How do you as a collector define “Rarity”?

[wonkaticket]

Rare a word that is tossed around more than a kickball at recess in our hobby, but what really is rare and when should that word be applied to an item?

How do you as collectors define “rare” what is your scale of this term? I’m sure everyone sees it different and that’s what I’m curious to know.

My scale or how I would define rare is below.


1-10 Examples known “Rare”
10-20+ Examples known “Exceptionally Scarce”
20-50+ Examples known “Very Scarce”
50-100 Examples known “Scarce”
100-250 Examples known “Tough”
250-500 Examples known “Very Difficult”
500-1000 Examples known “Difficult”


So what is your thinking? Love to hear it.

Cheers,

John

[calvindog]

Anything I'm looking to buy: difficult. Anything I'm looking to sell: rare.

[bn2cardz]

anything i'm looking to buy: Difficult. Anything i'm looking to sell: Rare.

haha
+1

[Leon]

Rare a word that is tossed around more than a kickball at recess in our hobby, but what really is rare and when should that word be applied to an item?

How do you as collectors define “rare” what is your scale of this term? I’m sure everyone sees it different and that’s what I’m curious to know.

My scale or how I would define rare is below.


1-10 Examples known “Rare”
10-20+ Examples known “Exceptionally Scarce”
20-50+ Examples known “Very Scarce”
50-100 Examples known “Scarce”
100-250 Examples known “Tough”
250-500 Examples known “Very Difficult”
500-1000 Examples known “Difficult”


So what is your thinking? Love to hear it.

Cheers,

John

I like the list John. However, for me personally, anything with a quantity of 100+ loses some interest for me. I really enjoy collecting things of 5 or less known....Two of the three items I won in the last 2 days fit the less than 5 known category.

[bn2cardz]

I have never read the word scarce and rare as different words. Even from a definition stand point the word rare is used to define scarce. Yet I know in collecting good doesn't really mean good.

Either way I have used both words for cards less than 100 and never used qualifiers (extremely or very).

[rainier2004]

I call cards with a couple hundred example "rare" and everything else maybe "hard to find". I only posses 2 cards with less than 10 examples and refer to them the same as my cards with 50 examples. I do notice a large portion of members refer to 1915 CJs as "common" and "all over the place" when there are only a couple hundred examples of every card. The term seems to change in relation to attitude at times. I had to do a double take on the thread title as Zach had asked a similar question:

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=150253&highlight=scarce

[Bicem]

rare for me is one or less.

[barrysloate]

As I mentioned in a previous thread, the coin hobby has a widely used rarity scale, and it's very specific. In other words, if a coin is in the category of say 7-9 known, and then a 10th one is found, it slips down to the next lower tier.

John's scale is a reasonable one but subject to opinion. Whether 1-10 is extremely rare, or 1-5 is, is debatable. We talked about the possibility of creating a rarity scale for baseball cards based on the number of each card known, but most of the people who responded didn't think it would catch on.

And looking closer at John's scale 500-1000 known doesn't strike me as very difficult. I would consider that relatively common.

[RobertGT]

Anything I'm looking to buy: difficult. Anything I'm looking to sell: rare.

This is good stuff.:D

[g_vezina_c55]

card with 150 or 200 example or less are rare for me.

card with 15 example or less in extremely rare or impossible to find in my language :)

The internet change the signafication of the word 'rare'. before the internet , it was hard to find card with 200 example or less... but now with the internet this kind of card (200 or less ) became more easy to find.

[sycks22]

I was reading a recent catalog and it talked about how there are 50 of this specific card graded making it "rare". Any card that has 50 total graded isn't rare. It was from the 1960's to boot.

[mrvster]

John, Love the topic....

i like your scale.....going to take a shot...

1 = unique
1-3 = impossible
3-5 = ultra rare
5-10 =very rare
10-30 =rare
30-50 =scarce
50-70 =tough
70-100 =very difficult
100-200=difficult
200-500=tougher
500-600=less common
600-1000=common


1000+ why bother:)


:D

[Baseball Rarities]

Here is the scale that has been used in the coin market for years:

■R-8: This is a unique coin; only 1 exists
■R-7 High: A coin that’s excessively rare; 2 to 3 exist
■R-7 Low: An extremely rare coin with 4 to 12 remaining known
■R-6: A very rare coin with 13 to 30 known specimens
■R-5: 31 to 75 coins exist, classifying it as rare
■R-4: A very scarce coin with 76 to 200 examples left
■R-3: With 201 to 500 estimated pieces, this is a scarce coin
■R-2: A coin that is not common, with 501 to 1250 coins in existence
■R-1: With at least 1251 coins remaining, this is a common coin

[barrysloate]

Kevin,
I know of a slightly different scale that is used for large cent varieties so the coin hobby may have more than one:

R8+: unique
R8 : 2 known
R8- : 3
R7+ : 4-6
R7 : 7-9
R7-: 10-12
R6+: 13-18
R6 : 19-25
R6-: 26-30
R5+: 31-45
R5 : 46-60...

