View Full Version : T205 Green Border cards- redux
I know we have gone over this before but here is another T205 I would like opinions on. Do you think this is green ink, faded or changed gold or something else?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1911-T205-Gold-Border-James-Austin-NY-Yankees-Ex-Clean-NO-CREASE-/170917667560?nma=true&item=170917667560&si=6IC5x0fI9Cx7xbLyHmweLW
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ethicsprof
10-10-2012, 10:19 AM
This one really surprised me.
Definitely green ink.
Quite a bargain for $49 methinks.
all the best,
barry
t206blogcom
10-10-2012, 10:21 AM
Green ink in my opinion. Could it just be missing the gold ink?
ullmandds
10-10-2012, 10:23 AM
personally...i think the gold material placed on the borders of t205's may have had copper in the mixture and over time...handling these cards the oils from the skin can react with copper to turn green.
sportscardpete
10-10-2012, 10:30 AM
I really don't think it was intentionally made to be Green. Some chemical reaction had to have happened for the colors to turn..
Reminds me of -
75960
brianp-beme
10-10-2012, 11:17 AM
It may be green, but to me it looks like the scan has been altered, because overall the rest of the card doesn't look like natural T205 coloring.
Brian
ullmandds
10-10-2012, 11:19 AM
I agree in that the scan is altered. Either that of it's the "rare" green faced version!
freakhappy
10-10-2012, 12:07 PM
It may be green, but to me it looks like the scan has been altered, because overall the rest of the card doesn't look like natural T205 coloring.
Brian
I was thinking the same thing...something looks off in the picture. Definitely looks green from the scan though.
Runscott
10-10-2012, 12:19 PM
Green ink in my opinion. Could it just be missing the gold ink?
That's what happened Jason.
Color enhanced image so it's hard to tell.
The metal could turn greenish (See Statue of Liberty), but not green like that.
If I had to guess, I'd guess ink. Metal-free T205s are seen from time to time, but it's usually yellow underneath not green. My guess is they used yellow to match the then shiny penny metal.
I should have the card in hand in a few days. At that time I will make a different scan, definitely not enhanced (not sure this one is but could be) and we can compare. I think it's green ink but it could be something else. For those that don't see the green, I thought only "I" was color blind :).
packs
10-10-2012, 02:58 PM
A lot of 58 green border cards sold for just over $2,000 in an REA auction a year or so ago. The cards in that lot looked different from this one. They were badly faded and most were hand cut.
Collecting cards, memorabilia and antiques involves coming across things you haven't seen before.
barrysloate
10-10-2012, 03:05 PM
As has been pointed out, the seller didn't adjust his colors right when he scanned the card. There's too much green in the whole image, so when you get it, the borders are probably going to look a little different.
My guess is it's green, just not as bright as in the scan. It certainly isn't yellow.
packs
10-10-2012, 04:13 PM
The REA green border lot breaks down to about 35 bucks a card and included major HOFers like Cy Young and Walter Johnson. Good buy for the person who got it.
marcdelpercio
10-10-2012, 06:15 PM
I believe that the gold ink contains traces of copper which can oxidize and turn green when in the presence of other chemicals. A lot of these cards were probably exposed to various glues and pastes as well as water and who knows what other chemicals if they were ever removed from a scrapbook, etc.
I don't think that the borders without gold ink would be green. I assume they would be white as can be seen on a number of the minor league cards that have off centered ink registrations on the borders.
Wite3
10-10-2012, 06:33 PM
Well...most t205s have white or yellow under the gold border. I own several green bordered t205s and often I feel that the gold has turned (but sometimes I am just not sure). Many of these are in awful condition. Oxidation can turn the metal to green if it has traces of copper.
I am still not sure what happened with these. Other than running a chemical test on the two inks to see if they are the same except one is oxidized (rusted) we may never know.
Joshua
Exhibitman
10-10-2012, 06:37 PM
Oxidation and wear are my bets. Does anyone have a sharp, clean T205 green bordered card to share?
danmckee
10-10-2012, 06:49 PM
I know we have gone over this before but here is another T205 I would like opinions on. Do you think this is green ink, faded or changed gold or something else?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1911-T205-Gold-Border-James-Austin-NY-Yankees-Ex-Clean-NO-CREASE-/170917667560?nma=true&item=170917667560&si=6IC5x0fI9Cx7xbLyHmweLW
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Bad scan, look at the green on the interior
Bad scan, look at the green on the interior
If the card looks close to the scan then that will be fine. If it doesn't look anything close to it then I will take advantage of the sellers 14 day return policy. My guess is the scan might be a little off but not a lot. We shall see.
Pup6913
10-11-2012, 02:59 AM
Oxidation and wear are my bets. Does anyone have a sharp, clean T205 green bordered card to share?
