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View Full Version : Maris Signed Dual Card - Add Another Sig or Keep It Single Signed?


scmavl
06-19-2012, 02:58 PM
Some discussion started up on the June Pickups thread about this and I'm curious about others opinions. Would you have Frank Robinson sign it or leave it single signed? Remember, Frank's auto is not near as scarce as Maris and his signature quality has gone down drastically in the past few years.

Would having Frank add or take away value? Make it look better or perhaps worse?

Opinions? Thoughts?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v258/santaclausmachine/Maris75.jpg

39special
06-19-2012, 03:41 PM
I would leave it as it is.Robinsons signature is really bad.The Maris is nice.
I think it would take away from the Maris.

milkit1
06-19-2012, 03:45 PM
most definetly add robinson. I can't stand incompletes! I have a marx brothers photo signed only by chico whom died first and everyone I see it I think "why didnt the original owner get the others?!?!". you owe it to posterity ;)

jgmp123
06-19-2012, 03:51 PM
Although I love Maris, I would get Robinson. It would complete the card. Unless you were planning on framing the Maris as a cut, I would add Robinson.

mr2686
06-19-2012, 03:54 PM
Well, first off I think both points that have been brought up are valid and normally I would be on the fence. However, I recently had Stan Musial sign a 3000 hit Sports Illustrated (the one when Aaron got his 3000 and his picture is surrounded by the other, at the time, 3000 hit members). Aaron's sig is perfect but Musial's sig is sooooo bad that it really bothers me. I mean, it is what it is, but if Robinson's sig is getting as bad as others have said, then I'd skip it...or at least prepare for what the possible outcome might be.

travrosty
06-19-2012, 04:05 PM
if money is your motivator, keep it single signed.

if you want it complete, and think robinson makes the piece look nicer, then get robinson, but it will be worth more with just maris. thats just a fact.


babe ruth single signed ball is worth more than if you added hank aarons sig to it. if not, then people would be getting aaron, who is still alive, to sign their single signed ruth balls, but they aren't. it's subtraction by addition in some cases.

either way is fine though. it is perfectly fine to look at value over aesthetics or completeness, and also perfectly fine to do it the other way around.

keithsky
06-19-2012, 04:44 PM
Jarrod, I have the same example with a 1959 Topps dual card with Nellie Fox and Luis Aparicio. The card has the Fox autograph on it encapsulated with PSA and I thought of breaking it open and putting Aparicio on it to so both have signed it but decided not to so I bought another one of the cards unsigned and got Aparicio to sign it and I'll put both cards in some kind of display.

Scott Garner
06-19-2012, 04:50 PM
Well, first off I think both points that have been brought up are valid and normally I would be on the fence. However, I recently had Stan Musial sign a 3000 hit Sports Illustrated (the one when Aaron got his 3000 and his picture is surrounded by the other, at the time, 3000 hit members). Aaron's sig is perfect but Musial's sig is sooooo bad that it really bothers me. I mean, it is what it is, but if Robinson's sig is getting as bad as others have said, then I'd skip it...or at least prepare for what the possible outcome might be.

Frank Robbie used to have one of the nicest, stylish sigs going, but here is what I believe is a current look at what his autograph looks like.

Perhaps this will help guide your decision...

bender07
06-19-2012, 04:51 PM
if money is your motivator, keep it single signed.

if you want it complete, and think robinson makes the piece look nicer, then get robinson, but it will be worth more with just maris. thats just a fact.


babe ruth single signed ball is worth more than if you added hank aarons sig to it. if not, then people would be getting aaron, who is still alive, to sign their single signed ruth balls, but they aren't. it's subtraction by addition in some cases.

either way is fine though. it is perfectly fine to look at value over aesthetics or completeness, and also perfectly fine to do it the other way around.

Not sure if I agree with the Ruth ball analogy. Apples and oranges. With both guys pictured on the card, it's begging for both to sign it.

Interesting discussion...

Is Frank's autograph that bad? I saw him sign some stuff last year at the HOF induction and it looked fine.

bender07
06-19-2012, 04:52 PM
Frank Robbie used to have one of the nicest, stylish sigs going, but here is what I believe is a current look at what his autograph looks like.

Perhaps this will help guide your decision...

Eeeeh, that does look rough. Too bad.

packs
06-19-2012, 05:24 PM
My opinion is from a value POV.

I think the card is one of the least desirable Maris cards to have signed. That's not to say it isn't a great card and a great signature. I just think its not on a lot of Maris collectors' want lists because it wasn't issued during his career and he shares it with another player.

