really a debate. You simply don't know what you're talking about.
The people at the top of those "leader boards" are really just people that want to be hobby celebrities. They don't have the best stuff out there, that's a fact.

I personally don't hate people who have positioned themselves, in life, where the can amass spectacular collections. I feel lucky to know some people like that, and by knowing whats out there, I simply can't force myself to consider a bunch of "#1 Topps sets", or the "#1 T206 set" anything to call great. I know I sound like an ass, but I'm pretty sure buying high grade topps cards is a waste of money. People are paying wayyyy too high a premium for someones opinion on a card.

Matt Hall

CMIZ5290
01-30-2013, 08:16 PM
PSA does rule especially with resale value, no contest. T206 values are not even close between PSA and SGC. While I have alot graded by both companies, the values are not even close. Not trying to stick up for our newest member (eomint), but he is spot on pertaining PSA....

murcerfan
01-30-2013, 08:23 PM
What I meant to say is that many of those who have arguably some of the rarest and most valuable stuff have entrusted their collection to PSA. That is a fact, not an opinion


like your 55 Clemente 10?

CMIZ5290
01-30-2013, 08:30 PM
Another thing pertaining T206s, PSA is much stricter on grading than SGC. I have many SGC 84's and 86's that would never even cross to PSA 6 or 6.5's....Sorry, but it is what it is......

HRBAKER
01-30-2013, 08:32 PM
I have no dog in this debate but I think that the notion that the majority of high value and rare collections reside in anyone's plastic cases is pretty myopic.
Also not sure what the 99% and 1% divide is.

botn
01-30-2013, 08:41 PM
What I meant to say is that many of those who have arguably some of the rarest and most valuable stuff have entrusted their collection to PSA. That is a fact, not an opinion.

There are some astounding collections in SGC holders and some that are not in any holders at all. Based on those collectors whose names you mentioned, I suspect by "rare" you are referring to PSA population figures for high grade (9s and 10s) cards. Others might define rare in a different manner.

vintagetoppsguy
01-30-2013, 08:49 PM
Nevermind

tiger8mush
01-30-2013, 08:51 PM
I have no dog in this debate but I think that the notion that the majority of high value and rare collections reside in anyone's plastic cases is pretty myopic.
Also not sure what the 99% and 1% divide is.

+1

HasselhoffsCheeseburger
01-30-2013, 08:59 PM
If the light is just right, and you squint hard enough, this thread somewhat resembles Han Solo.

novakjr
01-30-2013, 09:20 PM
Yeah, I wasn't trying to bash anyone with my last post. Especially not PSA(although, I will admit that I don't necessarily agree with the poofing). I actually have plenty of respect for PSA, BGS and SGC. But they all have their flaws, and there shouldn't be anything wrong with pointing out those flaws.

Now, I believe there are some ill-intentions towards PSA being thrown around, but at the core of those ill-intentions there are still a few nuggets worthy of legitimate concern. Some choose to lash out, others choose to more calmly shed some light on the matter. It would be nice to not have to dig through intentions to find the truth, but it doesn't mean that we should ignore them alltogether.

Seriously, out of everything that's gone on PSA-wise in the past few weeks on the board, I think there are probably a few very legitimate concerns. And I will admit that with some digging, a few interesting things have been brought over. Like the P-P submission info with all the 10's.

As far as the newbies here, who seem to have only come here to vent. I think we need to look at that in perspective as well. We're being dropped right in the middle, without too much knowledge of how all of this may have been handled to begin with.. It's obvious that we're getting is the boil over, which may be a good thing. Because I've got to believe that it takes a person who is very passionate and serious about the hobby to let it get to that point. So a bit of harshness and short-sightedness should be expected at this point.. I expect all the newbies to eventually settle down, and let their passion lead to them becoming legitimate contributors to this board. And if we've gotta deal with a little mayhem in the meantime, it may be worth waiting it out.

Runscott
01-30-2013, 09:36 PM
What I meant to say is that many of those who have arguably some of...

It's really impossible to argue with such a statement. What I mean is that it's arguably difficult for many of us to disagree with some of it.

Deertick
01-30-2013, 10:33 PM
I look at the PSA refugees as I would taking in a stray dog: It may not have very good manners nor understanding of what's going on, but with a little training can be a valued member of the household. Or continue to poop wherever it pleases. One will get "attaboys", the other a trip to the "farm".

