OAKS Philly Show this weekend....FREE admission FRI & SUNDAY [Archive]

tedzan

11-07-2011, 01:09 PM

Top Vintage Dealers in the hobby will be at this show with some great stuff this weekend......

Friday.......Nov 11th.......2 PM - 8 PM

Sat..........Nov 12th.......9 AM - 5 PM

Sunday.....Nov 13th.....10 AM - 4 PM

Here is the CSA website for detailed info......

http://www.csashows.com/

Hope to see you there....you'll find it worth the trip.

TED Z

Leon

11-07-2011, 01:14 PM

I look forward to this show again and will be set up for Brockelman & Luckey Auctions, taking consignments for our next auction, as well as will have some goodies for sale. Hope everyone stops by and says hi.....always fun to chat about our great hobby.

bbcard1

11-07-2011, 01:19 PM

just made my hotel resos...looking forward to a big trade with Ted Zan...or a series of small trades...or just trading stories...

bcbgcbrcb

11-07-2011, 01:51 PM

Thought I would be going but my wife made reservations for the weekend at Atlantic City instead. Not bad for a second choice though........

MooseWithFleas

11-07-2011, 05:06 PM

Haven't been to this show in 4-5 years. Think I will stop by though.

Gradedcardman

11-07-2011, 06:13 PM

Look forward to attending this show for the first time...T206 difficult backs...Where are you hiding !!

Dave1943

11-07-2011, 06:15 PM

Ted,

Look forward to visiting with you and Ken Cohen on Friday. Meeting Jim Rivera would be a plus.

Regards,

Dave

judsonhamlin

11-07-2011, 06:36 PM

I'll be there Friday as well - looking forward to it.

glynparson

11-08-2011, 01:02 PM

Hope to make it up friday or sunday. i have not been to a show in a real long time. to busy with work and family. Phil I'll be in AC saturday maybe I'll see you around.

bigred1

11-09-2011, 06:23 AM

Should be there at least Saturday

tedzan

11-09-2011, 05:32 PM

just made my hotel resos...looking forward to a big trade with Ted Zan...or a series of small trades...or just trading stories...

Hey Todd

We'll probably do all three trades :)

See you there on Friday.

Regards,

TED Z

cfc1909

11-09-2011, 05:49 PM

Dave

I will be at the show with my son on Saturday & Sunday.

Clark7781

11-09-2011, 06:31 PM

I will be there on Saturday morning continuing the hunt for additions to the Monster, and buying some new stuff that the fat man in the red suit will bring a little boy on December 25 :D

e107collector

11-09-2011, 07:02 PM

I will be there on Friday. Hope to see some fellow Net54 members.

Tony

kcohen

11-10-2011, 08:50 AM

Looking forward to meeting up with fellow Net54ers and maybe hoisting a few after hours.

Ted - In response to an earlier question, I expect I won't be across from you like last time as I did not get a corner booth. I procrastinated and signed up late so I don't know where I'll be.

See you there.

tedzan

11-10-2011, 11:31 AM

My understanding is that we are setting up in the "B" section of the Oaks Expo Center

Therefore, it's anyone's guess where our booths will be with respect to the April Show.

Anyway, see you there good buddy.

TED Z

thestump08

11-10-2011, 12:08 PM

Thinking about going as well. Hope it will be a great show!

tedzan

11-10-2011, 01:58 PM

YES....you read correctly

Saturday's admission is $5.--

Weather forecast for the Oaks area this weekend is blue skies.

Friday.......Nov 11th.......2 PM - 8 PM

Sat..........Nov 12th.......9 AM - 5 PM

Sunday.....Nov 13th.....10 AM - 4 PM

Here is the CSA website for detailed info......

http://www.csashows.com/

See me at.... Booth # 718 ....I'll have my usual eclectic stuff, from 1888 Goodwin Champions to 1950's Bowman's & Topps......