I think adding Robinson would increase the appeal of the card to general autograph collectors, which would then make your card more valuable.

I could see it selling for more to someone because both players signed it than I can for it to sell to a Maris collector.

scmavl
06-19-2012, 06:29 PM
Thanks for all of the opinions guys... Keep it going.

Personally, I really like that Maris sig and would hate for it to be "compromised" if FRobby signed it and ran his sig into Maris. Or if it was just an awful sig... However, Frank would balance it out...

travrosty
06-19-2012, 07:01 PM
single signed by a long deceased player is almost always more desirable than adding a current living player to it.

if an old card featured lou gehrig and bobby doerr sharin a card, and it was signed by gehrig, would you go and get doerr to sign it now? looking at it from a $$$ perspective it would be worth more with just gehrig. but from another perspective you might want both. there is no wrong way but adding robinson doesnt make sense if you look at it strictly froma $$$ angle.

packs
06-19-2012, 07:19 PM
I'm not sure if that's true when we're talking about this particular card. For Gehrig to sign a card it would have had to have been issued during his career. That's an entirely different scenario. If this particular Maris card was issued during his career and featured Frank Robinson, then I would say no, don't add a signature. However, this card was not issued during Maris' career. I think most Maris collectors would pass on this card and wait for a card issued during his career.

I think Robinson's signature with Maris' would appeal to a different set of collectors than the card presently does.

Just my opinion.

travrosty
06-19-2012, 07:53 PM
i respect your opinion. its definitely maris collectors vs. autographed card collectors in general.

Scott Garner
06-20-2012, 09:29 AM
i respect your opinion. its definitely maris collectors vs. autographed card collectors in general.

Travis,
I would agree with this, FWIW.

jmhockey23
06-20-2012, 11:07 AM
I say get it signed. The card is incomplete as is, with Frank's signature the complete version will get more interest, especially from 1975 autographed set collectors.

jcking2722
06-20-2012, 11:38 AM
I would have said to get it signed by Robinson before seeing that signature. But I kind of like the suggestion of getting the same card and having Frank sign it and then displaying them together somehow. Just my 2 cents.

Josh

jgmp123
06-20-2012, 12:06 PM
I would have said to get it signed by Robinson before seeing that signature. But I kind of like the suggestion of getting the same card and having Frank sign it and then displaying them together somehow. Just my 2 cents.

Josh


Completely agree with going this route.

Scott Garner
06-20-2012, 12:40 PM
Completely agree with going this route.

Or, alternatively, pick up an autographed Frank Robinson signed version of this card from when his signature still looked great, and display them together. If you could find a nice Frank Robbie signed in blue sharpie, you would have a winner, IMHO...

Fuddjcal
06-20-2012, 03:31 PM
Here's my dilemma.... many of you have seen this, but the thought had crossed my mind on having Yogi sign it too before it's too late?

I already have it professionally framed and displayed, so I'm never gonna break it out, but i thought I'd get your views on it here....

pooh528
06-20-2012, 03:37 PM
I posted on the other thread. From a value standpoint, given that this is probably one of Maris' least popular cards, I think it more valuable signed by both. The main market for this card I think would be set collectors, and when Robinson can no longer sign the card, I think that will significantly impact the value. As I said in the other thread, that 1968 topps card on ebay signed by Mays and Mantle and not Killebrew is in my opinion worth probably $200-$300 less than it wouldbe otherwise. Also, there are a bunch of those Maris signed cards around, but one signed by both would be that much rarer in my mind From a personal viewpoint, I am a sucker for multi signed cards

pooh528
06-20-2012, 03:38 PM
And I would add Berra to that Stengel for the same reasons.

Mr. Zipper
06-20-2012, 04:36 PM
Here's my dilemma.... many of you have seen this, but the thought had crossed my mind on having Yogi sign it too before it's too late?

I already have it professionally framed and displayed, so I'm never gonna break it out, but i thought I'd get your views on it here....

I would have that magazine in the mail tomorrow to Berra.

While his signature has declined slightly, it still presents well and still bears a strong resemblance to his signature from the era of that magazine. I would send him a black fiber tipped pen similar to what Casey used.

mr2686
06-20-2012, 05:10 PM
Chuck, I would also have it in the mail to Yogi tomorrow. He still has a good sig but I'm not sure how much longer it will last. I have the same mag but with only Yogi and would kill to have it with both of them. Any chance that this one will ever be up for sale?

mordecaibrown
06-20-2012, 05:29 PM
Maris/Robinson - If Frank signature had not deteriorated recently, I would have said have him sign it; however, having seen that recent signature - there is no way I would have him sign that card. It would drive me crazy to look at that beautiful Maris signature and see the Robinson scribble.

