Show beginning 3/5 on CNBC called Treasure Detectives. Cobb-Edwards Wagner examined.

[t206wagner]

There is a new show starting 3/5 on CNBC. One of them is going to be examining the Cobb Wagner. Here is a video of part of the show. Should be interesting.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/100348957/Treasure_Detectives

[insidethewrapper]

C-scan of a baseball card. Interesting ! I'll be watching.

[Iron Horse]

Thanks for the heads up.

[cobblove]

hell yes!! LOL.
This is hilarious these guys are still going. It will never end. Have they tried selling it anymore after they found the garage grading company?

[cubsguy1969]

It's pretty obvious that the scanner is racist. :)

[Runscott]

Thanks for the heads up.

Maybe someday "heads up" will be "heads out". But then again, their payday may end up coming from the journey instead.

[bn2cardz]

hell yes!! LOL.
This is hilarious these guys are still going. It will never end. Have they tried selling it anymore after they found the garage grading company?

They did try an ebay auction again, but ebay took it down. They started a website (http://www.honuswagnerauction.com/) to help promote the ebay auction and commissioned a painting for the big auction. Of course all of this didn't help disguise the card from ebay.

[bn2cardz]

I think it is funny that the clip shows a different card than the Cobb-Edwards Wagner. I guess they figure if they showed the C-E Wagner it would be obvious to anyone before watching the clip that it was a fake.

The Cob-Edwards wagner is below the clip capture from the show.

[SushiX37]

That video on their website is mind-numbing. I made it about 16 minutes in and couldn't go anymore. When he described the grading process at ACA and the "light machine" that did "this and that" he sounded very knowledgable. ;)

Rich

[gnaz01]

They were offered $10,000 for the card and didn't jump at it????????? :confused::confused:

[pepis]

I'm hoping they would give my story a strong consideration.

[brob28]

My guess is they are getting paid to be on the show, so this is how they collect their payday - they've simply reduced expectations about the $ize of it.

I bet the CT scan will proove inconclusive! ;)

[tiger8mush]

someone should submit a lot of like 10 low-grade T206s (with 1 or 2 "aged" reprints) to ACA grading :)

edited to add: isn't it ironic that PSA was started in a similar way ... grading a T206 Wagner

[bbcard1]

I once had a chance to pick up some very old, very expensive packs and thought about checking into using a CT scanner to try to see what was inside...didn't work out and I don't know if 1) I would have done it and 2) it would have worked.

Weren't all T206s kind of stuck together in effect...the front is a different texture than the rear.

[cobblove]

almost time for the show.
Thought Id bump it to remind people

[FourStrikes]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RpJ0eVr-U0

DS

[jcmtiger]

Interesting show tonight, they went thru quite a few steps to insure authenticity on the 2 items.

Looks like the card might be on next weeks show.. Not sure but they did show it in the previews.

Joe

[Iron Horse]

Missed the show. Will it be on again?
Thanks

[deadballfreaK]

I saw it. Hard to tell with these fakey reality shows, but they seemed to follow every avenue to prove/disprove. I hope the Wagner is next week, but it might be a carrot to keep watching.

[deadballfreaK]

BTW, I made a fake Wagner. Sometime in the late 70s early 80s there was a baseball card magazine that had true sized, full color pics of all the rarest cards on the cover. I bought a lot of maybe 200 T206s in various grades. Got stuck with a Piedmont card that had 95% paper loss on the front. All you could see was it was a Cincinnati player. Worthless. So I cut the Wagner pic out of the magazine, glued em together, trimmed the edges, did a little bit of distressing. Wouldn't fool anyone here for two seconds, but its not bad. The front is too glossy, but put it under plastic and it looks fairly real. I use it for a joke when someone wants too see my collection. I'll throw that out there and I've had two or three gasp in amazement before I fessed up!

[t206wagner]

Missed the show. Will it be on again?
Thanks

Check their weekend schedule. That is usually when they rerun the shows like this. I am sure it will be on again.

[ullmandds]

There should be footage of the cobb/edwards segment...maybe on youtube? someone posted a preview to it a ways back...and you pretty much get the whole scenario and the results...SPOILER ALERT...ITS A FAKE ADHERED TO A REAL BACK!!!!!

[I Only Smoke 4 the Cards]

The show was entertaining but seemed a bit too long to me. However, I will watch just to see the reaction when they tell Cobb and Edwards that the card is no good.