Including 300+ T206's

TED Z

MooseWithFleas

11-10-2011, 07:01 PM

I work 10 minutes from the show, so I will pop over right after work :)

Michael Peich

11-10-2011, 07:17 PM

Ted--Did you get my email? Hope so.
I look forward to seeing everyone from Net 54 who is there on Friday.
Cheers, Mike

tedzan

11-10-2011, 07:39 PM

Did not receive your email....try again.

Regards,

TED Z

bbcard1

11-10-2011, 08:16 PM

I was talking to marco and he said they had decided to go with free admission Sunday...good deal for the locals.

MooseWithFleas

11-10-2011, 08:28 PM

Gonna have to go in with a set amount of money :D. Looking to add to my 74-75 OPC Hockey set, a Monster, and a Copes golfer.

Buythatcard

11-11-2011, 05:47 AM

Definitely will be there tonight and tomorrow. Never miss a show in the Philly area.

Hope to pick up some vintage lots to resell.

Always looking to make new contacts.

e107collector

11-12-2011, 10:18 AM

I was planning on going to the show yesterday, but as luck would have it, I haven't been feeling well the last few days.

Any updates from the Show? Worthwhile? Any pickups?

Tony

bbcard1

11-12-2011, 10:30 AM

I had a great time, but ended up leaving early. I sold my tables to another dealer (not as big of a deal as it would sound as I was just trying to clean out a collection).

Ted Z and I made a big trade that worked out well for both of us.

bbcard1

11-12-2011, 03:46 PM

How were the crowds today? Did Jimmy Rollins bring them in?

x2drich2000

11-12-2011, 06:05 PM

I was there until almost noon today and I would say that attendance was very light. It also felt like there were a number of empty dealer spaces. I thought the overall prewar material was great, definitely better than the last Valley Forge Show. That said, I only picked up one prewar card for my collection thanks to Ken Cohen.

http://www.net54baseball.com/picture.php?albumid=209&pictureid=5116

DJ

bigred1

11-12-2011, 07:13 PM

I would say attendance was light, but better than what I heard Friday was. Hopefully free admission will help out tomorrow, I only picked a 1933 Goudey Foxx#154, made it worth it for me. Lot less tables than April, heard alot of dealer griping.

bbcard1

11-12-2011, 07:29 PM

FWIW, I can absolutely attest that Marco spent good $ promoting this show and he put a lot of effort into it.

cfc1909

11-13-2011, 11:37 AM

just back from the show -lot of fun-nice meeting David Adkins and Adam G.

It was a nice hang out with the tables set up in a box Mckee had 4 tables set up McDaniel had 3 more and Luckey had 3 more all set up in a box with plenty of room in the middle for everyone to visit and hang out. I think Ken Cohen had a set up in there too.

Adam W. -Boxingcard-John McDaniel has a really cool picture for you to check out-an original poster of Frazier and Ali fight.

David-I really enjoyed checking out the Doc Adkins collection

skelly

11-13-2011, 12:32 PM

I thought that the show itself was quite good. A nice mix of just about everything. If you wanted some high end older stuff it was there. If you needed commons from the 1970's for a quarter or so to complete sets that was also an option. I just can't get over how light the attendance seemed to me, and I was there for a huge chunk of time on Friday while my wife went to King of Prussia. I remember going to the Reading show about 4 years ago( I guess that's know as Ft. Washington ) and there was some juice to it. This show just seemed so dead, even a few dealers were walking around, didn't even really bother to man their tables. I hope I'm wrong, but I just can't see shows lasting other than the National. A few years ago I felt like there was still that core of people that would only buy in person, not on ebay, etc... Nowadays it seems like the only stuff that sells at shows is oddball material that is hard to find or commons out of the dime/quarter boxes. Thoughts? I'd be curious to hear a dealers point of view on this.

ValKehl

11-13-2011, 01:22 PM

I drove up to Oaks and back yesterday from Virginia, stopping en route to pick up another collector in Maryland on the way - left home at 5:30 a.m. and got back home at 11:00 p.m. I keep thinking I'm getting to old to do this, but I guess I'm too addicted!

