Notebook Covers as Collectible Issues

[Matt]

Interested in hearing how everyone feels about collecting notebook/writing tablet covers (or even whole notebooks) as part of their collections. I've come to consider oversized paper premiums like M101-2s and also postcards as collectible issues, and I do not count newspaper articles as issues, but I'm not sure how to handle notebook covers. If you collect a specific player or team, which side of the line do notebooks/covers fall on for you and why?

Edited to add: Clearly they are collectibles - as could be a napkin with a player's photo printed on it, but what I'm interested in is do you consider them issues for the purposes of check-listing.

[Jacklitsch]

I collect them and think they easily fit the criteria as a collectible.

Each of these is a complete notebook.

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g5/jacklitsch1/Paper%20and%20Supplements/BrownNotebook.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g5/jacklitsch1/Paper%20and%20Supplements/CobbNotebook.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g5/jacklitsch1/Paper%20and%20Supplements/MattyNotebook.jpg
http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g5/jacklitsch1/Paper%20and%20Supplements/PlayBallNB.jpg

[calvindog]

Steve, those are nice. What is written in the pages of the notebooks?

[Jacklitsch]

Thanks Jeff.

The Brown and Cobb have blank pages. The Matty is full of imaginary 1911 games between what appear to be a couple of youngsters

http://i52.photobucket.com/albums/g5/jacklitsch1/Paper%20and%20Supplements/sb630.jpg

[Dustanh1]

Those are really nice.

I would count them as collectibles, and even go as for as to disagree with you about newspaper articles. While they aren't as obvious as other collectibles, I think a nice readable newspaper article about a moment in baseball history would be of great interest to a lot of collectors.

[ullmandds]

I don't dispute the "collectible" value of these oversized "collectibles!?" I love the detail in the photos...many of which are shared on many mainstream card issues. But...I personally don't like the size...for storage reasons. And newspapers are just that...newspapers...definitely a little window to an event in time...which is fantastick...but slabbing newspapers...I think not!

[timzcardz]

I think that those notebooks are spectacular!

A real step back in time, especially where some kids have recorded there own games in the one.

Thank you for sharing these.


Edit: Collectible? Absolutely!

[Ladder7]

Like the big mutha Premiums. Notebook covers are a large collectible, but nailing a production date for them frustrates me a bit. As there are very few and frequently trimmed, slab authentic only.

Though eventually it could happen. News paper articles, paper cutouts, Spalding catalog photos and Baseball Mag. covers shouldn't be slabbed. -In our lifetime at least.

A recent practice that is upsetting... BVG has slabbed and incorrectly given numerical grades to many trimmed Prems.

Some little brat wrote all over the cover, and included his name and address. I tried doing some digging but couldn't locate any family or aquaintances;
http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c327/oche16/Ephemera/notebook1.jpg

[Matt]

I tried to word the question carefully - of course they are collectible - as are newspapers. What I'm not sure about is should they be treated like "collectible issues." In my mind, usually that requires a catalog designation, or recognition that something wasn't known at the time the catalog was printed and therefore is logged as a "UNC."

To put a finer point on the question, if you would be collecting issues of a particular player, you might pick-up an attractive notebook cover of your player if you saw it for sale, but would you include them on your checklist?

[calvindog]

Surely notebook covers are collectibles; they're just differently sized and a different sort of item from what we're traditionally used to. But so is plenty of memorabilia of the day. I think Steve's notebook with period writing inside is akin to a postcard containing writing about a game just seen -- both enhancing the item.

[Matt]

Jeff - see my post above; we can probably all agree that they are collectibles. What I was trying to ask is different - Are you after all of Cobb's notebook covers as part of your Cobb collection?

[ullmandds]

I've always loved the full sized photo of cobb jumping with ball in glove. I'm guessing he just put the ball in his glove...and the photographers had him jump so they could take the photo. I also love the stadiums/background details that get cropped for the more mainstream issues!

pete

[clamendo]

We'll I spent ALOT of money to get 4 Football Notebook/Writing covers. The guy cut the spiral and they are like brand new from I believe 1939. The four FB players parallel the 1939 Ink Blotter set called "Gridiron Greats". There were 50 in the series. 16 are movie stars and the rest are generic depression era photos. I sent the football ones to Beckett for slabbing. If anyone has an interest in the others let me know - but they look pretty collectible to me.

