Truly Rare Pre-War Cards [Archive] - Net54baseball.com Forums

Collect Equity

01-08-2011, 11:43 AM

I'm still fairly new to this board, so if my question has already been asked, please just point me to the right thread.

In reading auction magazines they claim every card to be 'rare.' But obviously not everything marked as rare would qualify. So for sake of argument, let's say that the definition of rare is a card would have a dozen or less total cards in existence.

My question is, what individual cards, sets or variations of pre-war cards would fall into the category of having 12 cards or less total in existence. To help focus the conversation, let's only focus on cards made after 1900 and only of active major league players or hall of fame player's minor league cards.

So, in everyone's opinion what cards and sets would be included in this survey?

Thanks in advance!

Brian Van Horn

01-08-2011, 12:08 PM

1911 Sporting News:

ullmandds

01-08-2011, 12:21 PM

there are probably handfuls of cards that are truly rare...but there is no real way to know for sure if 12 or less of a given card exist. you can look at pop reports til the cows come home...but noone really knows what cards are hidden in collections, attics or whatever. as a general rule I use...double the # of known specimens of a given card...and this is likely to be a more accurate guess of # of existing specimens.

milkit1

01-08-2011, 12:29 PM

theres gotta be less then 12 of this one:

30561

benchod

01-08-2011, 12:40 PM

Well you can start with the cards in the set of your avatar. I think most e107s would qualify

bcbgcbrcb

01-08-2011, 12:53 PM

1904 Allegheny cards (all belived to be 1-of-a-kind)

Abravefan11

01-08-2011, 01:15 PM

I don't think it gets much rarer than T231 Fans Cigarettes.

fkw

01-08-2011, 01:15 PM

Just from the 1910-15 Era...

every single

T208
T214
T215 Pirate
T216 VE
T217
D303 Mothers
D380
E125
E221
E222
E224
E271
E286

etc.

Collect Equity

01-08-2011, 01:21 PM

as a general rule I use...double the # of known specimens of a given card...and this is likely to be a more accurate guess of # of existing specimens.

Do you think this would apply to the t206 Wagner as well? Estimates I've heard say it has 60-70 known copies, so would you say it's closer to 120-140 in actuality?

Exhibitman

01-08-2011, 01:22 PM

Many regional cards, esp. minor league issues

http://photos.imageevent.com/exhibitman/frankleftyodoulcard/websize/1935%20Pebble%20Beach%20OquDoul%202.jpg

bijoem

01-08-2011, 02:01 PM

this one.....

http://www.internetville.com/images/albums/userpics/1916wagFront.jpg

and I would suspect many RPPCs would fit your definition of rare.

novakjr

01-08-2011, 02:30 PM

I know they're a little earlier than your time frame, but the 1893 Just So Tobacco cards are ridiculously rare. Anyways, I'm gonna have to agree with bijoem and exhibitman, RPPC and team/regional issues are pretty hard to come by. Probably not less than 12, but still extremely difficult.

Here's a website I found with some interesting cards.
http://www.cycleback.com/rarerthanhonus.html

egbeachley

01-08-2011, 02:45 PM

I think FKW just listed about 1,000 cards with less than 12 copies each.

I have about 20 cards from a single Contentnea set (non-sports) that are the only copy known.

calvindog

01-08-2011, 02:54 PM

ullmandds

01-08-2011, 03:01 PM

No...the t206 Wags is the highest profile card in the hobby...and as a result I'd guess most are known.

Bilko G

01-08-2011, 06:53 PM

How many of the Baltimore News Ruth's are out there?

cfc1909

01-08-2011, 07:01 PM

3058830589

cfc1909

01-08-2011, 07:22 PM

30590
30591

e107collector

01-08-2011, 08:05 PM

How many of the Baltimore News Ruth's are out there?

I think there are eleven 1914 Baltimore News Ruth's that exist.

