View Full Version : Peculiar T213-2 Find ??
DixieBaseball
06-06-2009, 03:36 PM
Recently I won a T213 Type 2 Cy Barger on Ebay and as a collector of Tennessee cards, I knew Barger had played for Memphis, so I was jazzed up about winning this card. I received the card in the mail today and as I analyzed the card, I noticed a strip of what seems like thin paper from another T213 (I presume) with "Memphis" on it. I checked Sabr, and Barger played in 1916 for Memphis, but when I checked the Standard Catalog, I noticed they listed the card as Barger, so I checked Lipset's Encyclopedia, and it shows Barger, Pittsburgh Fed. (No mention of Memphis at all)
So my question is this... Is there a Barger, Memphis card from the Type 2 ? Also, when looking at the scan of his Jersey, what Letter is on Barger's Jersey ? Can anyone validate this card ?
Research tells us that the Type 2 set had many strange cards, with players not on the correct teams, and multi player/team cards due to the Federal League, changing teams, production over a 2-3 year period possibly...
I know the card is authentic, but my guess is the picture is in fact of Barger in a Memphis jersey, and some collector decided to cut and paste Memphis on the card by possibly taking the strip off another T213 Coupon card. I am hopeful, Coupon Type 2 collectors can shed some light on this mystery Barger card.
sgbernard
06-06-2009, 03:49 PM
The uniform looks like an R. Check out the "R" on this T209 Fullenwider below for Raleigh; could be as it's the same gothic script, but it looks a bit off, although admittedly a bit earlier than your card. Maybe Roanoke? Sure doesn't look like an "M" to me, though. Interesting provenance to the card, though. Happy digging!
Brian Weisner
06-06-2009, 04:47 PM
Hi Jeremy,
The "R" on Barger's jersey is for Rochester.....The pose is the same as his T206 card, as are most T213's.... Be well Brian
PS T213 print changes are plentiful, but pose changes are not.... The Memphis looks added to me.....
sgbernard
06-06-2009, 04:55 PM
Brian, you're right. That's what happens when you think too hard, I guess! :p
Hope all's well with you, long time. Haven't been to see a heels game in awhile. Was living abroad all last year and missed that impressive championship team. Glad Tyler could leave with a championship.
cfc1909
06-06-2009, 04:58 PM
This is as much as I can find on Barger. Nothing from a Memphis team and does leave out several years
Eros Bolivar "Cy" Barger (May 18, 1885 - September 23, 1964) was a right-handed starting pitcher and left-handed batter who played in the American League for the New York Highlanders (1906-07); in the National League with the Brooklyn teams Superbas (1910) and Dodgers (1911-12), and for the Pittsburgh Rebels (1914-15) in the Federal League
I won a Schlei batting Coupon type 2 a few days ago and he also has a Memphis caption. I can't find anything on Schlei with Memphis either
Brian Weisner
06-06-2009, 05:00 PM
Hi Seth,
I'm glad to see you made it back to the States...Have you finished the T209 set.... Be well Brian
PS The Heels were on a mission this year.... And I hope the Baseball team is too....
scooter729
06-06-2009, 05:02 PM
Collectors back in the day must have liked to stay updated with team changes on their favorite players....
This is an Old Judge of mine which must have undergone a similar change in 1890, when Ward switched from NY to Brooklyn...
http://i45.photobucket.com/albums/f81/scooter0729/ward3.jpg
sgbernard
06-06-2009, 05:06 PM
Brian:
Sure took care of ECU today, let's see what they can do!
I wasn't able to do any collecting last year, so I'm still stalled out on my T209s with three to go: Booles, Pope, and Gilmore... Slowly does it.
Scott:
When I stop hijacking the thread and pause to read it, that's a cool card for that reason. These are like homemade prototypes for the "Traded" sets that Topps started in the 1981.
edhans
06-06-2009, 05:41 PM
I saw that card on ebay and looked it up in the guides. When I couldn't find it, I concluded that it must have been altered. The comparative boldness of the fonts is another giveaway. Still a neat item, though.
rhettyeakley
06-06-2009, 06:35 PM
This is the only team he was listed for in the Coupon T213-2 set...
http://www.geocities.com/rhettmatthew_37/t213barger.JPG
Looks like a home-made team change.
-Rhett
DixieBaseball
06-07-2009, 01:00 AM
Thanks guys for the comments - I concur... It looks like one of those team changes back in the day...
Barger did play for Memphis in 1916,17 & 19 according to Sabr/BaseballReference.com
Now, since this card does not actually exist, I can't decide whether I will ask the seller to take the card back, return my money, or consider it a "neat" traded type card from the ole days like the OJ pictured...
Hmmm....
Jacklitsch
06-07-2009, 05:30 AM
While it may be a home made team change it looks pretty sophisticated to me especially the use of the same color.
Since you found he did play at Memphis I would keep the card.
I would definitely keep it. How cool is a "traded" card from the day? I like obscure stuff though...
sgbernard
06-07-2009, 09:11 AM
I would definitely keep it! The cool thing is that, like Scott's Ward, the only time someone would have cared enough to go about changing the team name is when Barger was actually playing on Memphis, and that means your card was doctored probably by its original owner who liked the taste of Coupon cigarettes. That's a neat card as far as I'm concerned.