Adam they don't exist in that condition. I think a few sheets missed the gold border pass and were trashed and some were saved and cut. Most of the "True" green borders we see today are in really rough shape, missing the entire gold pass(not the ones with wear or light passes), and have hand cut characteristics. I do think these are real 205 printer scraps.
ullmandds
10-11-2012, 07:23 AM
So how would y'all categorize this card?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ira-Thomas-1911-T205-Gold-Border-/310466123040?_trksid=p4340.m1850&_trkparms=aid%3D222002%26algo%3DSIC.FIT%26ao%3D1%2 6asc%3D11%26meid%3D2665059190652901555%26pid%3D100 011%26prg%3D1005%26rk%3D4%26sd%3D170917667560%26
So how would y'all categorize this card?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ira-Thomas-1911-T205-Gold-Border-/310466123040?_trksid=p4340.m1850&_trkparms=aid%3D222002%26algo%3DSIC.FIT%26ao%3D1%2 6asc%3D11%26meid%3D2665059190652901555%26pid%3D100 011%26prg%3D1005%26rk%3D4%26sd%3D170917667560%26
It's a T205.
ullmandds
10-11-2012, 07:43 AM
thx a lot Leon!
Tyler
10-11-2012, 07:44 AM
How about this one? Are the black borders a common thing, compared to the green?
<a href="http://s210.photobucket.com/albums/bb189/Tyjaycox/?action=view&current=dygert.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb189/Tyjaycox/dygert.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
ullmandds
10-11-2012, 07:55 AM
Can anyone post all of the different "border" variations known on this...T205 issues y'all speak of?!
Perhaps this will be cause for the come-uppance of T205...finally...but I doubt it??!?!?
peterb69
10-11-2012, 09:39 AM
My guess is that green ink is laid down (borders) and then the gold ink was layed ontop of the green. From the ebay photo, this card looks like it got extra green passes and no gold.
packs
10-11-2012, 11:00 AM
There are a lot of minor league cards that didn't get fully coated with gold ink but their bare borders are white. I don't think green was laid down before the gold. This card has both "green borders" and no borders at all.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/T205-Card-Minor-League-JAMES-FRICK-Newark-HASSAN-GD-VG-/220796687780
Pup6913
10-11-2012, 12:36 PM
There are a lot of minor league cards that didn't get fully coated with gold ink but their bare borders are white. I don't think green was laid down before the gold. This card has both "green borders" and no borders at all.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/T205-Card-Minor-League-JAMES-FRICK-Newark-HASSAN-GD-VG-/220796687780
That card is designed that way as is several other ML 205's. It's amazing how many people speculate when all you have to do is look. There is red, green, white, yellow, pink, and so on under the gold pass. There was NO specific color laid first. What ever color the card is dictates what color is under the boarders.
As for Leon's card. The seller had a few others FS. This card has been up for a months off and on. All the cards had this weird hue to them. All probably from the scans/pics. Anyone look at feedback to see any other cards they sold or pics of items???
packs
10-11-2012, 12:59 PM
Which do you think they printed first, the borders or the image?
Pup6913
10-11-2012, 01:12 PM
Which do you think they printed first, the borders or the image?
The boarders were last to print
As for Leon's card. The seller had a few others FS. This card has been up for a months off and on. All the cards had this weird hue to them. All probably from the scans/pics. Anyone look at feedback to see any other cards they sold or pics of items???
That is a good point Andrew. His other listed T205s do have some "greenish" issues. As I said, the seller has a good return policy though that obviously isn't something I hope to do. But if the scan is a lot different than what the card looks like, and it very well could be, then back it will go. I don't mind a little bit of a difference but not a lot.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1911-T205-Gold-Border-Ed-Cicotte-Black-Sox-Red-Sox-PSA-2-Good-Shows-Better-/180993235990?pt=US_Baseball
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Pup6913
10-11-2012, 02:34 PM
That is a good point Andrew. His other listed T205s do have some "greenish" issues. As I said, the seller has a good return policy though that obviously isn't something I hope to do. But if the scan is a lot different than what the card looks like, and it very well could be, then back it will go. I don't mind a little bit of a difference but not a lot.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1911-T205-Gold-Border-Ed-Cicotte-Black-Sox-Red-Sox-PSA-2-Good-Shows-Better-/180993235990?pt=US_Baseball
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Leon I wish you the best on it. I will be kicking myself if it turns out to be like anticipated. I should have bought them all then:) It's a good gamble with that kind of return policy.
Wite3
10-11-2012, 06:17 PM
That Cicotte looks like it has blue Sweet Cap. back!
It does look like it was wet at some point in time which leads me to an oxidation for that one.
Joshua
Not green. Already got the ok for a return. Seller was very nice. ...and here is the other green one that I think really is green.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1911-T205-Go...9Cx7xbLyHmweLW
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Pup6913
10-16-2012, 06:58 PM
Leon that one looks good as long as it has no gold on it. Looks like on the left side to be cut by hand possibly. I still think those are scraps and even some with a light layer of gold may be also. Printer defects cut or discarded. They all are in bad shape. Haven't seen any in good shape like that.