Jim Ma.rinari

Runscott
01-30-2013, 10:51 PM
I look at the PSA refugees as I would taking in a stray dog: It may not have very good manners nor understanding of what's going on, but with a little training can be a valued member of the household. Or continue to poop wherever it pleases. One will get "attaboys", the other a trip to the "farm".

Jim Ma.rinari

That's a good analogy.

Scott <=== off to find a burlap sack and some rocks

ALR-bishop
01-30-2013, 11:22 PM
This board, that board, any board, share what you know, appreciate what others contribute and do not take yourself so darn seriously...and welcome and appreciate newcomers

Jay Wolt
01-30-2013, 11:35 PM
Al, well said!

travrosty
01-30-2013, 11:59 PM
I think you need to look further than the PSA registry leader boards before you decide where the 1% is.

It's not really a debate. You simply don't know what you're talking about.
The people at the top of those "leader boards" are really just people that want to be hobby celebrities. They don't have the best stuff out there, that's a fact.

I personally don't hate people who have positioned themselves, in life, where the can amass spectacular collections. I feel lucky to know some people like that, and by knowing whats out there, I simply can't force myself to consider a bunch of "#1 Topps sets", or the "#1 T206 set" anything to call great. I know I sound like an ass, but I'm pretty sure buying high grade topps cards is a waste of money. People are paying wayyyy too high a premium for someones opinion on a card.

Matt Hall


that's exactly right, there are tons of rare, great stuff, not in psa holders or with psa certs. tons of it.

the people on the top of the registry board just want to be celebrities, they want the pat on the back from psa. when psa holds their awards ceremony, there they are going up to accept the award of "best post 1930 but pre 1932 regional drum majorette set" psa 9.9 well whoop-de-do and so what? but they walk up there like they just won the nobel prize for chemistry. they shake joe orlando's hand like they just met elvis or something.

lsutigers1973
01-31-2013, 12:36 PM
I look at the PSA refugees as I would taking in a stray dog: It may not have very good manners nor understanding of what's going on, but with a little training can be a valued member of the household. Or continue to poop wherever it pleases. One will get "attaboys", the other a trip to the "farm".

Jim Ma.rinari

Referring to intelligent grown men as stray dogs with no manners or intellect simply because they are disgruntled with the current status of the PSA board is not only condescending but extremely rude. If you love the hobby and this forum, one would think you would welcome new members instead of belittling them.

As for the difference in TPGs. In a perfect world we would have one TPG with a holder as durable as BGS, as classy and stylish as SGC with the resale value of PSA. Anyone that truly believes that PSA isn't the current market leader is fooling themselves or has their blinders on.

ullmandds
01-31-2013, 12:52 PM
"As for the difference in TPGs. In a perfect world we would have one TPG with a holder as durable as BGS, as classy and stylish as SGC with the resale value of PSA. Anyone that truly believes that PSA isn't the current market leader is fooling themselves or has their blinders on. "

+1 But as for why PSA is still the market leader is beyond me...with their piss poor grading times/customer service...and inconsistent grading.

lsutigers1973
01-31-2013, 01:04 PM
+1 But as for why PSA is still the market leader is beyond me...with their piss poor grading times/customer service...and inconsistent grading.

Completely agree. No idea how PSA has survived this long with all the past "scandals" surrounding not only some high profile cards, but also recently with the pack grading. That doesn't even begin to scratch the surface of inconsistent grading especially when many cards increase in value by up to 50x's for a simple totally objective one grade bump.

Matthew H
01-31-2013, 01:05 PM
Selling your collection for a premium through PSA = smart.

Buying your collection for a premium through PSA = ?

ullmandds
01-31-2013, 01:08 PM
totally agree Matt...I try to avoid buying PSA cards at all costs! But when it comes time to sell...I wish they were all in PSA holders...but I won't deal with PSA so I'm most likely leaving $$$ on the table...oh well!!!!

Runscott
01-31-2013, 01:30 PM
Referring to intelligent grown men as stray dogs with no manners or intellect simply because they are disgruntled with the current status of the PSA board is not only condescending but extremely rude. If you love the hobby and this forum, one would think you would welcome new members instead of belittling them.