[bn2cardz]

There should be footage of the cobb/edwards segment...maybe on youtube? someone posted a preview to it a ways back...and you pretty much get the whole scenario and the results...SPOILER ALERT...ITS A FAKE ADHERED TO A REAL BACK!!!!!

http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=3000139643

What I like the best about the video is that they pull the card out of a brown paper grocery bag. If I thought I was carrying a $300k item I would not carry it in a grocery bag.

[e107collector]

I watched the show last night, and agree that it was too long. They probably could've done the show in a half hour.

They showed a preview for next weeks episode, and it was the Wagner card.

Tony

[insidethewrapper]

Reminder for those interested. I'm sure this Wagner segment airs tonight at 9pm on CNBC.

[novakjr]

http://video.cnbc.com/gallery/?video=3000139643

What I like the best about the video is that they pull the card out of a brown paper grocery bag. If I thought I was carrying a $300k item I would not carry it in a grocery bag.

That card's like a fine wine. I equate their card to be the equivalent of mad dog, and these clowns are the wino's of the collecting world. Of course they'd have it in a brown bag...

[SushiX37]

It looks like they might crack it. There is a photo on their Facebook page showing a pair of hands in white gloves holding the raw card. No way can they possibly find this to be legit. I can't wait to watch tonight!

Rich

[SushiX37]

Here is the picture from their Facebook page (that I referenced above).

Rich

[ullmandds]

yes...the card looks so real in that pic...easy to see what all of the controversy is about?!

[AndyG09]

Ray looks guilty even talking about that garbage card and sweet holder.

[I Only Smoke 4 the Cards]

When they showed the card in the beginning you saw the edge and it looked glued together.

[mrvster]

This is great:D where can I get mine:confused::)

[Sterling Sports Auctions]

From Ray, Johnny, real cheap ;)

[wolterse]

Genuinely feel bad for the guy but hopefully this ends his pursuit of fortune for good.

[deadballfreaK]

Very dramatic, but I'll bet there are a hundred guys in this forum who could hold that card in their hand say fake in seconds.

[conor912]

I don't have cable. If anyone finds a link to the show, please post it. Thanks.

[EvilKing00]

looked pretty fake to me, also whats the deal with the company that graded it???

[jcmtiger]

Oh my Gosh, it's FAKE!!!!!!:rolleyes:

Joe

[insidethewrapper]

I never seen such a dirty old looking card with such great corners ! Why didn't they just take a few of the real T206's at the dealers shop and compare to the Wagner under a magnifier and see the dot difference ? Why , because the show would have been over in a minute ! This card didn't even have black lines in the border outline of the photo.

[z28jd]

Oh my Gosh, it's FAKE!!!!!!:rolleyes:

Joe

So the one I own is the only real one now?

[SushiX37]

Something tells me this isn't the last we've seen of him or that card.

Rich

[AMBST95]

Just watched the show. They stretched that out! Hopefully that's the end of the story with this story. I wonder how the grader feels having his business completely debunked on National TV!

[esd10]

i cant believe that so called grading company authenticated that card in the first place have they never seen a t206 befor? i think the guy really thought it was the real deal and he could have sold it years back for a nice chunk of change but didnt and now it might be the most valuable fake t206 ever produced.

[conor912]

Something tells me this isn't the last we've seen of him or that card.

Rich

Of course not. The card has most definitely acquired some value to someone at this point given all of the press/hype it has gotten with these two clowns and the show. It will turn up at auction at some point and set an unprecedented record for the most spent on a reprint card. Then it actually, ironically enough, will become the holy grail of fakes.

[AMBST95]

Someone should buy it and blow it up like they did with the Bartman Ball.

[carbonrosa]

Question, is it true that back in the 80's the card was only worth a few thousand like they mentioned? That would seam odd to me. It was sad though. He put so much faith into that card being real but what did he expect when he refused to have any reputable authenticator in the USA look at it. That card authenticator from Canada will deny deny deny with every excuse in the book.

[deadballfreaK]

Question, is it true that back in the 80's the card was only worth a few thousand like they mentioned? That would seam odd to me. It was sad though. He put so much faith into that card being real but what did he expect when he refused to have any reputable authenticator in the USA look at it. That card authenticator from Canada will deny deny deny with every excuse in the book.

I don't know about the 80s, but I remember a Wagner for sale in the mid to late 70s for $1200. I nearly jumped, but I was only making maybe $250 a week at the time and I had other responsibilities. UGH. No guts no glory.

[carbonrosa]

You're probably better off. Catching fakes has come a long way these days. You might of been in this guys same position.

[tbarlage]

My faith in reality TV has been restored! If they had found it real I would never consider watching that show again. Back looks real but still wrong in some way, the front is not right at all for the set. Wish I had a real Wagner to compare it to (Honus not Heinie of course)!