I greatly enjoyed chatting with Ken C., Leon L., John M., Dan M., Jim R., and Ted. Z. (hope I didn't forget anyone) and seeing all their fabulous cards at their tables. I made a comment to a guy walking the aisles wearing a VATECH Hokies sweatshirt (I'm an UVA Wahoo) - turned out he is Net54er Adam L., and we ended up doing a trade!

I agree with most of skelly's comments above re this show. There were numerous empty tables. I heard several comments about their being dealers who weren't there on Saturday because the promoter of a competing local show threatened to exclude them from his shows. I believe I learned in school way back when that monopolies are a no-no in our free enterprise system. Frankly and unfortunately, I think there are currently too many shows in the Philly area for them all to thrive in this day and age.
Val

basesareempty

11-13-2011, 07:44 PM

I think the problem with this show was that the autograph lineup was not very strong and didn't have any top end signers to draw in the large crowd.

danmckee

11-13-2011, 07:51 PM

Actually an autograph line up shouldn't matter, i want card collectors attending not autograph collectors. I think there is a market for the one on one face to face deal arena amongst vintage card collectors, I just don't have the answer.

Reading was an awesome show but was ruined when David Hunt took over.

I like David but he single handedly ruined the vintage card show in Philly.

Oaks show this weekend was the worst attended show I have ever seen. It was embarrassing. Luckily I did well with a few big sales but I think total attendance actually through the door was about 17 for the weekend.

Very sad to see a tradition fail.

It was great to see friends like: Val, Ken, Ted Z, Jim R. Wonka, Leon, Pete G., Bagger (Dave S.) Chandy, Phil S., Scruffy, Alberry Moore (thanks for the Washington Times trade), Mickey Foxwell, Larry Dean, Scott at SGC, Al Rosen, Dave Czuba, and many more!

MooseWithFleas

11-13-2011, 07:55 PM

Had a good time, enjoyed the free admission :). Sad to see nearly 50% of the dealers packed up by 1-2 o'clock on Sunday.

danmckee

11-13-2011, 08:00 PM

1 or 2 O'Clock on Sunday?? I am surprised they stayed after Saturday. Imagine being there for 2 or 3 days and only seeing 12 customers walk by and only 4 of them stopping at your table, it was painful..

I only came back Sunday to see Leon who was in from out of town, otherwise I was DTFR on Saturday night.

it was a sad situation

MooseWithFleas

11-13-2011, 08:27 PM

It's to be expected with EBay. You see so many people checking prices on their smart phones and just finding shows to not be worth it with the marked-up prices even though most dealers are willing to be reasonable. Card shows have simply turned into a venue for the old school collectors to swap stories.

basesareempty

11-14-2011, 07:32 AM

Dan- There are a lot of collectors who collect autos and vintage cards such as myself. If the auto lineup was better it may have motivated them to come to the show and then spend money with card dealers. I also agree with another poster that if show dealers insist on pricing their stuff at 2 or 3 times Ebay prices then card shows will go the way of the dinosaur.I also cannot stand dealers that do not put prices on their stuff. I am not going there to overpay and frankly I do not want to go back and forth with dealers haggling over price. Dealers that have $100 cards marked for $200 or more I just walk by because I feel that they will not come down to the level I want to pay. Now if they had the same item priced at $125 and when asked for their "best price" they give the obligatory 10-15% discount now we are in the ballpark.

kcohen

11-14-2011, 08:09 AM

I always label my stuff with prices under what I am willing to take and expect to get. I always explain that the sticker is designed to start the conversation. Frankly, I'd love to put a fixed price on the cards but everyone wants to play the "do you have any room"? game. It's obviously the established rules of the game. I don't make them. I just play by them.

Leon

11-14-2011, 08:09 AM

Now if they had the same item priced at $125 and when asked for their "best price" they give the obligatory 10-15% discount now we are in the ballpark.