[calvindog]

Jeff - see my post above; we can probably all agree that they are collectibles. What I was trying to ask is different - Are you after all of Cobb's notebook covers as part of your Cobb collection?

No. At some point one has to draw a line in their collecting habits...because it can become a never-ending slippery slope otherwise.

[bijoem]

I think they are very cool. But, like everything else in this hobby, its all a matter of personal taste.

For me... if they were easier to find I would look to acquire as many as possible and would enjoy the hunt. But, since I haven't seen any offered (other than mine ;)) in quite a while - I tend to lose interest in the hunt.


http://internetville.com/images/albums/userpics/1910_notebook_Cobb.jpg

http://internetville.com/images/albums/userpics/1910_notebook_evers.jpg

[docpatlv]

I think notebooks are great collectibles. If other items can be in the standard catalog (coins, posters, pins) then I don't see why notebooks shouldn't be designated. As another member said, I think the toughest issue would be dating them. I guess you could put a range, 1910-1915.

Here are some more complete notebooks...

http://i488.photobucket.com/albums/rr248/docpatadc/WagnerNotepad2.jpg http://i488.photobucket.com/albums/rr248/docpatadc/MathewsonNotepad.jpg
http://i488.photobucket.com/albums/rr248/docpatadc/CollinsNotepad.jpg

Mike

[Matt]

Great responses guys - thanks! Keep'em coming.

Doc - that Wagner is fantastic!

No. At some point one has to draw a line in their collecting habits...because it can become a never-ending slippery slope otherwise.

Jeff -
Where is the line for you? Is there a specific criterion these don't meet or is it more of a "feel" thing?

[docpatlv]

Thanks Matt,

The reasons I like them are the graphics are often very nice and also the prices compared to cards of the same era are only a fraction. The problem is finding them (especially without writing on the cover...I don't mind writing on the inside).

Mike

[calvindog]

Jeff -
Where is the line for you? Is there a specific criterion these don't meet or is it more of a "feel" thing?

I think it's a function of two things: first, yes it's a 'feel' thing. As I collect mainly baseball cards I try to stay close to that base; postcards fit that criteria, notebook covers not as much. Second, it's just a storage space issue. Notebook covers leads to x, y, z and eventually cups from Burger King featuring the 1977 Yankees. That being said, Joe D's cover looks pretty much like a T3....not much difference at all, right? Maybe if there was a more finite list of what is out there it would provide an incentive to collect them.

[bcbgcbrcb]

I really like the notebook collecting niche as it presents the opportunity to study/research items that are rarely seen as compared to the tobacco cards of the era. The size is a plus in my eyes as the player pictures are much more vivid.

[bijoem]

Jeff -
Where is the line for you? Is there a specific criterion these don't meet or is it more of a "feel" thing?


Matt,

Basically - if a collectible does well on the farm team (my collection), then that collectible has a shot of making it to the big leagues one day (Jeff's collection).

Joe

[Vintagecatcher]

Here's one of my Bresnahan 1910 notebook covers. They look great framed!





Patrick

[sayhey24]

A few more baseball tablets.

[sayhey24]

A few more.

[Matt]

sayhey - I don't recall seeing any of those styles before - any idea what year they are?

[sayhey24]

Matt,

I haven't fully researched the years for each, so I guess I have a project now (I've had them tucked away in a drawer for a long time until I saw this thread). I bought the first grouping more than thirty years ago, and have seen a handful of other examples since. The four in the last photo (Favorites of the Diamond) were purchased just about a year ago, and I too had never seen that style before. I'm obviously in the camp of people who think these make great collectibles.

[Ladder7]

Nice shot of Ruth. Shows him coming out of his closed stance.