Do you think he was surprised when the grading guy showed up to open it? I thought they were going for "guess we'll never know" by keeping it in the case but was hard to argue for not opening it at that point.

[ethicsprof]

i was most surprised that the lamps weren't Tiffany. :)
all the best,
barry

[I Only Smoke 4 the Cards]

Cobb was noticably absent. Anyone know why?

[Iron Horse]

I think if i was them i would find an auction house that will now auction this very well known fake while it is in the news. Their only chance to make a few $$$ out of nothing. Publicity goes a long way.
Funny how something which looked fake to 99% of those on this board went so far on national tv. So much for CSA :D

[mrvster]

Lee!;)

....You ain't kiddn':) Great auctions btw...true meat and potatoes of our hobby, your a true gentleman and collector, and you have AWESOME auctions!:)

Barry,

I watched the show, and like Barry, lamps weren't Tiffany??;) I thought the show was real good, I think I'll watch it again...

I can't beleive it, but I actually felt bad for the guy! :oI really think he convinced himself it was the real deal....at first, after seeing the guy's reaction, I really feel he thought it was real!:eek:, or he is a great actor....as we all know, in about 1.2 seconds as soon as you see the card you can tell it's a fake 80's reprint like the GAZILLIONS that flood ebay each day......Johnny, btw, may I make an offer on your's??:D

Hearing the story for the past year or whatever, I never paid much attention to these guys, I just figured they were scammers trying to make a big payday and rip someone off.....but logic tells me, why in the world would anyone come on CNBC if they didn't convince himself it was the real deal??? or was he just trying to play it off like he "really" thought it was authentic just to avoid the legal ramifications if he tried to sell a reprint as the real deal for some stupid money????????????? I guess we'll never know....I know , for some reason, I try to find the good in some people , and maybe this guy has had his dreamed crushed was enough of a spanking to live and let live.....


I have a feeling this card will be auctioned and actually someone will pay a few hundred or maybe even 1 k for the novelty.....(btw, that's not me:))


anyway, glad this was laid to rest and now I can finally sleep knowing it isn't real;)

[thehoodedcoder]

at this point he should have to submit to a lie detector test to prove he really thinks it is not a fake.

if he passes, ok. maybe he really is that pathological and distrusting and its a personal flaw.

if he fails, it will be the last time we ever hear from this guy.

kevin

[Sean]

at this point he should have to submit to a lie detector test to prove he really thinks it is not a fake.

if he passes, ok. maybe he really is that pathological and distrusting and its a personal flaw.

if he fails, it will be the last time we ever hear from this guy.

kevin

Great idea. The story that I originally heard about these guys back in 2002 was that they had stolen this card from someone who had glued a fake front to a real Piedmont back. I would love to ask them where they got this card while they are taking this test.:rolleyes:

[vintagechris]

I don't know if this is the case or not, but the way he was acting reminded me of less than knowledgeable autograph collectors who have spent a bunch of money with people who sell forgeries and then when you tell them and show them evidence, they just don't want to believe it. They hold out hope that somehow it is real.

I have seen this countless times in the autograph hobby. You show them evidence that they are dealing with forgers and they look for every way they can to convince you and themselves that what they have bought is real. Sadly, many of them then try to sell and recoup $ just in case it isn't real.

[2dueces]

This this isn't the last we will hear of this card and the owners. It's been going on long enough but it ain't over. :(

[scooter729]

I was trying to find the original thread in the archives from many years ago - weren't these two guys on here arguing about this card back in 2005 or so? I can't find it, so I'm not sure if I am (as Roger Clemens would say) mis-remembering.

Can anyone help me find this if it really happened?

[murcerfan]

It seems like these clowns and Okeefe (the great defender of our hobby) owe some appologies....somehow I doubt that will ever happen. Time to drum up the next great hobby story to profit from.

[bn2cardz]

I was trying to find the original thread in the archives from many years ago - weren't these two guys on here arguing about this card back in 2005 or so? I can't find it, so I'm not sure if I am (as Roger Clemens would say) mis-remembering.

Can anyone help me find this if it really happened?



http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=81887&

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=81898& - This thread is started by one of them.

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=81976&

[scooter729]

Thanks Andy - will make for some fun lunchtime reading to go over these again!

[Deertick]

I really have to hand it to the producers (or the authenticators) of this show. They came out of the gate asking the hard common sense questions, and pretty much backed him in a corner by bringing in CSA. They knew it wasn't real from the get go, but their 'mission statement' is to be as close to 100% certain as possible.
I also felt that Edwards really thought it was authentic, and everyone up to this point were just being mean.