Given their 'pooping in the house', I think his analogy was pretty good. You have created a very poor straw man - as you well know, our reaction to their posts wasn't because they are disgruntled with the current status of PSA. It was because of their poor behavior over here. Personally, I don't think the other forums do a very good job of potty-training their members - they simply drop them off in a field if they don't behave correctly. At least we are trying.

Loving the hobby and this forum have nothing to do with putting up with bad behavior. I've had my wrist slapped plenty of times - claiming that it was because a moderator "doesn't love the hobby or the forum" would be ludicrous.

calvindog
01-31-2013, 01:37 PM
totally agree Matt...I try to avoid buying PSA cards at all costs! But when it comes time to sell...I wish they were all in PSA holders...but I won't deal with PSA so I'm most likely leaving $$$ on the table...oh well!!!!

For resale value, PSA brings more in only for cards in which the Registry comes into play. For many (perhaps most) prewar issues, the PSA Registry is a non-factor. For that reason, every single card that I submit raw for grading is through SGC. I can tell you that spending 10K on a prewar, non-Registry PSA card has, for me, been a frightening endeavor.

calvindog
01-31-2013, 01:39 PM
Given their 'pooping in the house', I think his analogy was pretty good. You have created a very poor straw man - as you well know, our reaction to their posts wasn't because they are disgruntled with the current status of PSA. It was because of their poor behavior over here. Personally, I don't think the other forums do a very good job of potty-training their members - they simply drop them off in a field if they don't behave correctly. At least we are trying.

Loving the hobby and this forum have nothing to do with putting up with bad behavior. I've had my wrist slapped plenty of times - claiming that it was because a moderator "doesn't love the hobby or the forum" would be ludicrous.

If not for Scott's comments on this thread I may have jumped out the window at the end of the first page. Please keep them coming.

insidethewrapper
01-31-2013, 03:03 PM
Look at these 2 PSA submissions ( A) and ( 10 ). Guess what dealer is selling the (10). It's on ebay now.

bobbyw8469
01-31-2013, 05:21 PM
If not for Scott's comments on this thread I may have jumped out the window at the end of the first page. Please keep them coming.

Darn it - I wish Scott had stayed away...one can only hope! (j/k)

ullmandds
01-31-2013, 05:43 PM
Mike...nice evidence...it is such crap...its like the fed reserve printing money for their friends!!!

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 05:52 PM
Eomint came on and seemed to be very polite and measured in expressing his opinions. Others are free to disagree, but does it have to be mean and childish?
JimB

+1

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 05:59 PM
Another thing pertaining T206s, PSA is much stricter on grading than SGC. I have many SGC 84's and 86's that would never even cross to PSA 6 or 6.5's....Sorry, but it is what it is......

I need you to submit for me then Kevin. :)

I find the exact opposite I have many more PSA cards that won’t make the SGC cut for cross overs I have lots of PSA 6-7’s that when looked at had minor issues that when crossed went down grades.

Both companies are fine BTW I just think SGC is way tougher and I don’t think I would be alone in that stance.

In terms of returns I have confidence that my cards will get good values and that no major money is being left on the table crossing from PSA to SGC. I think quality items sell for quality prices regardless of what TPG they are in within reason of course.

Runscott
01-31-2013, 05:59 PM
Darn it - I wish Scott had stayed away...one can only hope! (j/k)

I'm leaving. Someone go nail Jeff's window shut.

ullmandds
01-31-2013, 06:46 PM
Totally agree with John on this one... PSA is notorious for over grading. Kevin I kind of remember You dumping a whole load of PSA vg/ex's That were totally over graded... Most of those would have dropped one or two or three tiers on SGC?

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 07:21 PM
Peter/John- sorry you guys disagree, but I can send you a bunch of scans on SGC graded cards that are incredibly overgraded...I just dont see it with PSA, it's almost like some of you guys lost a ton of money on PSA stock! Also, for the record Peter, I have never had a bunch of PSA 4's that I unloaded, no clue where that's coming from as I dont even collect lower grades...would love to see those as I have never,ever had a ton of 4's....

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 07:27 PM
No stock in any TPG or love hate for either. Picked SGC because I liked the holders, the people and they are close to me. They also do a good job too.