[chiprop]

love 'em. Notebook covers are cheap compared to other cardboard, and some are very rare. Only 5 of each player from this set has ever been discovered. Picked up 4 of these beauties in REA

<a href="http://s68.photobucket.com/albums/i12/chiprop/?action=view&current=youngnotebook.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i68.photobucket.com/albums/i12/chiprop/youngnotebook.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

[jcmtiger]

I don't collect all Notebook covers, but do collect Cobb items.

Joe

[sporteq]

Hey, nice display of notebook .. IMO, i think notebooks are extremely under valued.
They don't pop-up as often. The conditions are not in great shape when they do decide
to be offered on ebay or elsewhere. I do believe they are more rare than cards, photos, etc.

have fun!
aL

[Wite3]

Here is my contribution...love this notebook cover.

<a href="http://s170.photobucket.com/albums/u266/Wite3/?action=view&current=dooin-alexandernotebook.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u266/Wite3/dooin-alexandernotebook.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

[Bob Lemke]

We used to list several of the "sets" of notebook/tablet covers in the Standard Catalog of Baseball Cards, but when space got tight (all those hundreds of new issues every year!), they were dropped from the book.

Our data is still in the data base and someday when I get access to the data base again, I plan to update the checklists and add some new types. That way they can be added to the CD "version" of the vintage section if and when that becomes reality.

[Matt]

You guys convinced me :)
I needed a Collins piece for my collection and this one has my favorite pose of his. It will do me just fine until another of his Plow's issues come up for auction.

Bob - if you have a backup of those catalog entires in digital form, I'd love a copy.

[docpatlv]

Nice one Matt, was that an e-bay pick-up? Haven't seen that Collins before. Congrats,

Mike

[dstudeba]

Truly stradling the line. All it takes is some scissors and a Notebook becomes cards...

http://www.baseballcardresource.com/img/10WUNC/10WUNC_Notebook_B.jpghttp://www.baseballcardresource.com/img/10WUNC/10WUNC_Notebook_A.jpg

[Matt]

Dan - that notebook is fascinating! As an all star team, those aren't the players I would have expected - e.g. on the AL side, a heavy dose of Boston, Philly and Detroit and no one from Cleveland (Lajoie), or St Louis (Wallace).

[brianp-beme]

Thanks for sharing the 'card' notebook. As individual cards I have seen some of the AL players before, but I don't remember ever seeing any of NL players. Great fun! Is the thickness of the notebook paper thin? The couple of cards I have had are papery thin, but it appears that the cover is perhaps cardboard...?

Brian

[dstudeba]

Thanks for the kind words guys. The cards are now being graded by SGC as 1910 W-UNC and can receive number grades. The cover is not a thick cardboard as the whole notebook is very flexible. VCP has recorded prices on all of the cards except for one so I don't think the American League is any more common than the National.

[ValKehl]

I am also a fan of these writing tablets. I hope Bob L. adds them back to the Standard Catalog! Am willing to trade the Sisler tablet for/toward a W. Johnson or Sam Rice card that I need.

[dstudeba]

The cards are now being graded by SGC as 1910 W-UNC and can receive number grades.

Just to clarify, I don't mean that I cut that notebook up, what I meant was that SGC used to not grade these, and Dan McKee even got some sent back as "counterfeit". They currently grade this issue with number grades. The notebook pictured is still intact.

[Matt]

And right on queue, Goodwin's latest has two notebooks:

"Hobbyists are quickly “tuning in” to the popularity of various notebooks portraying our National Pastime’s legendary heroes...."

[Rob D.]

And right on queue, Goodwin's latest has two notebooks:

"Hobbyists are quickly “tuning in” to the popularity of various notebooks portraying our National Pastime’s legendary heroes...."

No doubt, in part because of this thread and in part because of super-duper marketing, a bidding war will break out and these will sell for 5-10 times prices realized previously in other auctions.

But fear not, underbidders, you might get a second chance at next year's National.

[sayhey24]

Here are a few more that I picked up -- photos on left are very yellow for some reason.

Greg