Tony

philliesphan

01-08-2011, 09:13 PM

E104-III series is ridiculously rare. I think in the last decade, about five cards have been added to the checklist! What constitutes a "complete" set is not known, for all intents and purposes.

ethicsprof

01-08-2011, 09:14 PM

Jeff Lichtman's Cobb above is a beauty and a rarity.
i would add that all of the 1921 herpolsheimer's are one of a kind.
i have one---the geo. j. burns.
not a cobb, sadly, but still a beauty and a rarity.

all the best,
barry

Leon

01-08-2011, 09:34 PM

I have an unfair advantage as I have focused on rare cards for my whole collecting career (around 15 yrs)....

paul

01-09-2011, 02:29 PM

1927 Imperial Chocolates from Cuba. Only two cards are known, this one and the Speaker. I believe only one example of each is known.

Clutch-Hitter

01-09-2011, 05:54 PM

Frank's Cuban Ruth

terjung

01-09-2011, 05:56 PM

I think there are eleven 1914 Baltimore News Ruth's that exist.

Tony

I didn't think the number was quite that high. Didn't somebody lose one of them?

benchod

01-09-2011, 06:16 PM

I didn't think the number was quite that high. Didn't somebody lose one of them?

That was the buttercream (R306) Ruth that got tossed in the trash

White Borders

01-09-2011, 08:48 PM

I believe only two Charles Lindstrom cards from the 1932 US Caramel (R328) Set are known to exist.

(Scan is one I found on the Web)

Baseball Rarities

01-09-2011, 09:25 PM

I didn't think the number was quite that high. Didn't somebody lose one of them?

I think that REA accounted for ten known Baltimore News Ruth cards - plus one that a customer of theirs kept in his office drawer, but was either lost or stolen years ago.

In reference to the R306 Ruth - I think that it was Barry Halper who accidentally threw away the example that he purchased from Lew Lipset.

terjung

01-09-2011, 09:36 PM

I think that REA accounted for ten known Baltimore News Ruth cards - plus one that a customer of theirs kept in his office drawer, but was either lost or stolen years ago.

That was the story I was thinking of, but I guess lost or stolen doesn't mean "gone, never to be recovered", so the number is 10 with a possible 11th surviving. I was thinking that the story was that he had thrown it away accidentally or something like that.

Tom S.

01-09-2011, 10:07 PM

Nobody's mentioned "America's Toughest Want List" yet?

tedzan

01-10-2011, 07:16 AM

One can view the premise of "truly rare" in absolute terms (12 cards, or less). Or, another can take the view of
"supply vs. demand"....in my opinion, these two cards are truly rare, since the demand for them is very high.

Most of the 515 (of 524) subjects in the T206 set are available in the 1000's of cards. But to date, only 8 cards
of this error card of "Slow Joe" have been confirmed.

<img src="http://i529.photobucket.com/albums/dd339/tz1234zaz/at206joedoylenatl.jpg" alt="[linked image]">

And so far, only 14 cards of the red Cobb with the Ty Cobb back have been found.

<img src="http://i529.photobucket.com/albums/dd339/tz1234zaz/acobbtycobb.jpg" alt="[linked image]"><img src="http://i529.photobucket.com/albums/dd339/tz1234zaz/bcobbtycobb.jpg" alt="[linked image]">

TED Z

ls7plus

03-12-2011, 11:28 PM

The Boston Garter hall-of-famers.

Larry

ephus

03-12-2011, 11:55 PM

I would think any card in the E300 Plow's Candy set would count. Only a couple of each card in the set known to exist. As a side note it is a beautiful set.

sreader3

03-13-2011, 01:07 AM

Ted,

It's funny that the Doyle error you posted is the phony (or more accurately, altered) Polar Bear example.

You can spot it a mile away since the caption is, shall we say, "off."

For true rarity, how about the Schulte (Front View) Piedmont 350 (1 of 1)?

Scot

milkit1

03-13-2011, 07:52 AM

this might be a 1 of 1

34617

34618

vargha

03-13-2011, 07:57 AM

R304 Al Demaree Die-Cuts . . . The complete checklist may never be known.

milkit1

03-13-2011, 07:58 AM

another possible 1 of 1

34619

jimivintage

03-13-2011, 08:58 AM

Definitely of this one, and all Lections. Perhaps less than six of each that do not have holes in them?

kcohen

03-13-2011, 09:36 AM

In the T222 thread it was noted that the John Henry is quite rare. Apparently this 1921 Holsum Bread issue of the same player has recently surfaced and is I suppose the only one known. It's not listed in the 2010 SCD catalog.