Just saying in my experience I have had equal from both guys SGC and PSA. In my stacks of PSA I have a lot of cards that would never cross to SGC at their current grade due to things like minor paper loss missed, creases, marks etc. Things that sadly for my cross attempts SGC does not miss.

Deertick
01-31-2013, 07:52 PM
Referring to intelligent grown men as stray dogs with no manners or intellect simply because they are disgruntled with the current status of the PSA board is not only condescending but extremely rude. If you love the hobby and this forum, one would think you would welcome new members instead of belittling them.

As for the difference in TPGs. In a perfect world we would have one TPG with a holder as durable as BGS, as classy and stylish as SGC with the resale value of PSA. Anyone that truly believes that PSA isn't the current market leader is fooling themselves or has their blinders on.

I read this board for months prior to registering. As a result, I am unaware of any time that I posted in the wrong category multiple times, called out longtime board members over perceived slights, denigrated solicited opinions, or pretend to have knowlege in areas I don't.

I was mainly referring to the the FACT that the lack of decorum that is prevalent on other boards and blogs on the interwebs, sometimes carries over to their participation here. There is a learning curve that most go through to outgrow the posturing and shouting which is necessary for survival on other boards. Most succeed, but some don't don't even try to get it.

Clearly, I was not calling new members "dogs". And "intelligent grown men" don't have hissy fits.

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 07:58 PM
I read this board for months prior to registering. As a result, I am unaware of any time that I posted in the wrong category multiple times, called out longtime board members over perceived slights, denigrated solicited opinions, or pretend to have knowlege in areas I don't.

I was mainly referring to the the FACT that the lack of decorum that is prevalent on other boards and blogs on the interwebs, sometimes carries over to their participation here. There is a learning curve that most go through to outgrow the posturing and shouting which is necessary for survival on other boards. Most succeed, but some don't don't even try to get it.

Clearly, I was not calling new members "dogs". And "intelligent grown men" don't have hissy fits.

I have no idea what you just said.....Too many beers I guess....

Runscott
01-31-2013, 08:03 PM
http://www.toonpool.com/user/64381/files/run_for_cover_1815755.jpg

Deertick
01-31-2013, 08:32 PM
I have no idea what you just said.....Too many beers I guess....

Me or you? :D

vintagetoppsguy
01-31-2013, 08:33 PM
I can send you a bunch of scans on SGC graded cards that are incredibly overgraded.

I'd like to see one. Just one. It has to be something that we can all agree is overgraded (paper loss, pin holes, etc), not just your opinion that it's overgraded. I'll go first. Here is a PSA 6 with paper loss. Probably should have graded no higher than a 2 (overgraded by 4 grades). Either way, I think we can both agree it's not a 6.

http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x137/vintagetoppsguy/Personal/T206PickeringPSA6PaperLoss_zpse6c896df.jpg

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 08:37 PM
I'd like to see one. Just one. It has to be something that we can all agree is overgraded (paper loss, pin holes, etc), not just your opinion that it's overgraded. I'll go first. Here is a PSA 6 with paper loss. Probably should have graded no higher than a 2 (overgraded by 4 grades). Either way, I think we can both agree it's not a 6.

http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x137/vintagetoppsguy/Personal/T206PickeringPSA6PaperLoss_zpse6c896df.jpg

David- what about corner wear? Isn't that important?? SGC is a joke when it comes to this....

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 08:40 PM
David- Also, how do you know the card was not swapped out? I will admit, one downfall of PSA is the holders are very easily tamperable,,,but would'nt common sense take over in a case like this when you are looking at the card? how in the world would PSA miss this kind of paper loss? no way.....

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 08:42 PM
When is the last time you have seen PSA 7 T206s with slightly rounded corners? how many SGC's would you like to see?? I have many.....

vintagetoppsguy
01-31-2013, 08:48 PM
David- what about corner wear? Isn't that important?? SGC is a joke when it comes to this....

Corner wear is fine, as long as we can all agree it's "incredibly overgraded."

And no, that card was not swapped out. I can show you another PSA 6 with even more paper loss that belonged to a board member. He had to get PSA to make it right.

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 08:51 PM
Corner wear is fine, as long as we can all agree it's "incredibly overgraded."

And no, that card was not swapped out. I can show you another PSA 6 with even more paper loss that belonged to a board member. He had to get PSA to make it right.