I did quite well with that strategy......

wonkaticket

11-14-2011, 08:12 AM

Moose to a point I agree with you on eBay, but card shows are not dead just run in a very poor manner. Also you don’t have half of the inventory in pre-war on eBay. Just our little circle between Dan, Leon, Jim R and myself had more Pre-War goods than I could find on eBay in a 6 month period.

Then toss in Levi, Ken C, Willam C, Ted Z, Bagger, Joe T and you have quite a selection to choose from. Then there’s also the visuals to boot, you will get to hold and see stuff you never could afford or own etc. toss in the story swaps and getting to know folks beyond a screen name and I think shows still have a future independent of eBay.

John

dog*dirt

11-14-2011, 08:41 AM

I wish that I had more time to spend at the show. I thought there was a number of great cards, photos and oddball stuff. I managed to pick up a few cards I had been searching for which was nice. Enjoyed meeting and talking to Leon and John.

As far as the pricing at the show it was just like any other show to me, if you have a fair price I would much rather buy from a dealer at a show in hopes that it would keep card shows alive and well. However, most of us on here are aware of what prices are reasonable, so who in their right mind is going to pay $300 for a card that they can get for $150 here or on ebay? This is not just a comment on the Oaks show but a general statement on most card shows I go to.

I thank all you guys who set up at the show

Andrew

Dave1943

11-14-2011, 09:00 AM

Leon

11-14-2011, 09:10 AM

Got to meet Jim Rivera and John McDaniel, and visit with Bagger, Ken C, Leon, Ted Z, and Dan M. I was fortunate enough to gather several nice MLers for my T206 set at what I considered good prices.

I do not have the experience or knowledge of any of the above mentioned persons; but I truely hope someone will find a way to keeps shows in or near the area. I can see and do not disagree with Dan's point from a dealer's perspective. It is a 300+ mile trip for me as a fairly new collector, but I find the experience well worth my time and travel - I reside in an area where 1980 is considered vintage.

Respectfully,

Dave

Hey Dave,
I had only mentioned guys I was set up with before but it was certainly nice speaking with you again too, as well as Andrew, Mike and a few others I know I am forgetting. I agree with you too. If I could drive for a hundred or so miles to a decent show, as a collector or even a dealer, I would do it in a heartbeat. My very first post today was more about having to spend 1k+ to attend a show as a business and not having any traffic. Our board here is fine but there is no substitute for hootin' and hollerin' in person. Thanks for the shirt sale too!! take care

basesareempty

11-14-2011, 09:20 AM

I did quite well with that strategy......

Leon- That is why you had a relatively decent show in comparison to others who are complaining. As a dealer you cannot fall in love with this stuff. You buy it, put a reasonable mark-up on it, sell it and move on. The other option is to price stuff too high and then you can cart it from show to show and have a traveling museum. The first option seems like the better business model.

kcohen

11-14-2011, 09:25 AM

Hey Dave. Great seeing you again, as always. I guess the bottom line regarding
cards shows is that it's one of the last places, if not the last, where we old guys can get our freak on. :D

Hankphenom

11-14-2011, 09:43 AM

How do all the overpriced dealers stay in business? Are there that many "greater fools" out there that keep them going and make their seemingly untenable business model work? Their deep-pocket customers go to shows but can't be bothered checking eBay or auctions or price guides? Really? You're telling me there's enough of these "fools" around to make it worthwhile for the dealers to keep doing show after show? Really? I hate dragging the same inventory around for more than a few shows. I will lower the price or blow things out in the little auctions rather than have to look at them for more than three or four shows, unless it's such a great piece that I know it's just a matter of time before the right collector comes along to will pay my price. Some dealers seem to feel that way about everything in their booth. How do they do it? It seems to me they're the ones killing shows. In the good old days, you could go to shows and come back with a bunch of stuff and feel good about what you paid for it. Now dealers seem scared to death that they might have given somebody a good deal. God forbid. Sorry to miss the show--I signed up but events precluded. And from what Dan said, I guess there'll never be another one. Oaks will forever be known as the show that flushed Leon and John M. and other elusive hobby legends out from their man-caves. Fun while it lasted.
Hank Thomas

wonkaticket

11-14-2011, 09:51 AM

Hank sitting and talking with you was one of the best things that ever came out of me rolling to these shows.

