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View Full Version : Lou Gehrig Cut Autograph---I really need help


Donscards
06-27-2012, 09:47 AM
I am looking at this Lou Gehrig Cut Autograph---I know most are always bad---I just cant tell on this one. It does look good to me--but I am not a expert---I know there are alot of good Autograph people on here and would like there opinion on this Gehrig.---I am going to the National and would love to take this along---I would have JSA look at the cut there---but it would help me before hand.----If the cut doesnt look right to you---just let me know or Good, it would be even better. thanks in advance. Don

RichardSimon
06-27-2012, 09:53 AM
I would avoid this one.

David Atkatz
06-27-2012, 09:54 AM
it's no good, Don.

GrayGhost
06-27-2012, 09:54 AM
I would avoid this one.

+1

daves_resale_shop
06-27-2012, 10:50 AM
L is way off...

Donscards
06-27-2012, 11:22 AM
Wow thanks guys great to have this forum---the seller has a large collection---I felt some were bad---wasnt sure on the Gehrig----but thanks again to the 4 replys---you guys know your stuff---Don

travrosty
06-27-2012, 12:22 PM
please dont pay 150 bucks for some guy behind a curtain that you cant see take a guess at it when they have such horrible track records on such items. what a waste that would be.

JimStinson
06-27-2012, 12:27 PM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !
I could probably even guess the artist

JimStinson
06-27-2012, 12:35 PM
---the seller has a large collection---I felt some were bad---wasnt sure on the Gehrig-
If you have a glass of clear cold water and you place a drop of urine in it you have a glass full of urine. NOT a glass of cold water with a little urine in in.

travrosty
06-27-2012, 12:41 PM
it's really indicative of the problem of "cut" autographs. Not all are always bad, but they are cuts for a reason most of the time. If you see a cut, that should get your radar up first and foremost. They like to frame them with other nice pieces and elaborate frames to dazzle, but it's still a cut and proceed with caution. but this particular one does not look right.

JimStinson
06-27-2012, 12:51 PM
Good point made above but lately I have even been offered Government postcards (with postmarks) and even personal checks , that are extremely well executed forgeries

prewarsports
06-27-2012, 01:32 PM
There are legit Gehrig and Ruth cuts out there, I have had some that came out of Watermans autograph books (the kids were supposed to cut them off letters and paste them in) but in general cuts were pasted into books and there was a REASON they were cut! If you ever find a cut that looks Near Mint or there is no glue residue on the back etc., then be EXTRA cautious. Why would someone cut something and then keep it in mint condition and never glue it to a display or something? Answer...... they didn't.

Rhys

travrosty
06-27-2012, 01:38 PM
forgers will buy common, old books and use the old paper for several cut opportunities from a few blank pages in one old book. and if they screw up, they haven't ruined anything of value, just a piece of an old piece of paper. so it is low cost, low risk, high reward.

gnaz01
06-27-2012, 01:39 PM
If you have a glass of clear cold water and you place a drop of urine in it you have a glass full of urine. NOT a glass of cold water with a little urine in in.

Jim, never heard this analogy, but it is incredible. Can I use it in my business practice??

JimStinson
06-27-2012, 02:19 PM
Its cool I agree ! but in all fairness its a quote that I stole...I mean "Borrowed" from autograph dealer Bill Corcoran
______________
stinsonsports.com

Wymers Auction
06-28-2012, 12:41 AM
forgers will buy common, old books and use the old paper for several cut opportunities from a few blank pages in one old book. and if they screw up, they haven't ruined anything of value, just a piece of an old piece of paper. so it is low cost, low risk, high reward.
I contacted an auction house not long ago about this same thing. They had tons of cuts from the same paper source. It was lined paper with a red line and it was pretty easy to tell it was the same. They had Cobb, Speaker, Ruth, Wagner, and many more. I asked them if they really think that someone got all of these on a single paper and then cut it all up and also they do not care what it brings when it sells. The cuts sold for almost nothing at all.

travrosty
06-28-2012, 11:35 AM
the trick for them is to get one of these cuts past a major tpa. then you have a gold brick. i have seen ruth cuts to make one blush with a coa from abc, xyz, and qrs. help!

J.McMurry
06-28-2012, 12:07 PM
I wonder if the TPG's ever take notice when they receive a high percentage of fake material from the same submitter? :confused:

mschwade
06-28-2012, 12:09 PM
What about the guys that buy autograph album books and/or team sheets and think they could make more money cutting up the book and selling them as individual cuts? REA, for example, had a Joe Giard cut out of an autograph book in their last auction. REA, however, had a picture of the autograph book included with the auction lot before the signature was cut-out.

Mr. Zipper
06-28-2012, 02:14 PM
I wonder if the TPG's ever take notice when they receive a high percentage of fake material from the same submitter? :confused:

Yes they do.

Mr. Zipper
06-28-2012, 02:21 PM
If you have a glass of clear cold water and you place a drop of urine in it you have a glass full of urine. NOT a glass of cold water with a little urine in in.

I think it's a safe be that anyone with a large autograph collection has, over the years, unknowingly obtained a clunker or two. Are you saying you wouldn't bother looking at a collection that may happen to have a few bad ones in it?

:confused:

J.McMurry
06-29-2012, 11:59 AM
So,if they do pay attention to who submits a high number of bad material, the TPG's could actually be a big help in tracking down forgers or at least the middleman. My question is do they or have they ever taken that step?

RichardSimon
06-29-2012, 12:50 PM
So,if they do pay attention to who submits a high number of bad material, the TPG's could actually be a big help in tracking down forgers or at least the middleman. My question is do they or have they ever taken that step?

Very good question, not like there is an authenticator-client privilege :D.

Wymers Auction
06-29-2012, 01:31 PM
So,if they do pay attention to who submits a high number of bad material, the TPG's could actually be a big help in tracking down forgers or at least the middleman. My question is do they or have they ever taken that step?
What upside would there be for them? Loss of revenue?

mighty bombjack
06-29-2012, 10:02 PM
What upside would there be for them? Loss of revenue?

Very good point. Remember, tpas make money whether they deem an auto real or fake, they would have no interest in stopping a flood of bogus submissions.