Corner wear is fine? Really? Holy cow, how many PSA 7's would you like that you can easily cross to SGC 88-96's based on that? You dont collect coins do you?

HRBAKER
01-31-2013, 08:57 PM
Hey we all make mistakes, it happens. Luckily most of us aren't experts.

http://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s172/hrbaker/Decorated%20images/Wills68baz.jpghttp://i152.photobucket.com/albums/s172/hrbaker/Decorated%20images/BazookaWills.jpg

For those of you who think that essentially it's hard to tell the difference between an 8 and a 9.

vintagetoppsguy
01-31-2013, 08:58 PM
Corner wear is fine? Really? Holy cow, how many PSA 7's would you like that you can easily cross to SGC 88-96's based on that? You dont collect coins do you?

Kevin, you're twisiting my words. I didn't mean that corner was fine as an acceptable flaw on a card. I meant corner wear was fine if you wanted to use it as an example to show me an SGC card that is overgraded.

Still waiting.

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 08:59 PM
David- No offense, but to take a stance that "corner wear" is fine when it comes to T206 grading makes absolutely no sense to me. Yes, I know, there are some members that will insist "if the corners are too sharp, it must be trimmed!" So where in the hell do you draw the line? All I am saying is that if you look at SGC 84's and PSA 7's consistantly, 80% or better of the time, there is no comparison....

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 09:03 PM
David-How many examples of overgraded SGC t206s would you like to see? Start with this one, Google SGC 84 Hal Chase (dark cap). I recently bought this card for less than $400 on Ebay, is this really a 7? I dont think so....

vintagetoppsguy
01-31-2013, 09:04 PM
Just one will suffice.

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 09:04 PM
Kevin love to see some, but Chris is away so not sure he can post scans for you. :)

Also Kevin I will be submitting quite a few PSA 7s this month I will keep an eye out for these easy 88's and 96's I should be getting back from those sloppy SGC folks. Good to hear about this I'm very excited. :D

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 09:07 PM
David- here's another, take a peak at Ebay SGC 86 Harry Mcintyre, look at all corners....Really, a 7.5? not even close....let me know if you want me to go on....

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 09:09 PM
Kevin love to see some, but Chris is away so not sure he can post scans for you. :)

Also Kevin I will be submitting quite a few PSA 7s this month I will keep an eye out for these easy 88's and 96's I should be getting back from those sloppy SGC folks. Good to hear about this I'm very excited. :D

John- no offense, but as tight as you are, I doubt you have the nuts to crack PSA 7's! I didnt even know you had any...

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 09:12 PM
Not sure i follow Kevin perhaps you can clarify your comment?

vintagetoppsguy
01-31-2013, 09:13 PM
David- here's another, take a peak at Ebay SGC 86 Harry Mcintyre, look at all corners....Really, a 7.5? not even close....let me know if you want me to go on....

Please point out specifically what you're talking about. It looks like an 86 to me all day long. If you do't think it's an 86, what do you think it is?

http://i.ebayimg.com/t/1911-T206-Harry-McIntyre-Brooklyn-Chicago-Sweet-Caporal-350-460-SGC-86-/00/s/NDc0WDI3NQ==/$(KGrHqF,!qUFCv4fi-gFBQ8VehLN2!~~60_1.JPG

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 09:14 PM
Not sure i follow Kevin perhaps you can clarify your comment?

If you want clarification, why don't you give me a call? 229-630-1686....

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 09:15 PM
Please point out specifically what you're talking about. It looks like an 86 to me all day long. If you do't think it's an 86, what do you think it is?

http://i.ebayimg.com/t/1911-T206-Harry-McIntyre-Brooklyn-Chicago-Sweet-Caporal-350-460-SGC-86-/00/s/NDc0WDI3NQ==/$(KGrHqF,!qUFCv4fi-gFBQ8VehLN2!~~60_1.JPG

David- can you not see the rounded bottom right corner?

vintagetoppsguy
01-31-2013, 09:18 PM
David- can you not see the rounded bottom right corner?

Yes, Kevin, I see that rounded bottom right corner. :rolleyes:

Again, if you don't think it's an 86, what do you think it should have graded?

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 09:18 PM
If you want clarification, why don't you give me a call? 229-630-1686....

No thanks I would assume you would have the "nuts" to simply clear here publicly since you made the comment.