Cheers,

John

kcohen

11-14-2011, 10:07 AM

Hey Hank. Isn't the "greater fool" what the hobby has been built on for the last 30 years or so?

Hankphenom

11-14-2011, 10:14 AM

Leon

11-14-2011, 10:34 AM

Same here, John, hope we can continue our conversation somewhere down the road. Baltimore, maybe? Dan, Ken, myself, and others will carry on in Chantilly, perhaps we can entice other vintage nuts to make that their regular show fix and help turn it into the must-go show Ft. Washington used to be. Sorry about your unfortunate situation, Leon. Having done his shows for 15 years, I have nothing but good things to say about Marco and Angie and their staff, so many favors they've done me, not once any kind of uncooperative attitude. Can't imagine what went wrong, but I hate to hear about it.
Hank

Hi Hank
Well, when I checked in he said I was right next to the door. I said great, until I got to the door and it was all closed off due to drapes. Why do you think John and Dan recommended (thank God) that I move in with them? Maybe it was a mistake. Marco is human like the rest of us. Like I say, this isn't personal at all. I still like him and he has always been super nice to me. Maybe I should have said something to him so it's sort of my fault. But once again, after traveling from Big D and taking a weekend out of my life, I was pretty discouraged where he put me to set up. Mr.Mint, Memory Lane, Baggers and others were all right at the very front and everyone was directed towards them, via the curtain partitions, as you walked in the front. It's not like I asked for the worst spot in the whole place where there were NO other auction houses :).

Tony Gordon

11-14-2011, 10:40 AM

I'm sorry to hear this show was so poorly attended. There was definitely an impressive dealer line-up.

I disagree with the folks writing the obituary for card shows. Shows are NOT dead. I attend shows in the Midwest every single weekend. I was set up at the Gonzaga show yesterday in Milwaukee where at least 250 people came through the door and am very pleased with my sales. The previous weekend I was set up at the Two Hearts show in St. Louis where at least 300 people came through the door. These are one-day shows.

In respect to the Oaks show, I've noticed over the past 10 years or so that new shows NEVER do well. It doesn't matter who is set up or who is signing, new shows seem to always bomb. The days where customers will attend any show listed in Beckett is long gone. As several people have mentioned, card shows are much more social today than they used to be. As a result, customers will generally attend the established shows where they have known the dealers and other customers for years. I've also observed that attendance always goes down during football season. Regardless, I do believe there is room for new shows but it takes a lot of patience from dealers and promoters to have some success.

In the meantime, there are plenty of great shows out there. I read about many of them regularly on this board. Sounds like the Shriner's show in Boston is a great show. I'd like to attend that one sometime. I'm looking forward to the Sun-Times show in Rosemont, IL, this weekend. Over Thanksgiving weekend I'm going to attend two shows, one, a terrific show in Orland Park, IL, then back up to Milwaukee for the Serb Hall show. There are terrific shows every weekend in Illinois, Wisconsin, Missouri and Ohio that I regularly attend. Shows aren't going away any time soon.

Runscott

11-14-2011, 10:48 AM

yet more wasted keystrokes

Hankphenom

11-14-2011, 11:23 AM

Hi Hank
Well, when I checked in he said I was right next to the door. I said great, until I got to the door and it was all closed off due to drapes. Why do you think John and Dan recommended (thank God) that I move in with them? Maybe it was a mistake. Marco is human like the rest of us. Like I say, this isn't personal at all. I still like him and he has always been super nice to me. Maybe I should have said something to him so it's sort of my fault. But once again, after traveling from Big D and taking a weekend out of my life, I was pretty discouraged where he put me to set up. Mr.Mint, Memory Lane, Baggers and others were all right at the very front and everyone was directed towards them, via the curtain partitions, as you walked in the front. It's not like I asked for the worst spot in the whole place where there were NO other auction houses :).