And it continues on to R1, which is 1500 or more known of the variety. Maybe different areas of the coin hobby have their own scale.

[Baseball Rarities]

Barry,

I just copied the coin scale off of the internet. I am not sure what year it is from - I was just showing an example of the coin industry's take on it.

I think that it has basically stayed the same over the years, except that they have broken down each of the numerical categories - R8+, R8, R8-. The orginal Sheldon scale from the 1940's or 50's just had R1 through R8 with no subcategories. I think that the scale that you are referencing is the most up to date.

[Exhibitman]

Yeah, Jeff's pretty much got it right... ;)

It's kinda like porn; I know it when I see it.

I'd define "rare" in terms of how hard it is to get the card for my collection, money and condition notwithstanding. If a card shows up once every few years, that's rare. If I can buy a specimen tomorrow if I want to complete a set, that's common. Everything else is degrees. The T206 Wags and Plank [common back] are not rare; the error Doyle and Cobb/Cobb are. I can't afford any of them but if I had the cash I'd have a Wagner or a Plank, but I'd probably be sitting around waiting for the others to show up.

I don't consider "condition rarities" to be rare, for reasons I've blathered on about repeatedly in the past: subjectivity establishing the 'grade', lack of true population vs. graded numbers, etc.

[barrysloate]

That's probably it Kevin. Over time the +'s and -'s were added to make it more precise.

[atx840]

The R rating seems about right to me, however should sample size be considered(coins minted vs cards printed)?

For T206's Im not sure any card is considered rare outside of the Doyle, maybe a few of the errors (ghosts, test strips).

[bcbgcbrcb]

Anything other than a T206.........

[fkw]

If I see one offered for sale only once every 5-10 years, I call it Very Rare!

only T206 that is Rare is the Doyle..... the Wagner, Plank, and Magie are all Scarce IMO

[MVSNYC]

John- looks pretty good, but I think you need to refer to some of the auction house descriptions to get some stronger language at the top of your list:

extremely rare
excedingly rare

etc...

[kmac32]

Rare card would be anything that I have and Kevin Andrews would want. LOL

[MVSNYC]

gotta love Goodwin's lot titles these days... ;)


Lot #16: “Ultra Rare For The Grade” T206 Willie Keeler “Portrait” Sovereign Cigarettes (PSA 8) – “1 of 1 and Highest Graded Sovereign Cigarettes; Only 1 Graded Higher for ALL Advertisement Backs”!


gotta hand it to Bill tho, he gets great cards.

[E93]

I know that an objective scale is what people are shooting for here, but how does one factor in relative scarcity?

For example, a T206 O'Hara/St. Louis is a rarity for T206 collectors with roughly 200-400 known. A collector of any number of other sets would laugh at calling that rare. But demand makes it tougher.

No answers here. Just complicating the question.
JimB

[Anthony S.]

If I'm selling the card: One of 45,000

If I'm buying the card: One of 10

[4815162342]

I think something that is truly rare is difficult-to-impossible to find regardless of popularity or demand.

[Touch'EmAll]

Just picked up this 1926-29 P.C. Back, Rogers Hornsby, St. Louis Blank Back in SGC 60.

Where does this rank in the overall rarity department?

Not sure about SGC, but PSA lists Total Population of 4 with the highest grade a "4". All 3 variations together combine for total PSA population of 23 with only 8 cards grading "5" or "6".

The price was well under $500. - just seems too cheap for such a card - I will buy this kind of stuff all day long and be very happy.

[frankbmd]

My cards aren't rare, but some are well done.

[bbsports]

I'm looking at a lot of these threads on using the word rarity & I'm glad to see a lot of honest answers. It is the most overrated word when describing a particular card for sale. Yes there are rare cards out there, but not as many as sellers think there are. Over the last couple years sellers especially use this word in their titles & descriptions in their cards. Some sellers use rarity as an endorsment to get a high price for their cards. There are cards out there of course that are much tougher to get than others, but that necessarily doesn't mean there rare.

[Bosox Blair]

I know that an objective scale is what people are shooting for here, but how does one factor in relative scarcity?

For example, a T206 O'Hara/St. Louis is a rarity for T206 collectors with roughly 200-400 known. A collector of any number of other sets would laugh at calling that rare. But demand makes it tougher.

No answers here. Just complicating the question.
JimB

Exactly.

As I review the definitions proposed I think to myself: these must be T206 guys. The notion that items with between 200 and 1000 existing are on any level tough or difficult is foreign to me.

My own view is that "rarity/scarcity" should be measured by known examples, without regard to demand (like the coin system). Rarity is not tied to demand. A one-of-a-kind item is still rare, even if nobody wants it.

Just because a lot of people want something, that does not make it rare...just popular. That is an issue of supply crossed with demand.

Cheers,
Blair