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 09:19 PM
No thanks I would assume you would have the "nuts" to simply clear here publicly since you made the comment.

John- that's what I figured.....

TNP777
01-31-2013, 09:20 PM
can we please get back on topic and mock the PSA boards and its migrating members?

:D

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 09:20 PM
What are you the riddler? Figured what you made a comment I said please clarify...

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 09:22 PM
What are you the riddler? Figured what you made a comment I said please clarify...

Why dont you grow a set? 229-630-1686....

DerekMichael
01-31-2013, 09:25 PM
Hi guys. I am not taking sides, or anything like that, but I was actually hoping for some honest opinions on this one card in particular, because I found the grade to be seriously absurd. I saw it the the other day and was actually hoping for some feedback from the pros on this one.

Mr. Mize, I know you have a seriously fine eye for corners and high grade pieces in general, but wouldnt a stain of this magnitude be grounds for a serious docking of the grade?

I am just curious as to everyones opinion on a piece like this, and I figured this would be a good thread to ask.

I feel like I am not grasping the staining aspect of a card when it is being graded.

Thank You.

DerekMichael
01-31-2013, 09:26 PM
http://www.ebay.com/itm/350694389007?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 09:29 PM
Kevin it’s not about fear it’s about not wasting too much of my time jawing with you over nothing. I barely see the need to talk to you in this thread much longer let alone call you. I’m sure your lonely, I get it but perhaps e-harmony or something is a better option for you? You can always “bump” your profile should you not get any responses right away.

Kevin, I won’t take any more of your time. Besides I’m sure you have countless BST threads to bump on insanely undergraded low pop cards. Along with a night filled with outing other members cards that you feel are trimmed or overgraded. Keep up the good fight.

Hugs & Kisses

John

Leon
01-31-2013, 09:29 PM
http://www.ebay.com/itm/350694389007?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

flesh wound

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 09:30 PM
Kevin it’s not about fear it’s about not wasting too much of my time jawing with you over nothing. I barely see the need to talk to you in this thread much longer let alone call you. I’m sure your lonely, I get it but perhaps e-harmony or something is a better option for you? You can always “bump” your profile should you not get any responses right away.

Kevin, I won’t take any more of your time. Besides I’m sure you have countless BST threads to bump on insanely undergraded low pop cards. Along with a night filled with outing other members cards that you feel are trimmed or overgraded. Keep up the good fight.

Hugs & Kisses

John

Still no call, can you say "no balls"?

vintagetoppsguy
01-31-2013, 09:30 PM
http://www.ebay.com/itm/350694389007?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

:eek:

It was probably swapped out :rolleyes:

HRBAKER
01-31-2013, 09:33 PM
I think you are allowed one coffee stain per submission.
Sure looks overgraded to me.

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 09:33 PM
http://www.ebay.com/itm/350694389007?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

Derek- I agree with you on this one, no doubt. I am very surprised it sold for what it did....

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 09:34 PM
I think you are allowed one coffee stain per submission.
Sure looks overgraded to me.

+1

DerekMichael
01-31-2013, 09:35 PM
flesh wound

Lol.
Mr. Luckey,

I would actually be very curious as to your opinion on this one in particular. Personally, I do not care about grades too much, and I do not know if you do, but what do you make of this?

I have seen a card get docked heavily for a small amount of paper loss on the back, and I would like to use this one particular example if I may:

http://goodwinandco.com/LotDetail.aspx?lotid=8289

The only real flaw on this Waddell that I can see is a small amount of paper loss on the back. I truly find the fact these cards (the Bresnahan I posted above and the Waddell) are considered "equals" in terms of condition to be nothing short of offensive.

Maybe I am wrong here, but I just do not get it.

I would truly appreciate your opinion on this subject, as these are just a few examples.

Thank You Mr. Luckey, and to anyone else who would like to give their opinion.

Derek

Mikehealer
01-31-2013, 09:38 PM
Kevin, I won’t take any more of your time. Besides I’m sure you have countless BST threads to bump on insanely undergraded low pop cards. Along with a night filled with outing other members cards that you feel are trimmed or overgraded. Keep up the good fight.

Hugs & Kisses

John

Now that's funny.

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 09:39 PM
Now that's funny.

Mike- I was wondering when you would chime in! Boy I've missed you!