I wish you had said something to Marco, I'm sure he would have done something to make you OK with your situation. You probably didn't want to seem like a complainer, but to Marco it would just have been yet another detail to attend to, and from my experience I know he would have made it right. Quoting General Buck Turgeson, "You can't condemn the whole program because of one little slipup!"

tedzan

11-14-2011, 12:31 PM

1st......contrary to some rumors, Marco said the next Oaks Show is scheduled for the last weekend of April 2012.

Like Dan M, I had a very good show. In fact it exceeded any one of the five Valley Forge shows that I had set-up at in 2009 and 2010.

For example....many of you are familiar with my T206 "junk box" (priced at $20/card, or 6 cards for $100). I usually start with 50 cards.
This weekend I re-loaded it several times (142 cards were sold from this box).

Here's a flavor of some of the cards I sold....T206 Matty, several T201 and T202 (stars & commons), 1941 Play Ball's, some T209's, and
a bunch of 1948 - 1952 Bowman's.

And, except for one graded T201 and one graded T202, the rest were all RAW......I am sure that makes Dan M :)

Todd (bbcard1) and I had a great trade in which I helped Todd with 53 - T206's for his set. I think he needs only 50 more to complete it.

But, I can't say enough for the great conversations I had with Dan McKee, Levi Bleam & Jim, Leon Luckey, Ken Cohen, Mike Peich, Alan
Rosen, Dave Czuba, Bob Steinberg, Val Kehl, William Chappell, John Hom, Peter Putman, Dave Hayward, Peggy and Adam Lawrence, and
Andy (who I started him on an N162 set).

Also, John (Wonkaticket) who made my day on Sunday by spending some nice $$$$ on T-cards, while we were exchanging stories about
Greek restaurants here in Pennsylvania.

The way I see it....Auctions houses, nor Ebay....will never really replace the human interaction enjoyed by many of us at these shows.

T-Rex TED

MooseWithFleas

11-14-2011, 04:15 PM

A lot of good insight in these posts (as usual :))

I agree with the human interaction input, but it seems like the shows are turning from a show for people to get cards and dealers to make money into a show for dealers and people to get together and swap stories and share collections. Personally, I like the latter more, but from a business standpoint, the former is obviously preferred.

Many dealers are willing to be reasonable, the others either go out of business or are located in an area with a lot of marks.

tedzan

11-15-2011, 04:45 PM

Doug

Sorry, I forgot to mention you in my earlier post here. I enjoyed "Talking T206's" with you on Friday.

And, glad to add Matty and Dolly Stark to one of your T206 sets.

Best regards ole friend.

TED Z

Jaybird

11-15-2011, 06:22 PM

seems to me from my recent experience at a local show out here in Los Angeles and from the posts here that these shows might do better if they eliminated Sunday altogether. Just do a Friday/Saturday thing or a one day show and you might concentrate the attendance and minimize the exposure (time commitment).

I enjoy all aspects of attending and setting up at a show but everyone's lives are busy and devoting an entire weekend when most of the sales could concentrated in a small window doesn't make too much sense.

Not trying to revamp the whole system but maybe these modern times call for shorter show lengths. Except for the National, though I'm sure everyone could do without Sunday at that one as well.

Hankphenom

11-15-2011, 07:06 PM

Sundays have gotten to be such a drag (if they ever weren't), what a blessing it would be for that unhappy tradition to disappear. Friday setup, then go til 8 or 9, 10 to 4 on Saturday, then back home. Saving a day and a hotel night, you might even attract more part-time dealers to the hobby if it was less of a slog.

yanks4

11-15-2011, 07:34 PM

Really........... Who needs Sunday:confused:

Gradedcardman

11-15-2011, 07:56 PM

The show was good. Checking out stuff from the big 3 (John, Jim and Leon) was great. I had my 9 year old and he found some things to look at as well. I did not expect to buy much if anything but wanted to see what the draw was for the Oaks. I saw it and will be back. Everything was there to see. Was it priced well ?? Supply and demand, we make the market.