Last week they proved a Lalique hood ornament was authentic. The guy paid $1200 for it in a charity auction. Worth $300K! I am hooked. :)

[Hankphenom]

What a lot to do about nothing! One glance at the card showed it to be no more than the standard phony baked (or whatever) repro for which any one of us here or at any card show would have immediately taken a bet of 10 grand that it would turn out to be a phony. You have to give it to those guys, though, for taking something so patently bogus so far.

[deadballfreaK]

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=81887&

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=81898& - This thread is started by one of them.

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=81976&

I just spent an hour (can't sleep anyway) reviewing that old crap. Quite amusing. I wouldn't want to try and slip a good fake by this board, let alone that thing.

[npa589]

Wow, just read Cobb or Edwards' post on Net54 a while back....goodness. Is everyone still a racist for being "player haters" towards them? New question, what are the chances that "player" was an intended pun?


Red and yellow black or white, they are morons in my sight. No one trusts the silly two men with "TheCard".

[batsballsbases]

Well I just watched the show and the card was determined to be a fake. Didnt sit well with the owner of the card. May have been a real piedmont back but the front may have been glued on hence a peel job. The scan determined that the card wasnt a consistent thickness all the way thru,also the print matrix on the front wasnt right. No real surprise here! The owner didnt want to have it taken out of the slab(wonder why);)

[Clark7781]

Not that it didn't convince me (their analysis and investigation), but to really slam dunk their findings, it would have been more substantial had they scanned authentic T-206s, and a control T-206 that had been re-backed, and showed the audience the actual scientific comparison. Good TV....

Now the most important question: will this card go away????

Well I just watched the show and the card was determined to be a fake. Didnt sit well with the owner of the card. May have been a real piedmont back but the front may have been glued on hence a peel job. The scan determined that the card wasnt a consistent thickness all the way thru,also the print matrix on the front wasnt right. No real surprise here! The owner didnt want to have it taken out of the slab(wonder why);)

[JollyElm]

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=81887&

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=81898& - This thread is started by one of them.

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=81976&


I just started reading the "This thread is started by one of them" thread and all I can say is I'm so sorry our educational system has failed him so. Is this person even remotely familiar with grammar or did he just randomly hit the letters on his keyboard and hope he formed words and complete sentences???

[bn2cardz]

Out of boredom on my work break I was curious if Cobb's or Edward's had taken down their site or had released a comment and found this post from their facebook page (accompanied with a link about the PSA 8 wagner being trimmed) (https://www.facebook.com/TheCobbEdwardsT206HonusWagnerCard):

I have been saying this for years that the PSA-8 Wagner is alter. I have had every test done on my The Cobb/Edwards T206 Honus Wagner Card and pass every test and these other Wagner cards had no test done on them and can sell for millions. This Sh#t isn't right. Eleven years I have been fighting and still they want accept my card as the real deal. Even to go as far as to tell a open lie on TV Teasure Detective CNBC show. My card pass all the test on that show and the host of the show called my card a fake. Not right but I will win in the end. I put the challenge out to PSA, SGC to have a show down live on TV to prove to the world that my card is real or fake. No editng TV. Lets do the damm thing Joe Orlando at PSA. I need people to put pass on the word. Ray wants a show down live on TV....

I have to admit I would watch a show put out by PSA or SGC, but either way it looks like this saga isn't over yet.

[z28jd]

Is that Bill Hedin from this board telling the guy to keep up the fight on that facebook page? :confused:

[ullmandds]

It sure is Bill!!! Unbelievable to me that this runaway train is still rolling?!?!?!

What's more unbelievable is all of the support Ray is getting over a 1c reprint.

[Hankphenom]

Sometimes all you need is your eyes to tell you what's right and what's not. He could see all along the Gretzky Wagner wasn't right, and by God, those same eyes tell him his card IS the real deal. Don't ever give up, I say! Or at least not as long as you can get one more person to waste the time to pay the slightest bit of attention to this, the single stupidest hobby happening ever. Oh ####, I just realized--now that's me!

[Exhibitman]

That guy belongs in the same boat as Captain Ahab, Dale Gribble, and the 9/11 Truthers.

[cardaholic]

That guy belongs in the same boat as Captain Ahab, Dale Gribble, and the 9/11 Truthers.

There actually was a white whale. It sank the ship and killed Ahab (technically, he got pulled under by being caught in the harpoon rope).

We need a different example (maybe something out of Poe)?

[Cardboard Junkie]

How about...."Nevermore!"

[ctownboy]

I would be careful using the word "white" in any post relating to Cobb and Edwards..... :)

David