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 09:40 PM
Still no call, can you say "no balls"?

Use your giant manhood and publicly clarify your comment…or should I say “what I figured”? :confused:

Again why do I have to call you? Are we pals now?

HRBAKER
01-31-2013, 09:40 PM
Technically I think the Hindu is overgraded by 2 grades. Might have brought as much in a 2 holder bc of the lack of severity of the damage??

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 09:42 PM
Use your giant manhood and publicly clarify your comment…or should I say “what I figured”? :confused:

Again why do I have to call you? Are we pals now?

Still figures, no call...By the way John, have you ever wore a jock strap? Just curious....

DerekMichael
01-31-2013, 09:43 PM
Thank you Jeff. May I ask, if you feel the Waddell is over graded by 2 whole points, then how many points was the Bresnahan over graded?

In my honest opinion, the eye appeal and preservation of the Waddell card just destroys the Bresnahan beyond any words I can even communicate. There is just no comparison in my eyes as to which piece is by far superior.




Technically I think the Hindu is overgraded by 2 grades. Might have brought as much in a 2 holder bc of the lack of severity of the damage??

HRBAKER
01-31-2013, 09:46 PM
Thank you Jeff. May I ask, if you feel the Waddell is over graded by 2 whole points, then how many points was the Bresnahan over graded?

In my honest opinion, the eye appeal and preservation of the Waddell card just destroys the Bresnahan beyond any words I can even communicate. There is just no comparison in my eyes as to which piece is by far superior.

I'm no grader (I don't have the qualifications). If I had that Bresnahan raw and listed it on the BST I would grade it F/G at best. It has a huge stain on it. In terms of comparatives, while I would grade the Waddell a technical 2, it is a beautiful 2. No comparison, but what do I know.

DerekMichael
01-31-2013, 09:47 PM
I'm no grader (I don't have the qualifications). If I had that Bresnahan raw and listed it on the BST I would grade it F/G at best. It has a huge stain on it. In terms of comparatives, while I would grade the Waddell a technical 2, it is a beautiful 2. No comparison, but what do I know.

You know enough to know that there is no comparison, and that is good enough for me. :)

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 10:01 PM
Still figures, no call...By the way John, have you ever wore a jock strap? Just curious....

http://photos.imageevent.com/piojohn3/net54shared/Clown-Shoes_1.jpg

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 10:08 PM
http://photos.imageevent.com/piojohn3/net54shared/Clown-Shoes_1.jpg

I love it, I'm getting to you....by the way, still no call? has all your hair gone?

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 10:11 PM
Well John, Who would have thought you wouldn't call? How about the whole world! It's amazing how much hot air you have in you while you hide behind a computer. I have only been on this forum for a while, but I have seen and talked to others that you "have differences with" and now I truly know what they meant. You have actually told me about different members "not to do business with". By the way, dont you have the balls to call? I've been waiting...

wazoo
01-31-2013, 10:21 PM
This is more enjoyable than a teenage Facebook fight.

Jlighter
01-31-2013, 10:26 PM
I think this clip sums up this fight pretty well.:)

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/KQrJ7Jcendo?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 10:26 PM
Impossible Kevin my hair was gone long before you. Business, life and taxes beat you too it. :)

Besides if you were getting to me. I would have to follow your lead and send you long rambling PM’s like the below. :D

“How ironic for him(Dan McKee) to unload on me calling me a joke in the hobby and a pussy to boot, when I was questioning one of his cards. But yet, he is always unloading on people about their supposedly trimmed cards. I guess he gets a free pass. Pertaining T206 collectors, my collection is probably in the top 5 of NET54 members and if some members find me aggressive, so be it. I do think I know just a little bit about T206s.” Kevin Mize

You remember the PM’s over McKee when he called you bad names over you declaring his card trimmed. You remember this thread the one that backfired on you calling folks cards over graded again from your computer screen.

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=158200

No Kevin you’re loveable and fun because you have so much to prove to everyone I could never be mad at you. Besides how can anyone be mad at a top 5 collector.

Oh and Kevin no means no I don't need to call you..I think you can tuck yourself in tonight.

John

P.S. Again what did i say wrong to you to bring up my nuts....oh that's right I didn't think you could just pop PSA 7's into SGC 96's so easily.