Stengal/Berra - I agree with others and would have Yogi sign that soon. I had him sign a ball for me about 6 months ago and his signature was still very good! I know it would be tough to break something out of a custom framing (cost, etc); however, you can always reframe something, you ony have a limited time to have Yogi sign that item.

Best of luck to both of you in your decision.

Andy

Lordstan
06-20-2012, 05:35 PM
My answer to both item is to get the second signature.

I can understand the person searching for just a Maris sig might prefer to have just him on the card alone. On the other hand, I think the card collector will pay significantly more for a card with both. This will be especially true once Robinson passes.
In my mind, someone looking for just a Maris example can probably find nicer examples to display. That is not a shot at this card. It's just that a nice 3x5 will display more nicely than a signed card like that one. If it were a Maris Rookie or 61 topps card the situation would be entirely different. Obviously, they would sell for way more than a 3x5, but then we wouldn't be thinking of getting anyone else to sign it either.
I liken getting those items signed to this. If you had a "league batting leaders of 1927" card of Ruth and, say, Paul Waner. Would you rather have the card signed by Ruth alone or Waner as well? Perhaps, at that time, Waner wasn't nearly as important, but now I think the value would be much higher with the pair together, even for a non set collector.
The same holds true for the Sports Illustrated. As a signed Sport magazine collector, I cannot tell how many times I have repeated the phrase "Gee it's too bad they didn't get so and so to sign it before he passed" Will Berra's sig make it worth more tomorrow? Not a lot, but a week after Yogi passes...it'll be a different story.
Just my 2c.

Scott Garner
06-20-2012, 05:58 PM
I would have that magazine in the mail tomorrow to Berra.

While his signature has declined slightly, it still presents well and still bears a strong resemblance to his signature from the era of that magazine. I would send him a black fiber tipped pen similar to what Casey used.

I absolutely agree with Zip! The minimal cost of re-doing the framing job would not stop me from making that happen. Yogi's autograph is still pretty solid, IMHO.

mr2686
06-20-2012, 06:09 PM
Actually, the cost of reframing could be quite small depending on how the framer put the magazine in. If it has an attachd back matting, then I'd take out the whole thing and send it to Berra, mat and all. If it's floating, meaning that it's encapsulated in a magazine plastic holder, then the mag will come right out and can be replaced. The only problem would be if no back plate...I would then recommend detaching the magazine completely and sending only it in. But the cost of putting it back in and closing it up shouldn
't be more than 20 bucks tops.

Big Six
06-22-2012, 11:26 AM
I would see if you could find an exemplar of Robinson on a flat, not a ball, before making your decision. Signing a ball has to be one of the hardest things to do as you get older...and since you'd be asking him to sign a card, looking at his current signature on a flat would be more representative of what you'd end up with.

Assuming you are comfortable with the quality of Frank's signature today, I say finish the card...the completist in me would go nuts seeing only half the card signed...just as having all three guys on Cal Ripken's rookie card would be what I'd want, not just Cal alone...

Whatever you decide to do, you'll have a great piece! Take care Jarrod...Matt

Lordstan
06-22-2012, 02:27 PM
Here is a flat I had signed by Robinson last September at a show.
I think it is also a good exemplar, because he signed in a small space, like would be needed on a card.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v222/lordstan/Sport%20Magazine/Sport195913BaseballReview.jpg

Fuddjcal
06-22-2012, 02:50 PM
I absolutely agree with Zip! The minimal cost of re-doing the framing job would not stop me from making that happen. Yogi's autograph is still pretty solid, IMHO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Zipper
I would have that magazine in the mail tomorrow to Berra.

While his signature has declined slightly, it still presents well and still bears a strong resemblance to his signature from the era of that magazine. I would send him a black fiber tipped pen similar to what Casey used.
I absolutely agree with Zip! The minimal cost of re-doing the framing job would not stop me from making that happen. Yogi's autograph is still pretty solid, IMHO.

Thanks for the input guys....Maybe when I feel adventurous, I'll give it a try....

I have never done anything like this through the mail. Maybe you can PM me Zip and coach me through the best way to accomplish it:? Where to send it and what not. I know you have done it many times. It's a pretty thin Mag cover. I can just see Yogi trying to sign it ripping it to shreds.:D