View Full Version : Sam Crawford Spalding Bat on ebay
MGHPro
04-16-2011, 06:36 PM
Am I missing something here?
http://cgi.ebay.com/1909-25-Sam-Crawford-Professional-Model-PSA-DNA-GU6-Bat-/270736556778?pt=Vintage_Sports_Memorabilia&hash=item3f092802ea#ht_3095wt_99
Matt Hart
Exhibitman
04-17-2011, 06:48 AM
Hey, its "been professionally Authenticated by PSA/DNA the best in the bussiness"; if the best in the bussiness [sic] says it's good what more can there be to say about it?
My rule: never trust a seller with typos in critical parts of a listing.
mjkm90
04-17-2011, 09:24 AM
That is laughable:D
margoaepi
04-17-2011, 04:20 PM
I am not a bat collector and don't pretend to be, but can someone tell me why this is laughable? I'm not trying to be a smart a$$, just trying to figure out what makes this so obviously bad . . . and what is the difference between this bat and the one in SCP current auction?
Thanks.
mjkm90
04-17-2011, 04:45 PM
This piece is a store model bat Josh. It's bat nerd humor.
margoaepi
04-17-2011, 04:48 PM
Thanks Mike. So the long and short of it is psa screwed up?
EDITED: Sorry, I took a look on PSA and its pretty clear that this was authenticated as a store model. Thanks fellas!
margoaepi
04-17-2011, 04:49 PM
. . . and is it clear that the one in the SCP auction is a game used?
MGHPro
04-17-2011, 07:54 PM
heres a link to scp.
http://scpauctions.com/LotDetail.aspx?lotid=14772&searchby=0&searchvalue=None&page=0&sortby=0&displayby=2&lotsperpage=100&category=15&seo=SAM-CRAWFORD-PROFESSIONAL-MODEL-GAME-USED-BAT-(PSA%2fDNA-GU6)
I'd love for John or Vince to chime in on this one. The bat is a store model. No provenance? Is every spalding bat now going to be pro model?
There was a store model Harry Davis with a psa cert, listing it as a pro model, in the next Huggins sale. It's not coming up in the search results right now, so I wonder if it was pulled.
Matt
The bat on eBay has been authenticated as a retail bat, no?
murphusa
04-17-2011, 08:44 PM
in all my years of collecting baseball bats, only the Spalding Hand Turned Models were considered as Pro Model Game bats. All Autographed models were alway considered as a store model bat. If due to some circumstance that a player used a store model bat in a professional game happened so it may be, but for a group of Sam Crawford model to be graded as such is in my opinion strange in deed
Jim Murphy
Philadelphia Bat Company
MGHPro
04-18-2011, 04:18 AM
While the bat does say it was manufactured for professional/retail use, the fact that it is even referred to as a pro model, without any provenance is wrong.
I think the LOA is basically just saying that that the club bought some retail bats for player use, the bats in question exhibit use, but said use cannot be determined to be from Crawford.
murphusa
04-18-2011, 07:18 AM
Wording it as such it gives the impression that it is a professional modal bat used by Crawford. So what happens here is an experienced bat collector will only bid on the bat up to what the bat is really worth, but a novice may think that he or she is getting a great deal on a Crawford game used bat and bid higher.
The fact that the seller references a sale of a Crawford bat at $50,000 or whatever it was tells you he is trying to entice the buyer to spend more than what it is worth
So if the certificate said "Store Model Bat" then the buyer would be so warned
MGHPro
04-18-2011, 08:50 AM
I completely agree with the Murph..
Matt
Not sure if the seller was contacted, but the listing was revised and a picture of the LOA was possibly added .... Taube called it an Autograph bat from the get go.
How a seller markets a bat is out of Taube and Malta's hands.
murphusa
04-19-2011, 08:03 AM
Hey Matt
Can you explain the differences between this bat and the Huggins bat you are offering
margoaepi
04-19-2011, 08:06 AM
I'm sorry if I missed it, but is the feeling that the Crawford bat that SCP is offering is of similar ilk to the ebay bat?
I'm sorry if I missed it, but is the feeling that the Crawford bat that SCP is offering is of similar ilk to the ebay bat?
I would guess so, but the LOA is not visible in the SCP auction. The one on eBay has a letter stating it is an autograph model, which is correct. Perhaps the seller was trying to sell it as a player model w/o showing the LOA?
Not sure what the uproar was all about.
edited to add - SCP is also an autograph model, which states that in the title. Taube and Malta do not need to explain anything
MGHPro
04-19-2011, 01:49 PM
Hey Matt
Can you explain the differences between this bat and the Huggins bat you are offering
Sure,
mine DOES NOT have the Spalding mark on either end and is hand turned.
Not saying other spaldings aren't hand turned because most are, but they have the spalding mark. Ones lacking the spalding mark, have always been considered pro models by most.
MGHPro
04-19-2011, 01:54 PM
I would guess so, but the LOA is not visible in the SCP auction. The one on eBay has a letter stating it is an autograph model, which is correct. Perhaps the seller was trying to sell it as a player model w/o showing the LOA?
Not sure what the uproar was all about.
edited to add - SCP is also an autograph model, which states that in the title. Taube and Malta do not need to explain anything
Neal.. glad you feel that way but I disagree. So do the several lurkers that emailed and called me. An explanation on how a 35 inch Crawford with spalding marks on the end would be great. I don't really care to hear that every spalding bat was marked with that. Then explain the Cobbs, Keelers, Evers, Stones and so on, that appear without spalding on the knob.
The autograph model isn't even whats being questioned, its the PRO MODEL wording.
Matt
MGHPro
04-19-2011, 01:59 PM
In regards to the Eddie Maier Crawford bat. Besides the fact that it came from an early game used bat collector, is there any proof that the bat was used by Crawford and given to Maier? Its great that it was pictured with Maier in 1916, but how do we know Maier didn't have the bat and just got it signed? It is not inscribed Game used.
I have a game used bat collection, but does that mean every bat I have is a gamer.. NOPE.
murphusa
04-19-2011, 02:23 PM
I would guess so, but the LOA is not visible in the SCP auction. The one on eBay has a letter stating it is an autograph model, which is correct. Perhaps the seller was trying to sell it as a player model w/o showing the LOA?
Not sure what the uproar was all about.
edited to add - SCP is also an autograph model, which states that in the title. Taube and Malta do not need to explain anything
No uproad at all, what Matt was asking was, "did I miss something"
What you are missing is that unlike autpgraph dealer who at time will not tell you what is right or wrong with an autograph, most bat collectors and dealers will show you and educate you on why a bat is game used, game bat, store bat, etc.
While a bat may have similer chacteristic to a game used bat there may be only one or two small details that will give you the full story.
I think that was what Matt was asking
Perhaps uproar was a poor choice of words .... but I read the posts as the Letter of Opinion is misleading. I have never seen an LOA with "Store Model Bat" as the header, so that is where I was confused.
Matt, I agree that the only "proof" that the bat was used by Crawford is from word of mouth - in this case, from the mouth of one of the earliest known bat collectors. But that does not cut it, and that is what Taube stated in his letter of opinion - he could not confirm that it was used by Crawford.
Stating "autograph" for model number on the letter implies that this is a retail bat, to me at least, and although there are stories of clubs/players purchasing these bats for game use, the use of these bats in a major league game cannot be determined, and certainly not for a specific player.