This guy got no love.

Leon

03-13-2011, 10:07 AM

AS previously stated I think I have an unfair advantage. Kind of like Jeff L's advantage in arguing. When you do something all of the time it's not that difficult. :) Still don't know what this one is? (not the quarter, smart guy, the card)

tbob

03-13-2011, 11:24 AM

1911 Zeenut Bohen. I've never even seen a scan of a complete one.

Orions father

03-13-2011, 11:39 AM

Let me throw W501's into the mix. There are 120 cards in the set and combined PSA and SGC have only graded 177 examples. I dont ever see raw ones except beaters. I may be missing something so any other thoughts are appreciated. Has anyone ever figured out for sure how these were distributed? Newspaper is what I have always assumed.

jimivintage

03-13-2011, 11:47 AM

Jaybird

03-13-2011, 12:11 PM

Leon

03-13-2011, 12:20 PM

Hey Leon,

Great card.

What's the logo in bottom right corner of the card? I can't make it out by the scan.

By the way, my next dog is going to be named Ellsworth Ferguson. :)

This thread is quickly making me want to be a type collector.

Without digging through my collection I believe the little logo is a "Union Made" insignia.....or it could just be a copyright....not positive, off hand...

scotty21690

03-13-2011, 02:13 PM

Here is a PSA label of an extremely rare card that I so happen to own...

http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w129/scotty21690/PC/psasub1-2.jpg

Sadly I do not own the card. Instead:

http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w129/scotty21690/PC/Red%20Sox%20Vintage%20PC%20NFT/psasub1.jpg

:::sigh:::

tedzan

03-13-2011, 03:34 PM

How many of these Jimmy Foxx cards have any of you seen ?

<img src="http://i603.photobucket.com/albums/tt113/zanted86/jimmyfoxxsilverdollar.jpg" alt="[linked image]">

TED Z

sb1

03-13-2011, 04:40 PM

One of very few.

<img src=http://p1.sellebrity.com/upload/sb1/3476107-DSC00507.JPG width=600 height=450 border=0>

scotty21690

03-13-2011, 05:04 PM

One of very few.

<img src=http://p1.sellebrity.com/upload/sb1/3476107-DSC00507.JPG width=600 height=450 border=0>

Wow, those are incredible!!

Do you need my PSA slab/label?? ;)

ls7plus

03-14-2011, 01:06 AM

I'm a Foxx collector, Ted, and I've never seen that one--what is it???

Larry

Leon

03-14-2011, 07:54 AM

How many of these Jimmy Foxx cards have any of you seen ?

<img src="http://i603.photobucket.com/albums/tt113/zanted86/jimmyfoxxsilverdollar.jpg" alt="[linked image]">

TED Z

Am I mistaking or didn't we find the box that the Foxx card was cut from? I thought it was some sort of game with lots of players pictures, similar to the one shown?

Wite3

03-14-2011, 08:03 AM

Leon...
About your Kon. card. I can tell you that many tickets from that era exhibit that trademark/union label.

I wonder if this is a piece of a ticket from league park?

Joshua

Leon

03-14-2011, 08:39 AM

Leon...
About your Kon. card. I can tell you that many tickets from that era exhibit that trademark/union label.

I wonder if this is a piece of a ticket from league park?

Joshua

Hi Joshua
I have seen a lot of tickets/schedules used as cards. This one doesn't exhibit the characteristics (stock, edges, corners etc....) that other tickets do, besides that trademark. It certainly is possible but I don't think so. Good observation and there is certainly a chance of what you said.....

Here is a schedule used as 2 cards, or vice versa

E93

03-14-2011, 09:17 AM

Only three or four known to my knowledge. About half the Mello Mint set is not tough, and half is insanely tough.
JimB

http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/3305/e105cobbafront.jpg (http://img5.imageshack.us/i/e105cobbafront.jpg/)http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/328/e105cobbbback.jpg (http://img717.imageshack.us/i/e105cobbbback.jpg/)