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 10:30 PM
Still waiting on the call John...You are letting me down, but then again, who didn't expect that? You are a pussy and everyone knows it. Again, the number is 229-630-1686 for the sixth time. I thought you emailed me saying you would be glad to air differences?? Dont tell me you got amnesia....

CMIZ5290
01-31-2013, 10:38 PM
Good night John, times up.....

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 10:41 PM
“Dont tell me you got amnesia”

Yeah I tend to forget things that have never happened sorry Kevin LOL you know how us "pussies" are. We have no differences Kevin that need to be cleared by phone/email were not hobby friends who had a falling out. To have a falling out that needs phone calls/emails to clear up one party has to mean something to the other person to begin with…on my end I checked…I’m good.

You latched onto me in that McKee thread and haven’t let go. Kind of creepy/sad you want me to call you so badly because I disagree with you that PSA 7's easily become SGC 96's. if that's the case I will look for all the SGC 96's in the BST from you in the coming weeks.

Is nobody loving you tonight Kevin is that why you want to talk? :)

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/b_ILDFp5DGA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

freakhappy
01-31-2013, 10:48 PM
Lionel Ritchie<----the dude

Deertick
01-31-2013, 11:06 PM
Lionel Ritchie<----the dude

Correction: Jeff Bridges is THE DUDE.

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 11:22 PM
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/sYsw0KVRjCM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

+1

freakhappy
01-31-2013, 11:38 PM
Correction: Jeff Bridges is THE DUDE.

Lionel Ritchie = The first coming of "The Dude"

Jeff Bridges = The second coming of "The Dude"

:D:D:D

The difference is...Lionel actually performs, where Jeff had to act to be the dude.

Jaybird
01-31-2013, 11:40 PM
http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af353/jasonleemiller/220px-The_Dude_Quincy_Jones_zps701a2bd8.jpg

wonkaticket
01-31-2013, 11:42 PM
Triple Dude...is that like Double Rainbow?

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/OQSNhk5ICTI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

DerekMichael
01-31-2013, 11:44 PM
Triple Dude...is that like Double Rainbow?

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/OQSNhk5ICTI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

I just have to say, my friend showed me this video a couple of summers ago, and I laughed so hard it physically hurt me.

If you have not watched this guy, you should check it out. He is SO happy.

teetwoohsix
02-01-2013, 05:11 AM
:cool:

sdkammeyer
02-01-2013, 07:39 AM
Nice cards Clayton. I noticed they are both "seated" and I assume that has a bit to do with it ..... I'm not sure I have any "seated" ...... but I can share a whole team standing/sitting around for the hell of it :)

whitehse
02-01-2013, 11:53 AM
Still waiting on the call John...You are letting me down, but then again, who didn't expect that? You are a pussy and everyone knows it. Again, the number is 229-630-1686 for the sixth time. I thought you emailed me saying you would be glad to air differences?? Dont tell me you got amnesia....

I find it ironic that in a thread that highlights the downfall of the PSA boards because of silly posters and attacks on each other would have a post such as this.

Maybe the newbies shouldnt be the only one's to be asked to sit back, watch and learn before posting with abandon! :)

wonkaticket
02-01-2013, 11:57 AM
Well Andrew in his defense I did disagree with him on something. :)

teetwoohsix
02-01-2013, 03:10 PM
Nice cards Clayton. I noticed they are both "seated" and I assume that has a bit to do with it ..... I'm not sure I have any "seated" ...... but I can share a whole team standing/sitting around for the hell of it :)

Thanks Steve~ beautiful Detroit PC !!! Great image.
I was just screwing around, figured I'd throw a couple of cards in the mix. :D

Sincerely, Clayton

freakhappy
02-01-2013, 03:13 PM
It looks like Mike and Jake have front row seats...where did the action go???;)

teetwoohsix
02-01-2013, 03:22 PM
It looks like Mike and Jake have front row seats...where did the action go???;)

:D I don't know but this is a bizarre thread.

Sincerely, Clayton

bigfish
02-01-2013, 06:51 PM
Still figures, no call...By the way John, have you ever wore a jock strap? Just curious....



I really feel like this is an important question John.... #@$#@#

sdkammeyer
02-01-2013, 07:22 PM
Thanks Steve~ beautiful Detroit PC !!! Great image.

Thank you as always. MUCH respect.